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Agre and disagree. It looked liek it he wanted to call a TO but then didn't. Maybe he wasn't sure at that moment if they had one. He gets down near the bench and starts hearing peope yelling to call a TO and that confirms to him that he does have one to spend. I think at worst Webber wasn't sure if Michigan had a timeout or not and once he got near his own bench and heard people telling him to call one it made up his mind for him.
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Michael Talley signaled the timeout to Webber when he first touched the ball. There was a point in the documentary where they highlight Talley on the bench signaling timeout to Webber.
I had never seen the footage of Webber's walk off the court after the game ended. That was pretty powerful.Comment
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They missed a few things, but one I remember clearly (though I don't remember when it happened).
Sometime before or during the 1992 tourney, they were in a press conference, and someone asked them how many championships they could win. In turn, each of them said 4. I'm actually a little surprised that they didn't include that in there.
They mentioned but didn't talk much about the 1992 Indiana game, which was the final game of the regular season. We were #15, and beat them (#2) at Crisler, going into Selection Sunday. That was the main reason that everyone was shocked at the #6 seed; we thought we'd be a #3 or #4 at worst.
Webber did not announce a week after the tourney ended. I was home; my mom actually told me (and I screamed "NO!" in her face, but that's another story). It was probably 3-4 weeks after the tourney ended. After the final and frozen fours was a HUGE dead time on campus, with finals starting two weeks later. It went from excitement to "let's just get out of here already".
Perry Watson went on to coach the U of Detroit after my soph year, and we played them every year for a while. He'd get a HUGE hand when he'd come out on the court.
It will be interesting to see what happens with Webber when the sanctions lift.
Had to add... when Jalen said "We call them the Ohio State Fuckeyes", you'll notice he used the present tense. He also used the collective "we"... and represented all of us. ;)UglyChristmasLights.com - Celebrating 10 years with the 2011 collection!Comment
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really great documentary, these guys were very interesting and i can only imagine them with twitter accounts during their run
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Grant Hill goes in on Jalen Rose
March 16, 2011, 1:47 pm
Grant Hill’s Response to Jalen Rose
By GRANT HILL
Grant Hill currently plays for the Phoenix Suns.Associated Press Grant Hill currently plays for the Phoenix Suns.
“The Fab Five,” an ESPN film about the Michigan basketball careers of Jalen Rose, Juwan Howard, Chris Webber, Jimmy King and Ray Jackson from 1991 to 1993, was broadcast for the first time Sunday night. In the show, Rose, the show’s executive producer, stated that Duke recruited only black players he considered to be “Uncle Toms.” Grant Hill, a player on the Duke team that beat Michigan in the 1992 Final Four, reflected on Rose’s comments.
I am a fan, friend and longtime competitor of the Fab Five. I have competed against Jalen Rose and Chris Webber since the age of 13. At Michigan, the Fab Five represented a cultural phenomenon that impacted the country in a permanent and positive way. The very idea of the Fab Five elicited pride and promise in much the same way the Georgetown teams did in the mid-1980s when I was in high school and idolized them. Their journey from youthful icons to successful men today is a road map for so many young, black men (and women) who saw their journey through the powerful documentary, “The Fab Five.”
It was a sad and somewhat pathetic turn of events, therefore, to see friends narrating this interesting documentary about their moment in time and calling me a bitch and worse, calling all black players at Duke “Uncle Toms” and, to some degree, disparaging my parents for their education, work ethic and commitment to each other and to me. I should have guessed there was something regrettable in the documentary when I received a Twitter apology from Jalen before its premiere. I am aware Jalen has gone to some length to explain his remarks about my family in numerous interviews, so I believe he has some admiration for them.
In his garbled but sweeping comment that Duke recruits only “black players that were ‘Uncle Toms,’ ” Jalen seems to change the usual meaning of those very vitriolic words into his own meaning, i.e., blacks from two-parent, middle-class families. He leaves us all guessing exactly what he believes today.
I am beyond fortunate to have two parents who are still working well into their 60s. They received great educations and use them every day. My parents taught me a personal ethic I try to live by and pass on to my children.
I come from a strong legacy of black Americans. My namesake, Henry Hill, my father’s father, was a day laborer in Baltimore. He could not read or write until he was taught to do so by my grandmother. His first present to my dad was a set of encyclopedias, which I now have. He wanted his only child, my father, to have a good education, so he made numerous sacrifices to see that he got an education, including attending Yale.
This is part of our great tradition as black Americans. We aspire for the best or better for our children and work hard to make that happen for them. Jalen’s mother is part of our great black tradition and made the same sacrifices for him.
My teammates at Duke — all of them, black and white — were a band of brothers who came together to play at the highest level for the best coach in basketball. I know most of the black players who preceded and followed me at Duke. They all contribute to our tradition of excellence on the court.
It is insulting and ignorant to suggest that men like Johnny Dawkins (coach at Stanford), Tommy Amaker (coach at Harvard), Billy King (general manager of the Nets), Tony Lang (coach of the Mitsubishi Diamond Dolphins in Japan), Thomas Hill (small-business owner in Texas), Jeff Capel (former coach at Oklahoma and Virginia Commonwealth), Kenny Blakeney (assistant coach at Harvard), Jay Williams (ESPN analyst), Shane Battier (Memphis Grizzlies) and Chris Duhon (Orlando Magic) ever sold out their race.
To hint that those who grew up in a household with a mother and father are somehow less black than those who did not is beyond ridiculous. All of us are extremely proud of the current Duke team, especially Nolan Smith. He was raised by his mother, plays in memory of his late father and carries himself with the pride and confidence that they instilled in him.
The sacrifice, the effort, the education and the friendships I experienced in my four years are cherished. The many Duke graduates I have met around the world are also my “family,” and they are a special group of people. A good education is a privilege.
Just as Jalen has founded a charter school in Michigan, we are expected to use our education to help others, to improve life for those who need our assistance and to use the excellent education we have received to better the world.
A highlight of my time at Duke was getting to know the great John Hope Franklin, John B. Duke Professor of History and the leading scholar of the last century on the total history of African-Americans in this country. His insights and perspectives contributed significantly to my overall development and helped me understand myself, my forefathers and my place in the world.
Ad ingenium faciendum, toward the building of character, is a phrase I recently heard. To me, it is the essence of an educational experience. Struggling, succeeding, trying again and having fun within a nurturing but competitive environment built character in all of us, including every black graduate of Duke.
My mother always says, “You can live without Chaucer and you can live without calculus, but you cannot make it in the wide, wide world without common sense.” As we get older, we understand the importance of these words. Adulthood is nothing but a series of choices: you can say yes or no, but you cannot avoid saying one or the other. In the end, those who are successful are those who adjust and adapt to the decisions they have made and make the best of them.
I caution my fabulous five friends to avoid stereotyping me and others they do not know in much the same way so many people stereotyped them back then for their appearance and swagger. I wish for you the restoration of the bond that made you friends, brothers and icons.
I am proud of my family. I am proud of my Duke championships and all my Duke teammates. And, I am proud I never lost a game against the Fab Five.
Grant Henry Hill
Phoenix Suns
Duke ‘94Comment
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I never liked Bobby Hurley, but his comments about the documentary were kinda funny.Comment
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All Hill needed to say was "71-51 bitches"Comment
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jason whitlock had a great piece on the documentry
Whitlock: Fab Five film more fantasy than documentary - College Basketball News | FOX Sports on MSN
It was my intention to ignore ESPN’s “The Fab Five” documentary.
I assumed their “legacy” would be framed inaccurately by the doc’s executive producer Jalen Rose, the leader of the Fab Five.
Earning $125 million in the NBA and transitioning into a TV talking head produces little self-awareness and even fewer qualifications as a documentarian.
Give Rose credit. He talked a major television network and an alleged news organization into allowing him to write his own 90-minute history. We should all be so lucky.
With the help of the Worldwide Leader, Rose took baggy shorts, black socks, bald heads and trash talk and created the illusion the Fab Five were some sort of transcendent, revolutionary freedom fighters cut from the same cloth as Jackie Robinson, Jim Brown, Arthur Ashe and Muhammad Ali.
It’s laughably untrue.
The legacy of the Fab Five is that they were on the cutting edge of America’s unashamed embrace of style over substance.
When Rose ended the documentary waxing about how no one knows the names of the starters on North Carolina’s 1993 national championship team and everyone remembers Rose, Webber, Howard, King and Jackson, it dawned on me the Fab Five were the original Charlie Sheen.
Let me make this clear: I do not dislike the Fab Five. I made my bones as a journalist covering the Fab Five for the Ann Arbor News. I have a strong affinity for Rose, Juwan Howard and Ray Jackson. I have a great deal of respect for Chris Webber, particularly the way he handled the aftermath of the “timeout” and his work as an NBA broadcaster. I never developed any kind of connection with Jimmy King.
But the celebration of this documentary annoys me.
The Fab Five are taking credit for the real accomplishments of John Thompson’s and Patrick Ewing’s Georgetown Hoyas.
It was Thompson’s all-black, Ewing-led teams a decade before the Fab Five that shook the foundation of college basketball, changed the complexion of starting lineups across the country, opened coaching doors that had previously been closed to blacks and paved the way for black sportswriters at major newspapers.
It’s easy to forgive Rose for his lack of self-awareness. It’s America. In this country, self-awareness and common sense are our most rare commodities.
What’s not easy to excuse is the clueless robbery of what Thompson, Ewing, Bill Martin, Reggie Williams, Horace Broadnax and David Wingate accomplished.
They won championships — conference and national. They scared and intimidated the establishment. They were the inner-city black kids who left a legacy of jobs and playing opportunities for other impoverished minorities that exposes the lack of substance in the fads popularized by the Fab Five.
“Hoya Paranoia” is the story that deserves celebration and should serve as a teaching tool. Fab Five is a safe, harmless story celebrating black kids for choosing style over substance.
Rather than participate in the documentary, Public Enemy’s Chuck D should’ve remade “Don’t Believe the Hype” and replaced Elvis with Jalen Rose.
Five super-talented black kids enrolled at a prestigious, white university to play for an inexperienced, piss-poor-at-the-time white coach and, 20 years later, had the audacity to embark on a media tour preaching about black Duke players being Uncle Toms.
Are you kidding me?
Are we really this lost as a people?
Let’s end the facade that Rose’s words about the Duke players are being taken out of context. On Monday, Jimmy King was on ESPN spewing this nonsense.
Last week Webber published this bit of nonsense on his blog.
The Fab Five clearly believe Coach K and Duke didn’t and don’t recruit inner-city black kids, and they believe race/racism/elitism are the driving forces behind the philosophy.
Let’s go back to the Fab Five era and Duke’s philosophy then. Coach K recruited kids who had every intention of staying in school for four years. He recruited kids who had a good chance of competing academically at Duke and could meet the standardized test score qualifications for entrance.
The Fab Five stated it was their intention to win a national championship and turn pro as a group after their sophomore season. Webber, who was recruited by Duke, left Michigan after two years. Rose and Howard left as juniors. Impoverished inner-city kids have good reason to turn pro early. I’m not knocking Webber, Howard and Rose for their decisions. They didn’t fit the Duke profile at the time.
Furthermore, unlike Steve Fisher at the time, Coach K did more than roll the ball on the court. He coached.
The ideal in college basketball is to lead four-year student-athletes to conference and national championships. That’s the goal.
During the three-year run of the Fab Five (one season without Webber), Duke beat Michigan all four times the schools met while winning two ACC titles and one NCAA title. During the same span, Michigan won zero conference or national titles. In addition, Webber’s interactions with booster Ed Martin put the program on probation and caused Michigan to forfeit all its games.
I think Coach K recruited and recruits the right kids for Duke.
It’s ridiculous for Webber to insinuate that Coach K feared the Fab Five were “thugs and killers.”
Coach K probably thought the same thing I thought watching the Fab Five play: They’re immature, arrogant, interested in playing for a coach they could ignore and incapable of putting together the consistent focus and effort necessary to win a conference championship.
Two teams consistently beat the Fab Five — Duke (4-0) and Indiana (4-2).
Let me translate that for you: Structured, disciplined, well-coached teams beat Michigan.
While making money for their white university and allowing their incompetent, white coach to learn on the job, the Fab Five were not man enough to harness the courage and focus to outduel — in their minds — inferior, racist teams.
Now tell me who the sellouts were?
It wasn’t John Thompson, Patrick Ewing or Grant Hill.Comment
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you guys dont like Whitlock?Comment
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23:33 OnlyOneBeerLeft: jake nobody listens to you aint you supposed to die from cancer or somethin soon?Comment
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I don't see a problem with the comments made by Rose. I think he's clearly saying that's how he felt at the time as a 17 year old... I don't really know what's wrong with that. I doubt he still thinks that about HillComment
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Nothing at all when he was 17 but of course the way media blows everything out of proportion and content what would you expect.
But he really didnt retract what he said if he was so sorry.
Jalen was jealous he didnt have the grades to go to Duke anyway and why would Duke look at any of those five guys to come there when they all said they want to win a national championship and leave for the NBA. thats not what Dukes about and Im the biggest Duke hater there is and Im white.Comment
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