Why does Overeem catch so much heat?

[Liquidrob]

Is it because he doesnt fight in the US that much?

Guys like Brock, Carwin, Duffee, Lashely, etc...are all as big if not bigger than Alistair, NFL athletes are monsters and make some of these MMA fighters look small and are greater overall athletes for there size, just because these guys can pass tests in the US doesnt make them better than Overeem who has chosen to fight in Japan and compete in K-1

He passed a test in 2006 and 2 of them in 2007, in Cali twice which is the toughest of all of the commisions

He used to fight at 205, his walking around weight was probably around 225 to 230, guys like forrest always cut that much if not more, Overeem always had cardio issues, those big cuts didnt help help at 205

Now he is in the 247-252 range, Overeem weighed 230 against Paul in 2007 and passed, he was 27 years old, in his athletic prime, its not crazy to think he can go from 230 to 250 in a couple years

Once Alistair comes to the US to fight in Feb and passes, will he get the same treatment as the US MMA fighters?

[Liquidrob]

Looks like your average NFL player

[SHOGUN]

He's not in the UFC, thus not putting everyone's thoughts to rest about PEDs since NSAC has such a 'strict' testing.

He fights in Japan/overseas more than people like, and everyone thinks that non-US MMA events are roided out circuses.

He started off at 205 in PRIDE and people forget that he had to cut a lot of weight to make it at weight, so it's odd for people to see him closer to his 'natural' size.

He's been getting bigger year after year at a high, albeit reasonable* (if everything checks out), rate the last couple of years.

He displays Neanderthal-like physical characteristics that can be attributed to use of steroids, according to some, but I don't know about PEDs too much.

I don't think he'll get a pass because he'll still fight in Japan several times a year.

[CrimsonGhost56]

it is cause he barely fights in the US. fighting in K-1 is fine and dandy but the majority of MMA fans, especially in America, dont really care about K-1 so he might as well not be fighting at all. now when he does fight MMA its against the walking glass jaw known as James Thompson. i think people are really intrigued by Overeem and want to see him fight (in MMA) but he seems content to stay over in Japan and fight in K-1. hopefully once the new year comes around he'll have something set up for here in America. After Fedor zulu's Rogers, Overeem has to be next in line.

[Warner2BruceTD]

Once Alistair comes to the US to fight in Feb and passes, will he get the same treatment as the US MMA fighters?

Yes.

I will then admit that he knows how to beat a test like everyone else.

Until then, he's afraid to fight because he fears the suspension.

[Bigpapa42]

[Liquidrob]

Yes.

I will then admit that he knows how to beat a test like everyone else.

Until then, he's afraid to fight because he fears the suspension.

thats what I'm saying, I was trolling with the cutting and he can gain the weight angle

he is just like all the other guys that are in the sport, the difference is he hasnt had to pass a test in 2 years, so what, we know half these guys are on something but he doesnt have to bother with all the beating the test stuff the US fighters do

does it really matter?

[Bigpapa42]

Do I think Overeem like roids? Yes.
Do I think that factor might affect whether he fights in the US? Yes.
Do I think other fighters, even US-based ones who get tested, still roid? Yes.
Do I particularly care about them roiding? Not really.

With all the factors, it just seems so likely that Overeem is. The amount of muscle mass he has put on is questionable. The fact that he seems to be avoiding fighting in the US, when he has very good reason to fighting in the US, is questionable.

That said, I've basically stopped caring if guys might be on the juice. It used to be bug me a fair but, but I couldn't care less anymore.

[Liquidrob]

[Liquidrob]

from another poster on the UG

Here's all of Overeem's fights in the last two years or so -

Overeem vs Shogun - 2/24/2007 last fight at 205
Overeem vs Knapp - 6/23/2007 no weigh-in available
Overeem vs Buentello - 11/16/2007 224 http://mmajunkie.com/news/3184/stri...nt-pairings.mma
Overeem vs Lee Tae-Hyun - 6/15/2008 239 http://nightmareofbattle.wordpress....e-fourth-dream/
Overeem vs Hunt - 7/12/2008 no weigh-in available
Overeem vs Crocop - 9/23/2008 241 http://www.mmaconvert.com/2008/09/2...igh-in-results/
Overeem vs Goodridge - 11/09/2008 no weigh in available
Overeem vs Hari - 12/31/2008 253 http://www.fightline.com/news/2008/1230/377691.shtml
Overeem vs Bonjansky - 3/28/2009 no weigh in available
Overeem vs Aerts - 9/26/2009 no weigh in available
Overeem vs Sylvester - 10/17/2009 no weigh in available
Overeem vs Thompson - 10/25/09 253 http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2009/10/...eigh-in-results

So between 2/24/2007 and 11/16/2007, Overeem went from cutting to 205 to fighting at 224. If you assume that he was cutting from 215, that's only about a pound per month - a rate of growth that's not exceptional for a normal person bulking, let alone a full time athlete. And in fact Overeem has said that he was cutting a great deal of weight to get to 205, so he was probably much heavier than 215 - possibly as heavy as 224 already.

Between 11/16/2007 and 6/15/2008, Overeem went from 224 to 239. That's 15 pounds over the course of 7 months - 7 months during which he had no fights at all, and was free to focus on building quality mass while keeping up his training routine at maintenance. That's about two pounds a month - a decent rate of growth, but not exceptional at all for a professional athlete training full time.

Between 6/15/2008 and 9/23/2008, Overeem went from 239 to 241. Two pounds in three months - barely worth mentioning.

Between 9/23/2008 and 12/31/2008, Overeem went from 241 to 253. That's 12 pounds in 3 months - now we're getting into pretty quick growth territory. It is worth noting that Overeem looked substantially less lean against Hari - his face was puffy and a bit bloated, his abs were less visible, and in general he looked more "smooth" and less "cut". This could certainly be a symptom of steroid use, as many steroids cause you to retain water. It also could be that he bulked too fast in attempting to get heavier to match the 6'6" Hari, and put on a good bit of fat. Neither course of action would be surprising. It's also worth noting that Overeem only had half a training camp for this fight and weighed in fully-clothed with a wallet and cell phone in his pockets, so 253 is probably an inflated figure even though it's what the scale read.

Between 12/31/2008 and 10/25/2009, Overeem went from 253 to... 253. He looked leaner and less puffy against Thompson, so it appears he dropped some fat and replaced it with lean muscle, but again over the course of ten months this is hardly difficult or surprising.

CONCLUSIONS - The absolute fastest that Overeem gained weight was a three month period between the Crocop fight and the Hari fight. Even during that period he only gained four pounds per month, and the puffiness and smoothness he exhibited afterwards indicates that not all the weight he put on was muscle; a substantial amount was water and excess fat.

Certainly it's possible that Overeem has cycled PEDs, particularly during that particular three month period. But no sequence of his weight gain was impossible to achieve naturally, and the majority of it (2/24/2007 to 9/23/2008) was done at a rate that is actually very slow comparitive to how fast you can reasonably bulk without adding excess fat (by most estimates, around 2-3 pounds per month.)

Moreover, Overeem's weight has stayed stable for over ten months now, so the idea that he's avoiding fighting in the US due to drug testing concerns is not really credible - particularly when you look at fighters like Brock and Carwin, shorter than Overeem and significantly heavier, who have yet to fail a single drug test.

[KINGOFOOTBALL]

He catches flack because hes an underachiever.
He's blatant roider who doesnt wanna risk it in the U.S.
Hasnt been forced to defend his belt in eons.

The guys fun to watch and very talented but why am I going to focus on him with so many other guys fighting far more frequently ?

[Liquidrob]

He catches flack because hes an underachiever.
He's blatant roider who doesnt wanna risk it in the U.S.
Hasnt been forced to defend his belt in eons.

The guys fun to watch and very talented but why am I going to focus on him with so many other guys fighting far more frequently ?

you cant say he hasnt been fighting, he has fought 5 MMA fights in 2 years and 2 to 3 K-1 fights, he is actually busier than most guys in MMA

you can say in MMA he hasnt fought good comp, but he has been fighting and has been fighting elite level K-1 guys at the same time

[Kuzzy Powers]

LOL this is awesome. Pure roidage.

[Liquidrob]

LOL this is awesome. Pure roidage.

horse meat IMO

the transformation is almost complete

Overeem to Ubereem and finally he will be Megareem

[Kuzzy Powers]

horse meat IMO

the transformation is almost complete

Overeem to Ubereem and finally he will be Megareem

All-is-tar.. ROBOT IN DISGUISE!