Fireman Ed Steps Away

[JimLeavy59]

Lance Armstrong is the biggest fraud in sports history.

[MrBill]

Lance Armstrong is the biggest fraud in sports history.

Not sure that I agree with that either seeing as how even though he was doping, everyone else in cycling is doping. So he still beat every other cyclist in the tour 7 times on a level albeit drug enhanced playing field.

[JimLeavy59]

Not sure that I agree with that either seeing as how even though he was doping, everyone else in cycling is doping. So he still beat every other cyclist in the tour 7 times on a level albeit drug enhanced playing field.

The thing that hurt Armstrong was this whole persona he tried building up and the constant denial.

[KINGOFOOTBALL]

Did this really just turn into an Armstrong convo ?

Lol jet fans..didn't a jet throw a giant snowball into the stands once ? Or was that in n.e ?

[DJ Fog]

Anyone I've talked to that's met the guy say he's a complete douche bag anyway who acts as if he's a big shot for his fandom. Who the fuck cares.

[Goober]

Clemens using steroids and/or growth hormone = fraud, buddy.

And there's no way Clemens is getting into the HOF...at least not while he's breathing.

Why does this make him a fraud? Everyone was doing it, and he was still light years ahead of the competition. No proof that steroids make a difference anyways.

Not making the HOF? Fuck that noise.

[EmpireWF]

Why does this make him a fraud? Everyone was doing it, and he was still light years ahead of the competition. No proof that steroids make a difference anyways.

Not making the HOF? Fuck that noise.

If you use the argument that majority of players from that generation were using, okay. Make a PED wing or whatever in the HOF and put these guys in.

But when Clemens goes around insisting he never used, that makes him a fraud.

As for him getting into the HOF as the writers stand now, not gonna happen. Hell, Bonds isn't getting in and they'll definitely make ARod wait. There are arguments for both sides, but I'm of the belief that HOFs should tell the story of the sport through the best players. Don't hide the PED stuff, talk about how it plagued the sport.

Keeping Rose, Bonds, Clemens, ARod from the HOF for their transgressions is just denying the inevitable and backwards

[Cornelius]

Who knew that a Fireman Ed thread could be so entertaining? This thread is awesome. I have to say that I think this guy isn't alone and that video that was posted of Jets "fans" shouting down their team is proof positive of my thoughts. You see it on Youtube from that douchebag who "gives up" on the Browns to some Dallas Cowboy fan ripping Dez Bryant. Fans want to be associated with their team in any way that can give them part of the glory that NFL teams and players have. It's fucking pathetic. They aren't talented enough to coach or play, so they think that cheering counts as some sort of accomplishment. That they can pay a ticket price, so that entitles them to make giant asses of themselves and let the team/anyone else around know about their opinion of anything.

I went to a Niners/Cardinals game last year in San Francisco. It was a complete blowout and I didn't really give a shit about either team, tickets were free. The person I was with was a New York Giants fan. We were laughing at the stupidity of fans. And not to pick on Niners fans, fans like this are EVERYWHERE. One of the Niners receivers, I think it was Crabtree, had a pass thrown out in front of him. He didn't make the catch. The guy in front of me put his arms out as if telling Crabtree from his seat how he should reach for the ball. All I could think was, "that guy has been playing football forever and coached on many levels, he needs some nobody from row 400 to tell him how to reach for the ball". I love football and I am passionate about watching it, but I can't believe some of the people I know who get physically ill if their team loses. Fans are fucking weird.

[dave]

Clemens using steroids and/or growth hormone = fraud, buddy.

And there's no way Clemens is getting into the HOF...at least not while he's breathing.

Barry Bonds and Roger Clemens were Hall of Famers long before they ever touched an illegal substance. I despise Clemens, but he's a legit HOFer. Same deal for Bonds.
These are guys made in HOFers like McGwire and Sosa. They were HOFers long before they ever touched a drug.

I am not condoning what they did ... but simply taking the substance shouldn't eliminate them. I would include Alex Rodriguez in that group. Like him or hate him, he's a legit HOFer.

For that matter, so is Pete Rose. But I guess that ship has sailed.

[EmpireWF]

Barry Bonds and Roger Clemens were Hall of Famers long before they ever touched an illegal substance. I despise Clemens, but he's a legit HOFer. Same deal for Bonds.
These are guys made in HOFers like McGwire and Sosa. They were HOFers long before they ever touched a drug.

I am not condoning what they did ... but simply taking the substance shouldn't eliminate them. I would include Alex Rodriguez in that group. Like him or hate him, he's a legit HOFer.

For that matter, so is Pete Rose. But I guess that ship has sailed.

I'll give you the names except for McGwire and Sosa. Their significant success came directly because of the drugs they put in their body.

McGwire on a personal level is the biggest scumbag of the bunch...ducked out of the light when his body went to shit and when he wanted a job, and only then did he return for the cameras, shed some crocodile tears and that cushy job under LaRussa (the manager of the roid monkeys in Oakland decades ago).

[dave]

I worded that wrong.

IMO, McGwire and Sosa were never, ever HOFers. Only drugs got them in the talk. Clemens, Bonds, A-Rod were legit HOFers long before they ever touched an illegal drug ... and I despise all three.

And while I agree betting on your sport is obviously wrong, Pete Rose is a first-ballot Hall of Famer. Ty Cobb was a much bigger scumbag ... but also a first-ballot HOFer.

[chicubs2003]

Lance Armstrong is the biggest fraud in sports history.

Barry Bonds...Roger Clemens?...

Lance Armstrong still gives alot of people hope because he beat cancer

[EmpireWF]

Lance Armstrong still gives alot of people hope because he beat cancer

That's swell and all....but he still cheated to win which stains his survival story.

Because take away his cycling success, the public doesn't care about Lance Armstrong.

[dave]

Barry Bonds...Roger Clemens?...

Lance Armstrong still gives alot of people hope because he beat cancer

This is why I think Lance Armstrong is a bigger fraud than Bonds or Clemens.

My grandpa died of brain cancer. It's a topic that hits home.

IMO, Lance Armstrong used his cancer diagnosis as a way to mask his clear scumbag ways. I honestly congratulate him for beating cancer, and thank him for raising money to help beat the disease ... but he clearly was always using it as a way for him not being a disgraceful liar and a guy who would destroy other people's lives to protect his lies.

All Armstrong had to do was say "Yeah, I did it ... everyone else on the Tour did it. I had to do it to compete. I apologize."

In 20 years, no one will care about A-Rod or Andy Pettite. Armstrong will still be a scumbag liar. And dig deeper into the Armstrong story, chicubs2003, this guy didn't just lie ... he did everything in his power to destroy the lives of people who told the truth.

Again, my grandpa lost his life to brain cancer. I am not speaking as a fan or non-fan here.

[chicubs2003]

That's swell and all....but he still cheated to win which stains his survival story.

Because take away his cycling success, the public doesn't care about Lance Armstrong.

Thats why Bonds and Clemens are bigger frauds, nobody cares about cycling

This is why I think Lance Armstrong is a bigger fraud than Bonds or Clemens.

My grandpa died of brain cancer. It's a topic that hits home.

IMO, Lance Armstrong used his cancer diagnosis as a way to mask his clear scumbag ways. I honestly congratulate him for beating cancer, and thank him for raising money to help beat the disease ... but he clearly was always using it as a way for him not being a disgraceful liar and a guy who would destroy other people's lives to protect his lies.

All Armstrong had to do was say "Yeah, I did it ... everyone else on the Tour did it. I had to do it to compete. I apologize."

In 20 years, no one will care about A-Rod or Andy Pettite. Armstrong will still be a scumbag liar. And dig deeper into the Armstrong story, chicubs2003, this guy didn't just lie ... he did everything in his power to destroy the lives of people who told the truth.

Again, my grandpa lost his life to brain cancer. I am not speaking as a fan or non-fan here.

Yeah i see what ur saying, i havent really read too much into lance armstrongs story..
But your right he will never admit it and would throw anyone under the bus thats in his way...

Not too many athletes tho will say what Melky Cabrea did