Sean Payton Suspended 1 Year, Saints Lose Pair of 2nd Round Picks

[Tailback U]

LOL I find that text image picture hard to believe.

Do you think Shockey has all his coaches in his phone as "Coach Payton," "Coach Coughlin," "Coach Coker"? Like he's some little kid? Probably since that guy is a fucking idiot.

And does Sean Payton only end sentences with exclamation points? Is he that excited all the time? He's not Jon Gruden for fucks fake.

[Epidemik]

LOL I find that text image picture hard to believe.

Do you think Shockey has all his coaches in his phone as "Coach Payton," "Coach Coughlin," "Coach Coker"? Like he's some little kid? Probably since that guy is a fucking idiot.

And does Sean Payton only end sentences with exclamation points? Is he that excited all the time? He's not Jon Gruden for fucks fake.

https://twitter.com/#!/JeremyShockey/status/182874403971928064

[Cornelius]

I'm pretty tired of the disingenuous "oh they were trying to hurt people" bullshit in both of these threads. Some of the dirtiest players in league history lined up with the sole purpose of hurting the other guy. Steve Wisniewski, Bill Romanowski, Chuck Cecil, Charles Martin. They put on the pads to hurt people and I'm sure many others today do too. The only "bounty program" they were in was the NFL contract they signed.

A legal dirty play is the dumbest thing I've ever heard in the context of a sports discussion. Hitting the guy on purpose within the two step rule? Ok, if that's bad, change the fuckin rule then. Goodell wouldn't know what was good for the league if it hit him in the face with a baseball bat.

Devastating injuries are part of the game. I'm sure Warner2Bruce was totally devastated when Trent Green went down with a knee injury to be replaced by some unknown named Kurt Warner. Without that injury. Warner2Bruce might be Green2Bruce or better yet, WarnerNeverWas2Bruce.

[LiquidLarry2GhostWF]

I gave multiple examples in the original Saints thread. So did senser, iirc. I'll rehash a few here.

-Any time a QB is hit after the ball is released and the defender is aware the ball is gone. Happens multiple times every game, we've all seen it. QB throws the ball, defender KNOWS the ball is gone, but because the defender is within the two steps and knows he won't draw a penalty, he drives into the QB or gives him a hard shove into the ground. Totally legal, yet totally unnecessary and cheap.

The definition of "dirty" is being used really loosely here to include unnecessary and cheap.

Can't say that I agree...the defender laying it in to the QB is apart of the strategy of the game. Get into his head. Knock him around a little bit. Make him uneasy to step up into the pocket or hold on to the ball too long. There isn't an intention to injure or deliver a "cheap shot" its to get into the QBs head and they aren't meaning harm to ill will, but it is apart of the game. Same with looking to separate a player from the football over the middle...not only does it break up a play, but it sends a message to the wide out to NOT come over the middle like that again. It is apart of the psychology of the game.

You don't see where a $10,000 bounty being on the table could lead to defenders going a little bit further than they might normally go on a hit like this?

The 10K bounty was done with the intent to maim a player. I see the point you are trying to make, however, you need to separate real intent, and being a little rough with quarterbacks or other offensive players isn't the same as attempting to maim.

-Anything at or below the knee, in the open field where a basic, normal, form tackle would be sufficient. Lunging at the knees is bush, but in many cases, totally legal.

Again, with a bounty on the table, you can't see where a 22 year old retard who would be flipping burgers if not for his football ability, would be tempted to take a shot at the knees, as opposed to keeping it clean?

It happens with or without a 10K bounty on someone's head.

With the extended rules allowing for wide open offenses, defenses are combating it by doing X, Y, and Z. The game has always had the players one step ahead of rules...Deacon Jones head slap, corners abusing wide outs in the 80's, the wild shenanigans that go on at the bottom of a pile during a fumble, guys fucking with each other like untying their shoes or laying on top of them.

However, its about intent. Some of the Saints players obviously came at other players with bad intentions and not just within the spirit of the game, but with intent to maim and take a man's livelihood away from them. However, separating A from B isn't a call you can make by watching game film.

[Warner2BruceTD]

However, its about intent. Some of the Saints players obviously came at other players with bad intentions and not just within the spirit of the game, but with intent to maim and take a man's livelihood away from them. However, separating A from B isn't a call you can make by watching game film.

Exactly.

Which is why people who keep making the argument of "show me the dirty hits" are lost and have no clue.

There was a bounty program in place. That is a fact. It was obviously a program that ran deep enough and was serious enough in scope for the Saints to cover it up. Another fact. Players were clearly pursuing the bounties, otherwise the program would not have existed.

With all of that said, every hit the Saints have made for three years MUST come into question.

The inability of some to separate the idea of 'it's a tough game! they hit hard anyway!', from the idea that accepting money for injuring other players (the term the Saints used was "cart offs", for fucks sake) is baffling. And the idea that players chasing bounties didn't approach the game or approach making hits differently is flat out retarded.

[LiquidLarry2GhostWF]

Exactly.

Which is why people who keep making the argument of "show me the dirty hits" are lost and have no clue.

There was a bounty program in place. That is a fact. It was obviously a program that ran deep enough and was serious enough in scope for the Saints to cover it up. Another fact. Players were clearly pursuing the bounties, otherwise the program would not have existed.

With all of that said, every hit the Saints have made for three years MUST come into question.

The inability of some to separate the idea of 'it's a tough game! they hit hard anyway!', from the idea that accepting money for injuring other players (the term the Saints used was "cart offs", for fucks sake) is baffling. And the idea that players chasing bounties didn't approach the game or approach making hits differently is flat out retarded.

Oh, in regard to the Saints...just the simple fact that 10K was on the line to maim Brett Favre, I know the Saints defensive player's intent...its common sense...I don't even need to see a hit-by-hit breakdown...I'm not Roger Goddell or a court of law...I can use common sense and draw a conclusion without needing to present evidence because I'm about ready to take 7M from a man and upward of 25M away from a group of men for said bounty program (you know, so I'd have to provide evidence and statements to prove said fines are legal in a potential court of law)...of which, RG and the NFL provided that...why do we need that information here?

We on the internet call this attempt by said posters as "re-hash trolling".

[Warner2BruceTD]

Oh, in regard to the Saints...just the simple fact that 10K was on the line to maim Brett Favre, I know the Saints defensive player's intent...its common sense...I don't even need to see a hit-by-hit breakdown...I'm not Roger Goddell or a court of law...I can use common sense and draw a conclusion without needing to present evidence because I'm about ready to take 7M from a man and upward of 25M away from a group of men for said bounty program (you know, so I'd have to provide evidence and statements to prove said fines are legal in a potential court of law)...of which, RG and the NFL provided that...why do we need that information here?

We on the internet call this attempt by said posters as "re-hash trolling".

No, you would think it's common sense, but according to the likes of zoneblitz, bucky, and others, the bounties meant nothing in terms of intent or provided any extra incentive to injure. Which is obviously mental.

[LiquidLarry2GhostWF]

No, you would think it's common sense, but according to the likes of zoneblitz, bucky, and others, the bounties meant nothing in terms of intent or provided any extra incentive to injure. Which is obviously mental.

It is silly. Roger Goddell and the NFL already provided evidence to those that matter to make such a ruling...

But, zoneblitz and bucky would like for us to post youtube videos just to prove it to them.



Scott Fujita and Anthony Hargrave might as well be called Karl Anderson and Gigante Bernard.

[shag773]

No, you would think it's common sense, but according to the likes of zoneblitz, bucky, and others, the bounties meant nothing in terms of intent or provided any extra incentive to injure. Which is obviously mental.

You, FT, Senser, and some other posters have had some pretty strong words for the Saints organization, and I can respect your stances.

But let me give you this scenario. Let's say the the government gets involved and does a massive, thorough investigation into all 32 NFL teams. At the end of the investigation, they find that every NFL team in the league has some sort of bounty system at certain points in the last 5 seasons.

How do you react? Do you attack the NFL with the same veracity you attacked the Saints?

Do you stop watching football all together?

[Senser81]

You, FT, Senser, and some other posters have had some pretty strong words for the Saints organization, and I can respect your stances.

But let me give you this scenario. Let's say the the government gets involved and does a massive, thorough investigation into all 32 NFL teams. At the end of the investigation, they find that every NFL team in the league has some sort of bounty system at certain points in the last 5 seasons.

How do you react? Do you attack the NFL with the same veracity you attacked the Saints?

Do you stop watching football all together?

This thread has gone full retard. So now you go from disbelieving a bounty program's existence, to disregarding its effect on the players (?????...which still in my mind makes the LEAST sense, because if the bounty program had no effect on player behavior, why bother having one in the first place?), to now rolling out a scenario in which every team in the NFL has a bounty program!!

What ever happened to "discussing the issue at hand"?

[FirstTimer]

Do you attack the NFL with the same veracity you attacked the Saints?

Yes.

Any other stupud questions/scenarios?

[Liquidrob]

The UFC runs a bounty program every card

KO, Sub and FOTN is all extra incentive to hurt and injure

You break a dudes arm instead of a regular tap you will probably get the extra 60k, you drop a guy cold and come down with a crazy hard follow up shot you will probably get the KO of night and the extra money

They already have there show money, a set win amount, so why do they need 'bonus' money for trying to break limbs and land extra shots?

SHUT THE UFC DOWN

[Maynard]

i think this whole bounty thing is a joke. who cares if the saints used a bounty program. are long as they are not doing anything that is against the rule when trying to take out players, then who cares. Its what they are paid to do anyways.

the saints, with a bounty program....are they any different than any other team that doesnt have a bounty program? no...all teams are looking to kill the QB...all teams are looking to destroy the offense...all teams are looking to take out the offenses best players.

[EmpireWF]

i think this whole bounty thing is a joke. who cares if the saints used a bounty program. are long as they are not doing anything that is against the rule when trying to take out players, then who cares. Its what they are paid to do anyways.

Of course it's against the rule. That's why the league was pissed at them to begin with. Then they were even more pissed after they told the Saints to quit it, they lied to them and tried to cover it up.

[Maynard]

Of course it's against the rule. That's why the league was pissed at them to begin with. Then they were even more pissed after they told the Saints to quit it, they lied to them and tried to cover it up.

dude...u should just stop posting. do you ever read anything?