Saints Defense maintained a Bounty Program

[DSpydr84]

Well, well, well, looks like everybody is going down, just like I said they would.

You see Tailback, Zoneblitz, bucky, dspyder, in civilized society we don't accept concepts like bounties and blood money. Normal people think this is really fucked up and unethical, so Goodell is going to send a message to everybody else that if you bring that thug shit to the the shield, he is going to kick your ass out of his league.

It was never about "good, clean, hard, hits", as you mouth breathing morons continually (and still) miss the point. It's about rouge cash-for-injury operations taking place in locker rooms, and it can't be tolerated for reasons obvious to anybody who isn't mentally retarded.

Yep, I gotta say I'm completely shocked that the NFL is doing anything about this.

For as much as I missed your point, you sure missed mine.

[ralaw]

Well, well, well, looks like everybody is going down, just like I said they would.

You see Tailback, Zoneblitz, bucky, dspyder, in civilized society we don't accept concepts like bounties and blood money. Normal people think this is really fucked up and unethical, so Goodell is going to send a message to everybody else that if you bring that thug shit to the the shield, he is going to kick your ass out of his league.

It was never about "good, clean, hard, hits", as you mouth breathing morons continually (and still) miss the point. It's about rouge cash-for-injury operations taking place in locker rooms, and it can't be tolerated for reasons obvious to anybody who isn't mentally retarded.

They're also going down because the NFL knows that once the "ROAR! I'm a football player.....BE A Man or stop playing!" guy retires he'll be trying to sue the league for liability. Much of all of these rule changes that Goodell has implemented are directly influenced by future lawsuits that players will file.

[Warner2BruceTD]

Yep, I gotta say I'm completely shocked that the NFL is doing anything about this.

For as much as I missed your point, you sure missed mine.

The idea that bounties don't change the way the players play is not only flawed, but is also irrelevant, even if you are right (which you are not).

Nobody missed your point, your point just sucked.

[DSpydr84]

The idea that bounties don't change the way the players play is not only flawed, but is also irrelevant, even if you are right (which you are not).

Nobody missed your point, your point just sucked.

So why is my name put in your previous post when I never said anything about that?

:joeybats:

[EmpireWF]

Sounds like Payton will be suspended a few games and a bunch of players on defense will, too. They'd almost have to do it on a tiered basis though or else the Saints may not have enough guys to play a game lol.

[Warner2BruceTD]

So why is my name put in your previous post when I never said anything about that?

:joeybats:

Here you go!

It is absolutely unacceptable in every single way, and a tremendously awful PR and ethical decision by the NFL to allow that to happen.

Listen, I'm not naive enough to say that the macho-attitude of the NFL is a good thing for player safety or helps the league in terms of its perception.

What I'm saying is, the way the game is played, I can see how these things would happen. If I pay a guy $50,000 to blitz off the edge and hit the QB in the back as hard as he can to knock the ball out (which is what players essentially get paid for in their contract), is that any less or more acceptable? If I teach my smaller defensive backs to dive at the knees to tackle a bigger running back, or if my teach my huge offensive lineman to throw their bodies at the knees of a linebacker to stop backside pursuit and cut them, is that any less or more acceptable? If my wide receiver is taught to come down inside and blind-side a safety who's chasing the run and crack him, is that any less or more acceptable?

I posted this video earlier, but notice all the cut blocks and bodies on the ground after this carnage. What makes this acceptable? Because nobody had "intent to injure"?


Where is the line? The issue here is that they threw the word "injure" around. But all of the acts mentioned above happen on a regular basis, and in each case, players are at risk for injury.

When does a "good technique" or a good "football play" (the worst phrase in sports) turn into a malicious attempt to hurt someone? Is it because they said it, or is it because it happened?

I think in both cases, the players on the field respond the same.

[DSpydr84]

Tailback, bucky, dspyder, answer this for me.

If there was sign in an NFL locker room that read:



Do you think that is something acceptable that the NFL should allow if the team so chooses? Forget the salary cap implications for a moment. No qualifiers like "if it was good, clean, hits...". None of that. Just, would you have a problem with it on a face value level?

Do you not see how this is mental?

It is absolutely unacceptable in every single way, and a tremendously awful PR and ethical decision by the NFL to allow that to happen.

Listen, I'm not naive enough to say that the macho-attitude of the NFL is a good thing for player safety or helps the league in terms of its perception.

What I'm saying is, the way the game is played, I can see how these things would happen. If I pay a guy $50,000 to blitz off the edge and hit the QB in the back as hard as he can to knock the ball out (which is what players essentially get paid for in their contract), is that any less or more acceptable? If I teach my smaller defensive backs to dive at the knees to tackle a bigger running back, or if my teach my huge offensive lineman to throw their bodies at the knees of a linebacker to stop backside pursuit and cut them, is that any less or more acceptable? If my wide receiver is taught to come down inside and blind-side a safety who's chasing the run and crack him, is that any less or more acceptable?

I posted this video earlier, but notice all the cut blocks and bodies on the ground after this carnage. What makes this acceptable? Because nobody had "intent to injure"?

Alabama's Mark Barron levels Vanderbilt's Jordan Rodgers 10/8/2011 - YouTube

Where is the line? The issue here is that they threw the word "injure" around. But all of the acts mentioned above happen on a regular basis, and in each case, players are at risk for injury.

When does a "good technique" or a good "football play" (the worst phrase in sports) turn into a malicious attempt to hurt someone? Is it because they said it, or is it because it happened?

I think in both cases, the players on the field respond the same.

Well, well, well, looks like everybody is going down, just like I said they would.

You see Tailback, Zoneblitz, bucky, dspyder, in civilized society we don't accept concepts like bounties and blood money. Normal people think this is really fucked up and unethical, so Goodell is going to send a message to everybody else that if you bring that thug shit to the the shield, he is going to kick your ass out of his league.

It was never about "good, clean, hard, hits", as you mouth breathing morons continually (and still) miss the point. It's about rouge cash-for-injury operations taking place in locker rooms, and it can't be tolerated for reasons obvious to anybody who isn't mentally retarded.

:joeybats: :joeybats: :joeybats:

[ZoneBlitz]

The idea that bounties don't change the way the players play is not only flawed, but is also irrelevant, even if you are right (which you are not).

Obviously everyone associated with the bounties should be penalized, because that isnt and shouldnt be allowed.

But the idea that players played differently because of bounties is wrong and stupid.

[Warner2BruceTD]

joey bats


Don't back peddle son, you think bounties are "cool".

You also continually say they don't change the way the game is played, which is not only wrong, but is also missing the point.

I see nothing wrong with it because it's the nature of the game. If I tell a guy to fill the alley at full speed, I don't expect him to get there and play patty-cake with the running back.

Why not have a reward system? A "big hit" is too subjective, so he said if you need to injure a guy. I really don't see why it's a big deal. Every player in the NFL gets some type of ding in every single game. There's not one guy in the league after week 3 that isn't hurt in some way. I think it's cool, actually. Go knock a dude out. That's how we play D.

To me, it's foolish of you to think this doesn't happen everywhere, or if it's not to the extent of paying players, there isn't one guy out there who isn't trying to get a knock-out hit on his resume. Tell me when you played in HS you didn't want to de-cleat a guy. There's no guarantee that he gets hurt, but fuck, if he does, I'm getting paid. I win twice.

Cut the cord, man. Let it go.

[nwfisch]

Obviously everyone associated with the bounties should be penalized, because that isnt and shouldnt be allowed.

But the idea that players played differently because of bounties is wrong and stupid.

Players don't play harder for more money and prestige. OK

[Rayman]

Don't get your roided up panties in such a twist there Lattimer. This isn't a discussion about where Favre sits on the GOAT list, this is about the Saints being guilty of illegal hits on QBs during the 2010 playoffs. The mention of Favre's name as a victim of said bounty program is germane to the conversation going on in this thread.



It's a good thing you don't work for the NFLPA or the league office because there were $30,000 in fines in those hits that are in your clip. If you don't think the shots to the knee and ankle area that produced the injuries shown in the photo weren't dirty, then you are just trolling.


I know what I saw because I was at the game. They were cheering and high fiving each other when Favre took a dirty shot like the one where he was driven to the turf and the high low shot that knocked him out of the game. When that one happened and Favre was limping off of the field the reaction on the Saints sideline made it obvious something was going on. NFL sidelines do not normally cheer for injuries to opponents because it is bad karma.

The hits were so illegal that they never got flagged or fined for them.

[Warner2BruceTD]

The hits were so illegal that they never got flagged or fine for them.

Illegal/dirty are not the same thing, and besides, i'm pretty sure the Saints were fined for those hits, and I recall those hits being a pretty big talking point in the week following the game. There is little question the Saints were headhunting Favre, and now we know Vilma had $10k on his head. Probably explains the legal, but highly questionable and unnecessary cheap shot on Warner the week before, too.

At any rate, any borderline hit or penalty the Saints have committed over the last three years now immediately has to come into question, and Payton & Loomis can only blame themselves.

[DSpydr84]

joey bats


Don't back peddle son, you think bounties are "cool".

You also continually say they don't change the way the game is played, which is not only wrong, but is also missing the point.



Cut the cord, man. Let it go.

Cord was cut. You mentioned my name.

Should the NFL allow it - no.

Can I put myself in Williams' and the players' shoes and understand why this would take place - yes.

Does that make it right - no.

Should the NFL change the game so that players are more safe - doesn't matter to me either way.

Can the NFL game be played in the manner it is today and not have things like this take place (bounties, cheap shots, trying to injure other players, win-at-all-cost mentality, etc) - I don't think it can.

[bucky]

Well, well, well, looks like everybody is going down, just like I said they would.

You see Tailback, Zoneblitz, bucky, dspyder, in civilized society we don't accept concepts like bounties and blood money. Normal people think this is really fucked up and unethical, so Goodell is going to send a message to everybody else that if you bring that thug shit to the the shield, he is going to kick your ass out of his league.

It was never about "good, clean, hard, hits", as you mouth breathing morons continually (and still) miss the point. It's about rouge cash-for-injury operations taking place in locker rooms, and it can't be tolerated for reasons obvious to anybody who isn't mentally retarded.

Thanks for misrepresenting us. Grow a penis and take your PMS meds. You are such a fucking woman. Not because you don't get caught up in the macho attitude stuff, just how you handle yourself. It's exactly like dealing with a woman.

Good luck in the Tournament dude!!!!!!

[MrBill]

The hits were so illegal that they never got flagged or fine for them.

As mentioned in my post there were multiple roughing penalties from hits on Favre in that game and $30K in fines levied by the league.

Excerpt from Peter Kings MMQB article this morning-

Favre isn't that angry -- but he is glad the truth is coming out. I caught Favre at the end of a day planting soybeans on his ranch in southern Mississippi Friday. The story had broken two hours earlier, and his cell phone kept vibrating. That's how he knew something was up. When I told him the extent of it, and the Vilma story, I waited for his reaction. "Hmmmm,'' he said, and paused. "That's about it.''

With Favre, the reaction is rarely three words long. "I'm not pissed,'' he said. "It's football. I don't think anything less of those guys. I would have loved to play with Vilma. Hell of a player. I've got a lot of respect for Gregg Williams. He's a great coach. I'm not going to make a big deal about it. In all honesty, there's a bounty of some kind on you on every play. Now, in that game there were some plays that, I don't want to say were odd, but I'd throw the ball and whack, on every play. Hand it off, whack. Over and over. Some were so blatant. I hand the ball to Percy Harvin early and got drilled right in the chin. They flagged that one at least.

"I've always been friends with Darren Sharper, and he came in a couple times and popped me hard. I remember saying, 'What THE hell you doing, Sharp?' I felt there should have been more calls against the Saints. I thought some of their guys should have been fined more.''

As for the story finally seeing the light of day, Favre said: "Now the truth comes out. That's good. But that's football. The only thing that really pisses me off about the whole thing is we lost the game. That's the thing about that day that still bothers me. And that's the way it goes. If they wanted me to testify in court about this, they'd be calling the wrong guy.''

Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/201...#ixzz1oGGZKm5H