This weekend. All the haters can suck it.

[KINGOFOOTBALL]

damn KOF didn't we learn at MM like 10 years ago that this was one of the biggest waste of time arguments in the history of internet message boards. :D

lol of course!!
Im only doing it because of the HOF induction and to bring you out of the woodworks.

Remember when Charles Haley threw his helmet at Jerry and said "SIGN HIM NOW!!"?

That fucker was scary. "WE CANT WIN WITHOUT EMMITT"
Tryna throw trashcans across the room.

[BigBucs]

A Cowboys fan would never concede this argument. Any neutral party who seen both of them play and take in to account surrounding talent knows its a no brainer. Some of the 90s Cowboys teams are mentioned amongst the NFL top 10 of all time. Who did Barry Sanders have? Herman Moore to take some the heat off him? Barry Sanders was the sole focal point week in and week out and still shitted on the competition. I dont even see how this is debatable.

[KINGOFOOTBALL]

A Cowboys fan would never concede this argument. Any neutral party who seen both of them play and take in to account surrounding talent knows its a no brainer. Some of the 90s Cowboys teams are mentioned amongst the NFL top 10 of all time. Who did Barry Sanders have? Herman Moore to take some the heat off him? Barry Sanders was the sole focal point week in and week out and still shitted on the competition. I dont even see how this is debatable.

The article says otherwise.

If Barry had performed better his 5 playoff teams may have made a bigger name for themselves. Only an idiot ignores every single point than comes back with the same tired argument that somehow success diminishes a player.
It borders on the retarded.

I hope you have Young , Rice , Brady , Brown , Thurman Thomas , Marshall Faulk , Singletary, Peyton Manning , Marvin Harrison off your top players of all time list.

I also hope your all star all time NFL draft team starts with Archie Manning , Corey Dillon , Tim Brown. What those guys did with piles of dirt for teammates catapults them to no.1 on any list.

[bucky]

Interesting the Lions and Cowboys split the decade in terms of passing yardage.
They had a "good" line. You dont get to the playoffs 5 times have ,an all time back and record breaking WRs with a shitty line.
Interesting that Herman Moore led the league in receptions twice , finished 2nd a 3rd . He and Brett Perriman BOTH had 100 receptions in a single season. Both went over a thousand yards back to back seasons.
Thats alot of work with noone throwing to you.

Sorry, but Scott Mitchel wasn't a good QB. Sanders and Moore made him his only good season. And that was Moore's QB during those years.

Sanders helped open up that passing attack by teams devoting so much to stopping the run. Makes it easier for receivers. I watched a lot of the games.

All running backs have holes to run through. You dont make it in this league without them.
All of you ignoring this entire league and its top runners are all in a system similar to Barrys not Emmits.
You spread the field you remove the FB and a linebacker from the field and you let your RB pick his spots.
Like it or not Emmit faced more 8 man fronts per season than Barry ever did. Formations dictate fronts not players.

Sorry, I watched a lot of the Lions games. Barry drew a lot of attention from the defenses. GB devoted a lot to trying to stop Barry. Dallas had a much better O-Lineman than Barry had, and more holes to run through. Just a fact. Letting Sanders pick his spots doesn't mean that the O-Line had anywhere for him to go.

EDIT: Formations definitely dictate fronts, but some players do as well.

lol they won our division and made the playoffs 5 times with bad teams...ok..got it.
He created all his yards and the losses were purely the lines fault.
lol Somehow Barry can rack up 230 yards in the regular season and its all him...when he runs for -1 against that same team all of a sudden its his coordinator and his lines fault.
Blaming the coordinator for abandoning the run after 13 carries and -1 yards is laughable.

Here I know your talking out of your ass (Sorry for the talking out of your ass statement). I watched the game. It was against my Packers. The O-Coordinator was in his first year and didn't understand how to use Sanders, and abandoned the run game when he should not have. I saw an interview a couple years after the game where the O-Coordinator admitted to just that. I was thrilled that he was such a dumbass.

Sanders made a lot of his own yards out of nothing. He did it against my Packers consistently. No where to go, with no holes to run through, and makes these moves and makes three guys miss and next thing you know, he's 30, 40, 50, or 60 yards downfield.

Deciding to cut back into 3 defenders is a wrong decision.
Everyone has a responsibilty. Sanders failed to live up to his and underperformed in the playoffs. SIX games only 1 good one. The other 5 were just not his fault ?

Here you're just wrong. Cowboys during the Smith years far greater than Lions during the Sanders years. Cowboys O-Line during the Smith years, far greater than Lion's O-Line during the Sanders years. Sanders made a LOT of his own yards, out of nothing.

He also made nothing out of something far too many times to be ahead of the others.
This is NFL not CBS sports fantasy football lineup sign up now league.
You cant waste time "waiting" for guys to break a long runs. You need to get yardage,you need to get first downs , you need the plays you call to be positive gains ,and you need to establish some semblance of a threat. You need a guy you can count on that anywhere on the field any down and instance he can deliver. Barry wasnt that guy. Sorry.

Sanders didn't make nothing out of something like you claim. Sanders made nothing out of nothing. And he would do it for 3, 4, 5, or 6 runs in a row. Then he would make something out of nothing on the next run. And that something could be a 65 yard run. That was the danger of Sanders. That's why you had to devote so much of your defense to stop him.

You put Smith on the Lions during that time and you don't know just how great Smith really is. Smith isn't a something out of nothing back. Smith is a between the tackles, get consistent yards back that could break some long ones. He was just what Dallas wanted. Sanders is what the Lions needed.

Anyway, I'll let you get the last word and not post again. We clearly won't see eye to eye on this.

Even though I disagree with where you put Sanders and Smith, I think you're on of the best sports guys on VSN. I'm done. I will give you the last word dude.

My last word is.....Congrats Emmit, you deserve all the accolades. I respected both he and Aiken. Not so much that coke head receiver. Nice talking to you KOF.

[Aso]

Um.. Aikman had his second best passing season in 97. Irvin had a pretty on par season in 97 as well.

Emmitt was a hair shy of 1400 twice and went over 10 tds twice during this "decline". Barrys 10th and final season he had 1491 4 tds. Emmitts 10th season he had 1397 and 11 tds.

Your not going to win a statistical argument for Barry.

I'm talking about Aikman and Irvin's decline and the domino effect on Emmitt. After 1995 neither Aikman or Irvin had as good seasons as they did between 91 and 95 and because of that neither did Emmitt.

Irvin may have had a couple good seasons but they weren't good by Irvins standards and Emmitt may have had a couple good seasons in 98 and 99 but again, it wasn't nearly what he did between 91 and 95. That's a point you can't argue.

15 games in a season with a TD. NFL record. More with More.

Cool.

Yeah and ?
Thats the point. His style wasnt condusive to winning.
Dont use INTs against Favre because he was a "gun slinger" that was just his style.
Dont use fumbles against Peterson because "thats his style".
Its a retarded argument. Take the good with the bad.

So if you aren't an overly physical back then you're style isn't conducive to winning. Barry Sanders' biggest asset may have been his biggest weakness, how he didn't hit the correct hole all the time. If he did do that I think he could play in the offense that coach Bobby Ross wanted him to play in 97 and 98 but thats speculation.

More TDs same amount of Rushing titles.
Only an idiot takes less production. The point of this game is to score points and win games.

If Barry was such a yardage machine why did Emmitt outrush him the same amount of times ?

5 tds a season >>130 yards a season.
Even a fantasy football nutjob admits that.

The same amount of rushing titles with quite a bit less carries and 5 less seasons... Four times Emmitt Smith had more carries in a season than what Barry Sanders career high for carries in a season was. It's not overall less production. It's about 4 less touchdowns per year for a lot higher yards per carry. He outrushed him the same amount of times because he had a lot more carries. This seems like it's something you don't comprehend.

This isn't fantasy football. That doesn't help your argument one bit.

Packers, Bills ,Skins,Steelers blocked for 4 HOF rbs.
Bills had two thousand yard rushers in a season.

Again. You dont hear offensive lines come up until someone tried to defend Barry. Its a weak argument.

Because RB's don't play well unless they have a good offensive line... or unless you're Barry Sanders. This past season Benson had a very good offensive line and averaged 4.2 ypc, this is the difference between a great back and a back like Cedric Benson.

Are you dense ?
TuenIe ,Newton ,Gogan , Gesek were nobodies in the league before Emmitt. NO PROBOWLS.
Emmitt comes in all of a sudden there PB HOF players ?

Were they waiting ?
Ray Donaldson is a journeyman who hasnt seen a PB since 89...goes to Dallas he gets back to back probowls ??
Was he just holding in his excellence for Emmitt ?

Media people don't pay a whole lot of attention to offensive lineman. Lineman only make the Pro Bowl when players around them do well unless they REALLY stand out. By the time Nate Newton became a starter the Cowboys sucked. This is pretty much the same for all the guys you named.

Youre doing a great job of proving my point.
If its the surrounding talent and the Oline how did these other players do so poorly ?
Why didnt they just step in and start popping off 150 yard games ?
Why does a SB team go 0-2 ? then win 15 of there next 17 with the only difference being one player ?

Were they just holding it all back till Emmitt arrived ?
What a special guy.

Because they couldn't perform well under anyones O-line all of a sudden proves your point? No. If a teams offensive line is great doesn't mean you can pick up Joe Nobody off the street and average 4 ypc.
Because Emmitt Smith is a HOF back and the other RB's were scrubbs.
Because their offense was centered around the run and when they couldn't do just that they sucked. Jimmy Johnson even said he always prepared his team leading up to that season as if Emmitt would start and he didn't for the first two games.

[bucky]

I hope you have Young , Rice , Brady , Brown , Thurman Thomas , Marshall Faulk , Singletary, Peyton Manning , Marvin Harrison off your top players of all time list.

Wait a minute, these guys did have good teams.

I also hope your all star all time NFL draft team starts with Archie Manning , Corey Dillon , Tim Brown. What those guys did with piles of dirt for teammates catapults them to no.1 on any list.

And I always did like Archie Manning. He did play on some horrible teams. He was NFL MVP once. But if you look at his stats, he only had one very good season. Stats don't tell the entire story.

Now I'm done.

[longhornfan]

Aso honest question, how old are you? You posted your picture in the thread in the soap box and you don't look older then 20. There's no possible way you can honestly remember the 91-95 Cowboy teams.


Anyone under the age of 28 or so in this thread should make their argument invalid. There's no way you guys remember Barry or Emmitt playing week in and week out.

[bucky]

Aso honest question, how old are you? You posted your picture in the thread in the soap box and you don't look older then 20. There's no possible way you can honestly remember the 91-95 Cowboy teams.


Anyone under the age of 28 or so in this thread should make their argument invalid. There's no way you guys remember Barry or Emmitt playing week in and week out.

Dude, I'm 50, I remember. But I said I would give KOF the last word, so I won't comment on the Barry/Emmit thing again. I'll do the same for you. You can have the last word too. I said my piece.

I know you're a Dallas fan, so I'll say what I said to KOF...Congrats Emmit, you deserve all the accolades.

[longhornfan]

Dude, I'm 50, I remember. But I said I would give KOF the last word, so I won't comment on the Barry/Emmit thing again. I'll do the same for you. You can have the last word too. I said my piece.

I know you're a Dallas fan, so I'll say what I said to KOF...Congrats Emmit, you deserve all the accolades.

LOL I wasn't talking about you, I know your one of the older guys on this forum.

I just find it funny how some guys come in here acting like they saw and remmeber Emmitt and Barry in their prime. When in reality there's probably a handful of people on VSN who actually did.

[FirstTimer]

Deja Vu.

All over again.

:acid:

[BigBucs]

Aso honest question, how old are you? You posted your picture in the thread in the soap box and you don't look older then 20. There's no possible way you can honestly remember the 91-95 Cowboy teams.


Anyone under the age of 28 or so in this thread should make their argument invalid. There's no way you guys remember Barry or Emmitt playing week in and week out.

How about deeming all Dallas/Lions fans opinions invalid. There surely has to be some bias from each side wouldnt you think?

[bucky]

Deja Vu.

All over again.

:acid:

Hey FT. Even though I hate everything Bears (I know you understand why), I defended Walter Payton. I might hate the Bears, but I have a strong respect for Walter. For a GB Packer fan, that's hard to say.

[longhornfan]

How about deeming all Dallas/Lions fans opinions invalid. There surely has to be some bias from each side wouldnt you think?

BB you should know how these threads go from your days at MM. There's really no middle ground when it comes to the Barry/Emmitt conversation.

Its always the same old arguments..

[BigBucs]

BB you should know how these threads go from your days at MM. There's really no middle ground when it comes to the Barry/Emmitt conversation.

Its always the same old arguments..

Yea and its always Dallas fans making the case for Emmit while all nuetral partys are siding with Barry. You dont find that interesting?

[longhornfan]

Yea and its always Dallas fans making the case for Emmit while all nuetral partys are siding with Barry. You dont find that interesting?

Wait your telling me that Dallas fans are making a case for Emmitt? No way!!11

Of course guys like KOF and rayman are going to make a case for him, thats the guy they grew up watching every weekend. He's probably their favorite player on their favorite team.