Sean Payton Suspended 1 Year, Saints Lose Pair of 2nd Round Picks

[shag773]

Yes and don't underestimate the fact that these bounties violated the CBA. The league is making each team sign waivers saying that they do not have any kind of bounty system in place (whether for violent hits or just for making plays).

I understand that and I don't have an issue with the league acting on it. I have an issue with it's severity, and the feigned appallment from some people here and in the media. Anyone who ever stood up and cheered when a player gets absolutely destroyed is being hypocritical, and every football fan here has done that.

The players get paid to ellicit that reaction. The only difference is the money isn't always laid down on a training table by Jonathan Vilma....

[shag773]

You asked about the impact of bounties. I personally cant say either way, but I always thought the Saints were a dirty team. Anthony Hargrove was the dirtiest player in the league, diving on piles and taking out knees. Jabari Greer was always looking for a kill shot.

So, in my estimation, it did have an impact on the field. You are always going to have dirty teams like Glanville's Oilers or Buddy's Eagles, so i dont get why people have such a difficult time accepting that bounties can impact the on field product.

I have no problem accepting it if given a concrete reason why. You tell me that you're not sure if it helps or hurts, you just think the Saints are a dirty team.

I don't watch the Saints every week and I havent seen them enough to feel comfortable saying they are dirty or not. But I've seen a couple games I never remember thinking they were doing anything over the top.

If you can't tell me how it affects the game, than I can't buy into this outrage over the bounties.

[shag773]

Just because a hit is legal, does not mean it isn't dirty. How people still can not grasp this is beyond my understanding
.

Give me an example of a legal, dirty hit.

[ralaw]

Give me an example of a legal, dirty hit.

I maybe wrong, but IMO taking a runner out at the knee is pretty dirty. I'm not sure if it is legal though...I thnk it is.

[ZoneBlitz]

I maybe wrong, but IMO taking a runner out at the knee is pretty dirty.

With the rules so strict on hitting above the shoulders, taking out the knees is one of the few choices for a defender.

[ralaw]

With the rules so strict on hitting above the shoulders, taking out the knees is one of the few choices for a defender.

IMO it's still dirty. Everytime I see a tackler lunge at the knee of a runner I cringe. Maybe it is because I saw the McGahee injury in college, but to me it's pretty dirty.

[Warner2BruceTD]

Give me an example of a legal, dirty hit.

I gave multiple examples in the original Saints thread. So did senser, iirc. I'll rehash a few here.

-Any time a QB is hit after the ball is released and the defender is aware the ball is gone. Happens multiple times every game, we've all seen it. QB throws the ball, defender KNOWS the ball is gone, but because the defender is within the two steps and knows he won't draw a penalty, he drives into the QB or gives him a hard shove into the ground. Totally legal, yet totally unnecessary and cheap.

You don't see where a $10,000 bounty being on the table could lead to defenders going a little bit further than they might normally go on a hit like this?

-Anything at or below the knee, in the open field where a basic, normal, form tackle would be sufficient. Lunging at the knees is bush, but in many cases, totally legal.

Again, with a bounty on the table, you can't see where a 22 year old retard who would be flipping burgers if not for his football ability, would be tempted to take a shot at the knees, as opposed to keeping it clean?


I can go on, but you get the point. If you honestly don't see how a bounty changes how the game is played or effects what's happening on the field, this is pointless. It's just stunning to me that functioning adults can't see where any tackle the Saints have made over the last three years must come under question. The bounties didn't exist because nobody was chasing them. And to chase them, you had to be actively trying to hurt people.

It's scary to me that people downplay this or claim it doesnt affect the game. Use your brains, people.

[Epidemik]

Not sure if this has been said yet, but heard that warren sapp said the snitch was Jeremy schockey.

https://twitter.com/#!/QBKILLA/status/182546899096715264

[Juggernaut]

I gave multiple examples in the original Saints thread. So did senser, iirc. I'll rehash a few here.

-Any time a QB is hit after the ball is released and the defender is aware the ball is gone. Happens multiple times every game, we've all seen it. QB throws the ball, defender KNOWS the ball is gone, but because the defender is within the two steps and knows he won't draw a penalty, he drives into the QB or gives him a hard shove into the ground. Totally legal, yet totally unnecessary and cheap.

Maybe unnecessary, but is a part of the mind game. I don't want to see an NFL where the only time a qb is on the ground is when he's sacked. The QB should know that he's able to get hit, just like any other player. If defenders are able to be blind sided and crack blocked, or even defensive players getting blocked out of nowhere on a sweep, a QB should manage getting a push once in a while.

You would also be very hard pressed to find a situation where you can tell the defender knew the qb didn't have the ball, and didn't get a penalty flag.

With the rest of your post, I agree with.

How would you differentiate between a "dirty" clean hit, and a clean hard hit? Is there such a thing, a clean hard hit?

Not sure if this has been said yet, but heard that warren sapp said the snitch was Jeremy schockey.

https://twitter.com/#!/QBKILLA/statu...46899096715264

I'd like to see who his sources are, looks like Shockey's saying its not him.

@QBKILLA @elnicastro my ass!! I don't even play defense! Haha

[RosettaStoned]

The bounties didn't exist because nobody was chasing them. And to chase them, you had to be actively trying to hurt people.

Well said.

[shag773]

I gave multiple examples in the original Saints thread. So did senser, iirc. I'll rehash a few here.

-Any time a QB is hit after the ball is released and the defender is aware the ball is gone. Happens multiple times every game, we've all seen it. QB throws the ball, defender KNOWS the ball is gone, but because the defender is within the two steps and knows he won't draw a penalty, he drives into the QB or gives him a hard shove into the ground. Totally legal, yet totally unnecessary and cheap.

You don't see where a $10,000 bounty being on the table could lead to defenders going a little bit further than they might normally go on a hit like this?

Going a bit further from what is allowable in the rules would make it illegal, wouldn't it? Plus, the plays you described get flagged 9.5 times out of 10. Therefore, a poor example of a clean, dirty hit.

-Anything at or below the knee, in the open field where a basic, normal, form tackle would be sufficient. Lunging at the knees is bush, but in many cases, totally legal.

Quarterbacks are protected from these sort of hits which again would subject them to fines that would be way more than any bounty offered in a locker room.

Again, with a bounty on the table, you can't see where a 22 year old retard who would be flipping burgers if not for his football ability, would be tempted to take a shot at the knees, as opposed to keeping it clean?

So you think NFL players need a bounty program to incite them to go after other players? The only thing this changes is the actual cash transaction. Don't be so naive.

I can go on, but you get the point. If you honestly don't see how a bounty changes how the game is played or effects what's happening on the field, this is pointless. It's just stunning to me that functioning adults can't see where any tackle the Saints have made over the last three years must come under question. The bounties didn't exist because nobody was chasing them. And to chase them, you had to be actively trying to hurt people.

It's scary to me that people downplay this or claim it doesnt affect the game. Use your brains, people.

It's a violent game. The defense is always going to set their sights on key members of the offense. If you really buy into the fact that NFL players are not trained to hurt anybody, and just make "good, solid football plays", than I'm not sure what else to say.

Again, I think bounties are stupid. I just don't find it as deplorable as you do.

[RosettaStoned]

Shag... You're being a retard.

[shag773]

Shag... You're being a retard.

Good point...

[Tailback U]

Shag go through 15 pages of the Saints bounty program thread because everything you're trying to say has already been said.

Dont waste your time.

[shag773]

Shag go through 15 pages of the Saints bounty program thread because everything you're trying to say has already been said.

Dont waste your time.

Yeah I glanced over it. Didn't post because honestly this story really didn't interest me until I saw this punishment. I think the everybody's getting sick of talking about. I'll just say I respect everyone's position but respectfully disagree with the punishment.