Steve Berthiaume on why the Rays need to leave Tampa

[Youk]

I highly doubt building a new stadium in the Tampa area would do the trick here, not to mention the cost of the thing would be enormous.

Completely agree. It's sad to say, but the Rays need to explore the options of relocation. The thing is, most of the markets that would be open to relocation would be smaller than the Tampa Bay area. That's not to say that attendance would be worse, but they would still be a small-market team.

Shame that three New York teams couldn't happen. (Yankees and Mets would never allow it)

[EmpireWF]

Ken Rosenthal wrote about the need to relocate the Athletics and the Rays earlier this year.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/oakland-as-tampa-bay-rays-need-to-relocate-or-face-contraction-022211

Mentioned how the Rays support from the fans is non-existent so building a new stadium in a down market is not the answer.

If the New York clubs or Boston could be convinced, perhaps a third NY team or a second one in New England could financially work.

He listed other potential options as San Antonio, Charlotte, Tampa, Orlando or anywhere else that could make sense.

Curious, without worrying about pleasing the Yankee/Met brass, where would they put a third NY team? I doubt they'd have much interest in an upstate team since it would usually be cold as fuck in March/April and then in September.

Another NYC team? Staten Island and Brooklyn have minor league teams that draw relatively well considering they're low A ball. lol @ SI tho.



The big thing with the new Marlins stadium is it's enclosed so they should be able to draw better in part due to that (plus having a state of the art BASEBALL stadium doesn't hurt).

[NAHSTE]

The only city I can think of that is remotely viable population wise is Portland, and they've failed to support a AAA team twice. But they should move the Rays to Portland or Vegas or somewhere else out west and put them in the AL West. Move Texas to the Central or just leave the NL East with 4 teams.

[Goober]

I still think contraction is the best option.

If they relocate, Vancouver.

[Swarley]

I've always thought Charlotte or Orlando would be best for the Rays. But clearly something does need to be done. That fan base is embarrassing. As for a quick comment on that Rosenthal article about the A's as well, maybe moving them down to San Jose would work.

[FedEx227]

Contraction really isn't fair though because by all measures it's an extremely well run franchise with a growing amount of success. This isn't a dead in the water franchise like the Expos largerly were.

[FirstTimer]

Contraction really isn't fair though because by all measures it's an extremely well run franchise with a growing amount of success. This isn't a dead in the water franchise like the Expos largerly were.

Exactly. They play in an extremely difficult division and for the last 4 years or so have been at the very least a good baseball team.

[Obst]

How much better support could the Rays get if they moved to Tampa? Would it make that much of a difference? If so then it would only be fair to move them there.

[FedEx227]

I think it would help a decent amount but not enough to be as viable as many of the other franchises in the league.

Right now they are absolute dead last in population within 20-30 miles of their stadium. Moving them closer to the actual population hub of the area would probably help but as that article pointed out the Lightning still struggle to generate consistent attendance and they are in that population zone.

[FirstTimer]

I think it would help a decent amount but not enough to be as viable as many of the other franchises in the league.

Right now they are absolute dead last in population within 20-30 miles of their stadium. Moving them closer to the actual population hub of the area would probably help but as that article pointed out the Lightning still struggle to generate consistent attendance and they are in that population zone.

Except no one likes hockey anyways and Tampa has never been a great hockey hub. The Marlins and Rays proved that when they play good ball they draw crowds in southern Florida. I think using the Tampa Bay Lightning to explain why the Rays wouldn't draw was kind of weak.

[NAHSTE]

What about Omaha, OKC, Charlotte?

Omaha maybe, that new ball park is beautiful and there is a huge sports fan base there. Risky though due to the small market.

OKC is another maybe, I think their AAA team draws well, it'd give another southwestern team for Texas/Houston to be rivals with and they have proven they support big league sports with the Thunder.

Charlotte is probably a no due to proximity between DC and Atlanta and the lack of a viable ball park (at least to my knowledge).

[RyanLeaf16]

http://espn.go.com/blog/sweetspot/po...t-of-tampa-bay



Can't really argue with him, you can literally hear the vendors yelling out during the games on TV due to the lack of people lol. Sucks to because they are such a well run team, with a TON of talent on the current roster and in their farm system. When they do leave, and I think it's inevitable, some town is going to get a great team. Not to mention if they moved out of the AL East they would probably do even better. Marlins have horrible attendance issues as well, but they are finishing up building their new stadium more in the miami city area so it should pull in more fans. I highly doubt building a new stadium in the Tampa area would do the trick here, not to mention the cost of the thing would be enormous.

The thing that really drives me nuts, and I am sure you are well aware of this MVPete, is the number of transplants to this area. Most people who live in this area are not originally from here. I am a native, but, I don't know of many others. My neighbor across the street is from Rhode Island. Guess who he roots for? The guy next to me is from Philly. Hell of a nice guy too, but, guess who he roots for?

People say this is a bad area for baseball. I say that is horseshit. The problem is, people move down here and they keep their allegiances from the north. It's not my place to tell people who to root for. However, I find it laughable when people use the "You guys have such a good team, it's a shame no one watches them." Well, many of the transplants don't bother to go because they have the MLB package and watch their team on a nightly basis and it would be total blasphemy, according to them, to root for the team that plays in their city. Soooo...you are left with a small pool of people to draw on.

Additionally, the Yankees have a very strong presence down here. Most may think they just train down here. However, Yankee headquarters are down here. You can see their offices driving down Dale Mabry Highway. George Steinbrenner was a saint to the Tampa area. His family still lives down here, hell, the high school just 2 miles down the road from me is named George M. Steinbrenner High School. A number of players live down here as well. Jeter spends the entire offseason down here and it's not out of the ordinary to see them out and about during the offseason. Because of this community involvement with Mr. Steinbrenner and the large presence of the Yankee offices and training facilities, the team has reached a number of people down here and have a large presence in the area.

Finally, I think Berthiaume underplayed the employment issue. People on here are going to argue with me, but, this is a services industry related area. It's not a major metropolis like a Boston or New York that attract big businesses and corporations. Plus, the REAL unemployment rate for this area is actually > 20%. As most of you know, the unemployment rate is actually based off the number of people drawing off the system. It does not take into account the people that have been on unemployment so long that they are no longer eligible for benefits.

I don't think moving the Rays will maximize revenue streams for Sternberg and company. In fact, I think they will find very similar results for any possible cities considered in relocation. That being said, you can't blame them for considering a move or thinking it may be in their best interest.

[RyanLeaf16]

The big thing with moving them anywhere in Florida is the need for an expensive stadium. They are either going to need a retractable roof due to the amount of rain storms we get here during the year. They would have to get most of that money from the residents in the area, so it would most likely come down to the residents of Tampa if they want to keep the team then they are going to have to pay for it.

Yeah, the residents of Miami played that poker game with Jeff Loria and blinked. If the Rays threatened to move and insisted on a taxpayer funded stadium, I would call their bluff and let them explore their options. All too often teams use the threat of relocation to get people to pony up large amounts of cash to pay for a stadium.

What would be really interesting is what would happen to broadcasting rights if the Rays did move. The logical selection would be the Marlins would take the area. In fact, the Rays usually play on SunSports and the Marlins are usually on FSFlorida. However, I could see the Yankees trying to make a play for a broadcast deal in this area and I could see the Braves doing the same.

[FedEx227]

Except no one likes hockey anyways and Tampa has never been a great hockey hub. The Marlins and Rays proved that when they play good ball they draw crowds in southern Florida. I think using the Tampa Bay Lightning to explain why the Rays wouldn't draw was kind of weak.

It's a tough risk to take though, while you'd like to say "Well we're BASEBALL" it doesn't make sense to put up millions of dollars to build a stadium and run into the same problem. It'd be nice to ignore what the other sports in the area do.

Personally, I think baseball needs to get out of South Florida all together.

[RyanLeaf16]

If you guys really want to hear a conversation about this. Go to www.620wdae.com and click on the listen live link.

You'll hear from the locals perspective. Should be a good listen today.