So, Nuke...

[Fox1994]

One bad game not only from him but the whole team as well and we get a 9 page thread on it and how much he sucks? Damn...

Four pages... Forty posts per page.

[FirstTimer]

Denver can win a Super Bowl with Kyle Orton.. We're one year away..

The Ravens won a Super Bowl with Trent Dilfer.

The Colts won one and got to another one because of Peyton Manning

There's a difference.

[Tailback U]

Numbers next to teams are NFL ranks in points & yards. Martz coached offenses in bold.


1998 Rams - 24, 27 (3 wins)
1999 Rams - 1, 1
(Rams have not had a winning season since Martz left in 2005, many of those years with a roster full of the same players Martz had to work with - Holt, Bruce, Bulger, Jackson, Pace, etc)


2005 Lions - 28, 27 (254 points)
2006 Lions - 21, 22 (7th in NFL in passing, 305 points)
2007 Lions - 16, 19 (346 points, highest ranks over a 10 year period in either category, team goes 7-9, best record since 2001)
2008 Lions - 27, 30 (268 points, 0-16, worst team in NFL history)


2007 49ers - 32, 32 (219 points, one of the worst offenses in modern era football)
2008 49ers - 22, 23 (339 points, a 120 point swing, and possibly his best work yet)
2010 49ers - 31, 23 (arguably the worst offense in the league, Jimmy Raye fired Week 3)

What the Martz offense "has always been" in an offense that IMMEDIATELY improves the second he touches it, then IMMEDIATELY drops off the earth the second he leaves.

Stick to your facinating obsession with Cutler, you are lost on the topic of Mike Martz.

I'm not going to argue that Martz is one of the best offensive mastermind's in the game, but you failed to mention the massive amount of turnovers that his teams have had over the years.

I'd love to see where all of those teams ranked in terms of turnovers.

But, I believe that has more to do with the QB than the scheme. While Martz's scheme is great, it's not going to make every QB great. Shaun Hill, JT O'Sullivan, Jon Kitna didn't really have the mind or the arm to efficiently run that type of complex passing scheme.

The jury is still out on Cutler, but it's clear that he has issues with protecting the ball, decision making, and accuracy right now. We'll see if he improves. He has all the physical tools.

[Warner2BruceTD]

Never said bench Cutler.. I just haven't seen him make the strides yet. He's at least a year away in that system and you yourself have said there's no way Martz sticks around there as an OC next year. Orton on the other hand is on pace to break Dan Marino's single season passing record after getting off to a rough start in McDaniels' offense last season..

Cutler's current career highs:

- 67% comp% is the highest of his career

- 102.2 QB rating is by far the highest of his career (has never broken 90 previously)

- 5.9 TD% is the highest of his career

- His yards per attempt (arguably the most important QB stat) of 8.9 crushes his previous career high of 7.5

-His yards per completion of 13.4 is also a career high

Across the board Cutler has drastically improved his numbers. But you haven't seen any strides yet. Good thing you aren't an NFL scout.

Meanwhile, you praise Orton for being on pace to break the yards record. Hey, that's cool, but it's only taken an obscene 175 attempts to do so. Two weeks ago, Orton threw for nearly 500 yards and produced a whopping 13 points. And you talk about 'empty stats' for Cutler? Laughable.

Orton is averaging less yards per attempt than Cutler, less yards per completion, and has the same amount of TD passes on almost 100 more attempts. And Cutler has the higher QB rating. Yet you praise Orton for having this supposed phenominal year, and rip Cutler for "making no progress". Awful. Cutler is having the better year.

glen, gtfo with this shit. You are too emotional when it comes to this topic, and you're armed with Kyle Orton, which means you're doomed to fail. Your arguments suck, and Orton swallows.

[Fox1994]

glen, gtfo with this shit. You are too emotional when it comes to this topic, and you're armed with Kyle Orton, which means you're doomed to fail. Your arguments suck, and Orton swallows. Your arguments suck, and Orton swallows.

glen: "Well, spitters are quitters."

[FirstTimer]

Cutler's current career highs:

- 67% comp% is the highest of his career

- 102.2 QB rating is by far the highest of his career (has never broken 90 previously)

- 5.9 TD% is the highest of his career

- His yards per attempt (arguably the most important QB stat) of 8.9 crushes his previous career high of 7.5

-His yards per completion of 13.4 is also a career high

Across the board Cutler has drastically improved his numbers. But you haven't seen any strides yet. Good thing you aren't an NFL scout.

Meanwhile, you praise Orton for being on pace to break the yards record. Hey, that's cool, but it's only taken an obscene 175 attempts to do so. Two weeks ago, Orton threw for nearly 500 yards and produced a whopping 13 points. And you talk about 'empty stats' for Cutler? Laughable.

Orton is averaging less yards per attempt than Cutler, less yards per completion, and has the same amount of TD passes on almost 100 more attempts. And Cutler has the higher QB rating. Yet you praise Orton for having this supposed phenominal year, and rip Cutler for "making no progress". Awful. Cutler is having the better year.

glen, gtfo with this shit. You are too emotional when it comes to this topic, and you're armed with Kyle Orton, which means you're doomed to fail. Your arguments suck, and Orton swallows.

/thread..

Until Cutler throws 7 picks in two games

[Bear Pand]

Cutler's current career highs:

- 67% comp% is the highest of his career

- 102.2 QB rating is by far the highest of his career (has never broken 90 previously)

- 5.9 TD% is the highest of his career

- His yards per attempt (arguably the most important QB stat) of 8.9 crushes his previous career high of 7.5

-His yards per completion of 13.4 is also a career high

Across the board Cutler has drastically improved his numbers. But you haven't seen any strides yet. Good thing you aren't an NFL scout.

Meanwhile, you praise Orton for being on pace to break the yards record. Hey, that's cool, but it's only taken an obscene 175 attempts to do so. Two weeks ago, Orton threw for nearly 500 yards and produced a whopping 13 points. And you talk about 'empty stats' for Cutler? Laughable.

Orton is averaging less yards per attempt than Cutler, less yards per completion, and has the same amount of TD passes on almost 100 more attempts. And Cutler has the higher QB rating. Yet you praise Orton for having this supposed phenominal year, and rip Cutler for "making no progress". Awful. Cutler is having the better year.

glen, gtfo with this shit. You are too emotional when it comes to this topic, and you're armed with Kyle Orton, which means you're doomed to fail. Your arguments suck, and Orton swallows.

All I'll say is this. Comparing Orton to Cutler is hilarious and unfair at the same time. Let's be real here Orton was just a bonus in that trade. The Broncos didn't call up the Bears and say "hey let's trade Orton for Cutler straight up!." The prize was the draft picks which the Broncos may or may not have wasted.

The fact that Orton and Cutlers numbers are even comparable at this point isn't something to beat your chest over if you're a Cutler supporter.

I understand you're talking to Broncos fans and not someone like me who'd root for Orton regardless. But you're also a bit of a hypocrite since the only reason you're even paying attention to Cutler is because your boy Martz is behind him.

And hating on Orton is about as ridiculous as it gets when you look at his supporting cast and the numbers he's been able to put up anyway. If he was actually as bad as you try to make him be his numbers would be worse.

[Warner2BruceTD]

All I'll say is this. Comparing Orton to Cutler is hilarious and unfair at the same time. Let's be real here Orton was just a bonus in that trade. The Broncos didn't call up the Bears and say "hey let's trade Orton for Cutler straight up!." The prize was the draft picks which the Broncos may or may not have wasted.

true

The fact that Orton and Cutlers numbers are even comparable at this point isn't something to beat your chest over if you're a Cutler supporter.

true

I understand you're talking to Broncos fans and not someone like me who'd root for Orton regardless. But you're also a bit of a hypocrite since the only reason you're even paying attention to Cutler is because your boy Martz is behind him.

I wouldnt be able to argue that, except I often found myself involved in this shit last year somehow, too. This shitty fucking topic is like the shitty politcal threads in the Soap Box that I vow to stop entering, but just.....can't.....do.

And hating on Orton is about as ridiculous as it gets when you look at his supporting cast and the numbers he's been able to put up anyway. If he was actually as bad as you try to make him be his numbers would be worse.

He's off to a good start.

His career numbers are as bad as I make him out to be.

But yeah, he's off to a good start. The problem for obsessed Broncos fans, is they cant even rub that in Bears fans faces, because Cutler is off to a better one - and that includes a game where he was assraped and accumulated embarrasing statistics.

[FirstTimer]

true





But yeah, he's off to a good start. The problem for obsessed Broncos fans, is they cant even rub that in Bears fans faces, because Cutler is off to a better one - and that includes a game where he was assraped and accumulated embarrasing statistics.

His passer rating was awful but he still completed 70+% of his passes.

[Senser81]

But yeah, he's off to a good start. The problem for obsessed Broncos fans, is they cant even rub that in Bears fans faces, because Cutler is off to a better one - and that includes a game where he was assraped and accumulated embarrasing statistics.

I don't think Cutler is off to a better start than Orton. Their stats are nearly identical...except for the fact that Orton has thrown for nearly 125 YARDS PER GAME more than Cutler. Wow.

[Warner2BruceTD]

I don't think Cutler is off to a better start than Orton. Their stats are nearly identical...except for the fact that Orton has thrown for nearly 125 YARDS PER GAME more than Cutler. Wow.

I certainly hope so, considering he has an obscene 175 pass attempts through three games.

Cutler has more yards per attempt & yards per completion.

I can't believe no one has mentioned this gem: Cutler's sack percentage is a mind boggling 14.3%. This with liberal use of double TE from Martz. No wonder he's still laying face down in a pool of drool.

[Senser81]

Cutler has more yards per attempt & yards per completion.

I certainly hope so, considering he has a miniscule 102 pass attempts through three games.

Do you also think that Brandon Lloyd isn't off to a better start than Devin Aromashodu, its just that Lloyd has more yards because he has more receptions?

[Warner2BruceTD]

I certainly hope so, considering he has a miniscule 102 pass attempts through three games.

That's almost 35 attempts per game.

Do you also think that Brandon Lloyd isn't off to a better start than Devin Aromashodu, its just that Lloyd has more yards because he has more receptions?

C'mon, save that shit for ram29jackon.

Orton is throwing something like 45 passes per game, he better have more yards than anyone else.

I think the point is, Orton is off to a career year, and he still isn't convincingly outplaying Cutler, who according to glen "isn't showing progress" and is having a bad year.

[Primetime]

Through 4 games people.

Orton = 43.75 PAPG
Cutler = 25.5 PAPG

[Warner2BruceTD]

Through 4 games people.

Orton = 43.75 PAPG
Cutler = 25.5 PAPG

Whether you want to "count" the abbreviated game Cutler player or not, Cutler has more yards per attempt & yards per completion. It's not like Cutler is a part time player who has 40 pass attempts. When he finishes games, he's throwing 33-35 passes.