Gunning for What? - The Arsenal Gunners Thread

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  • Bigpapa42
    Junior Member
    • Feb 2009
    • 3185

    Gunning for What? - The Arsenal Gunners Thread

    Pretty sure I'm the only Gooner around here that posts regularly, so this is a spot where I can come bitch about the side under-performing and Wenger refusing to spend money. A rant from the Champions League thread...

    This side is just utterly inconsistent. They can play at a really high level at times and then they can do just shite. Its hard to tell what you are going to get when.

    I still think it comes down to a lack of leadership on the pitch. Van Persie is a world class player but I don't know that he provides the kind of leadership a young side needs. He's also the only world class player in the side. Vermalaen is also supposed to be a leader but he just doesn't always seems to have that presence you expect a defensive leader and class center back to have. I see it there sometimes, but not that often.

    They lack real creativity in midfield. The kind of incisive, creative passing that Cesc provided. Or even Nasi at times. Its just not there. Wilshire should bring it, but when the fuck is he going to be back and how long will it take for him to find form? Arteta seemed to have that kind of creativity at Everton but its not there for Arsenal. Don't know if he's being asked to do different or what. Walcott is indeed Walcott. Ultra dangerous in a very very limited way and almost useless otherwise. None of the strikers outside of Van Persie are close to dangerous.

    I won't even guess what happened with the defense.

    Were the beaten before they stepped on the pitch? It sounds like they played that way. No excuse for that. Milan are class and it was always going to be tough, but even Leverkusen should at least a little bit of fight yesterday against Barcelona...

    It just pisses me off. Because the side doesn't measure up to what Arsenal had when they were winning titles. They had a couple of truly world class players and a squad full of talent who could legitimately walk into almost any side in the Prem. Now they've got a bunch of good-but-not-really-great players outside of RVP who clearly can't do it all himself. And quite simply, its Wenger's fault. He refuses to spend. As a supporter, it leaves me conflicted. I love that the club is one of the only fiscally responsible ones in the league and working to get rid of any outstanding debt, and that the current squad was built for far less money than any other top English side, except for maybe Sperz. I've always liked that. But Wenger has admitted he basically knew Fabregas and Nasri would leave in the summer, yet he refused to spend on quality players. If it wasn't for them getting eviscerated by United in late August, I doubt the likes of Arteta would have come in and they would have been in even worse shape. They have built expectations of Arsenal being a top four club and in Europe every season, but they aren't building a side to do that nor spending what it takes. So they are building a side that is maybe top half Prem caliber - at least they should be fucking honest about that.
  • Bigpapa42
    Junior Member
    • Feb 2009
    • 3185

    #2
    Interesting article from Ben Blackmore on ESPN Soccernet, highlighting the drop in the overall quality of Arsenal's squad. I can't really argue against any of the points. He brings up Parker, which is still a sore spot for me.

    For a split-second the ball was there, and then it was gone. Zlatan Ibrahimovic, perceived big-game choker but undoubted possessor of world-class talent, had tricked his way past Johan Djourou, 25-year-old "youngster" and former Birmingham City loanee. AC Milan were all set to complete their 4-0 Champions League drubbing of Arsenal, and every question mark over the increasingly under-fire Arsene Wenger was soon to be raised.

    Other than the most obvious: What was Djourou doing on the pitch in the first place?

    Djourou, of course, was not solely to blame for Arsenal's worst defeat in European competition. He was not even on the pitch for Milan's first two goals. Yet he embodies the lowering standard that Wenger has come to accept at Arsenal - and like a stone (Djourou most definitely isn't a rock) hitting water, it is a standard that is rippling through the rest of the squad.

    In the context of what happened at the San Siro on Wednesday, Djourou was only on the pitch due to a rash of defensive injuries to Per Mertesacker, Carl Jenkinson and - picked up in the match itself - Laurent Koscielny. But honest Arsenal fans will acknowledge he is one of many who should not be wearing the shirt at all.

    Neither, arguably, should the three names mentioned ahead of him.

    Djourou is a symbol in this article to represent the many names who are lucky to be playing for one of England's greatest clubs - Carl Jenkinson, Laurent Koscielny, Per Mertesacker, Andre Santos, Theo Walcott, Andrei Arshavin, Marouane Chamakh. An honest head says none of them have consistently shown they are capable of the form expected of past great Arsenal sides.

    Wenger, mocked as a nutty-looking professor when he arrived in England, once produced arguably the best footballing side to grace the Premier League - the famous Invincibles. The current crop, by comparison, must be dubbed the Unreliables. His mathematician's mind was once heralded for picking out footballing gems such as Patrick Vieira and Cesc Fabregas at bargain-basement prices, but nowadays most football fans would rather walk to White Hart Lane for Harry Redknapp's street-savvy approach.

    The dealings of the past 12 months are evidence enough that Redknapp could currently teach Wenger a thing or two. Scott Parker was so obviously needed at Arsenal that he may as well have been gift-wrapped with a one-way ticket to Holloway Road tube station, yet for a cool £5 million he is currently being hailed as the next England captain whilst in the white of Tottenham. Ryan Nelsen, who did not even cost a penny, is surely another who would walk into the Arsenal line-up.

    Wenger, over time, has allowed the standard to drop so low at Arsenal that players who were once derided as liabilities are now championed as their strongest assets. Koscielny is a prime example, a defender capable of solid performances such as the one against Manchester United, but equally prone to a gaffe. The mind only has to rewind to the 3-2 defeat at Swansea in January to recall how he allowed Danny Graham in for the winning goal. When he arrived at Arsenal it was obvious he was not the type of player to stand up and be counted when 1-0 up away at Fulham (another loss for Arsenal), yet Wenger's latest comments on the Frenchman lead one to believe that the Gunners have the next Laurent Blanc.

    "[We found him] in France of course, from a smaller team," he said. "You could see that there was something special there. I believe that last year you could already see the potential but he did not have that dominance in the duels that he has found this season. That makes him, I personally believe, one of the top-class central defenders in the Premier League."

    Acceptance of mediocrity is the path to exactly that, and it only takes a comparison to the last trophy-winning Arsenal side to prove it. How many of the current XI would have featured in that 2005 FA Cup win against Manchester United?

    Is Wojciech Szczesny better than Jens Lehmann? Temperament-wise perhaps. Are Kieran Gibbs or Santos superior to Ashley Cole? Only morally. What about Bacary Sagna - woefully exposed in Italy - compared to Lauren? Or Koscielny in relation to Kolo Toure? All answers, truthfully, are no. Only Vermaelen would step into that back five at the expense of Philippe Senderos.

    In midfield, do Alex Song, Aaron Ramsey or Mikel Arteta lace the same boots as Patrick Vieira, Gilberto Silva or Cesc Fabregas? That question is purely rhetorical.

    And are Walcott or Arshavin preferable to Jose Antonio Reyes or Robert Pires? Not on the form of the past six months. Only Robin van Persie qualifies for that 2005 team in the midfield or attacking positions, and even he would only make the bench behind Dennis Bergkamp and Thierry Henry (the final was even won without Henry's services). That totals a grand number of two current players good enough for the side Wenger built seven years ago, with Jack Wilshere a promising up-and-comer.


    GettyImages
    The Arsenal midfield is a pale imitation of those in Arsene Wenger's best sidesAs a result, the likes of Koscielny, Song and Arteta have become recognised as Arsenal's better players, the bar lowered deep enough for such players to raise their heads slightly above the mediocrity around them.

    A mathematical mind Wenger does indeed possess, after all, he boasts a degree in economics, yet when it comes to the simple maths of football his sums do not add up. Summer outgoings: Fabregas, Samir Nasri and Gael Clichy. Replacements: Arteta, Yossi Benayoun and Santos. Three top-drawer players replaced by three players significantly less talent. Replace Heinz Tomato Ketchup with a low-budget alternative and what do you expect?

    In Wenger's defence, he had no choice with the players he lost, but according to his board and all noises coming out of Arsenal, he most certainly had the money to replace them. "There have been suggestions that we keep stopping him from buying," chairman Peter Hill-Wood stated earlier in the season. "That is not the case."

    Player for player, Arsenal have two or three at most who would challenge for a spot in the Manchester United, Manchester City and Tottenham XIs (yes, none of them are currently in the Champions League, but it's a hollow point): Van Persie, Wilshere and Vermaelen (the latter is generous). Simple maths says that statistic must change if Arsenal are to stop their slide from the country's best.

    The club, the manager and the fans can defend the likes of Koscielny, Song and Djourou as strongly as they want - the loyalty is to be admired. But how often do these players return the favour by fighting for the reputation of the club? And how long, given current circumstances, until Wenger is heard championing the importance of the Europa League - another lowering of the standards?

    Comment

    • Bigpapa42
      Junior Member
      • Feb 2009
      • 3185

      #3
      So it looks like Arsenal are going to follow up their Champions League shit-show by bowing out of the FA Cup to Sunderland. Great work, Gunners. Great work.

      On the upside, at least Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain got another goal.

      Comment

      • 1ke
        D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F
        • Mar 2009
        • 6641

        #4
        Tough times right now. Im no fan of LeArse, but I dont hate them and havent hated them in a while because AW has led them to not contend for titles lately.

        They have been hard to watch though. No confidence, and no real intentions to create offensively.

        Comment

        • Rudi
          #CyCueto
          • Nov 2008
          • 9905

          #5
          Arshavin off to Zenit on a loan.

          Comment

          • Bigpapa42
            Junior Member
            • Feb 2009
            • 3185

            #6
            Originally posted by Rudi
            Arshavin off to Zenit on a loan.
            Thank Christ. In a decade of following this club, I don't know if I've seen anyone who was as consistently harmful in their play, and indifferent at best.

            Comment

            • BigHouseUSA
              Late to the party.
              • Jun 2009
              • 4907

              #7
              His fall has been amazing. He was magnificent the first few months at Arsenal, anticipated watching him more than pretty much anyone during that period. It just stopped without warning and he's been horrible ever since.
              Originally posted by mgoblue2290
              If you want to win, put Drew in.

              Comment

              • Rudi
                #CyCueto
                • Nov 2008
                • 9905

                #8
                lol

                Arshavins troubles started when Russia failed to make the world cup when they lost the second leg against Slovenia. The rumours are that the Russian team was drunk on the pitch because they already partied thinking they were through. Since then he's been a totally different player.

                Comment

                • 1ke
                  D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F
                  • Mar 2009
                  • 6641

                  #9
                  Hey LeArse. Thought youz guyz were dead? Guess not....

                  Comment

                  • Bigpapa42
                    Junior Member
                    • Feb 2009
                    • 3185

                    #10
                    Well that was unexpected. Honestly, its the kind of performance that confuses me more than anything. The side isn't utterly lacking in quality but don't play at a high level with much consistency. They still need to add some quality this summer if they want to stay in the top four...

                    Comment

                    • 1ke
                      D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F
                      • Mar 2009
                      • 6641

                      #11
                      Dont think I can think of a better weak foot finish that what your captain did for you today.

                      Comment

                      • Rudi
                        #CyCueto
                        • Nov 2008
                        • 9905

                        #12
                        RVP is so good.

                        Comment

                        • 1ke
                          D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F
                          • Mar 2009
                          • 6641

                          #13
                          Originally posted by Rudi
                          RVP is so good.
                          Lol REALLY? Ya dont say....

                          Comment

                          • Bigpapa42
                            Junior Member
                            • Feb 2009
                            • 3185

                            #14
                            Watching the match now so haven't got to that point. Know the result already. I PVR'd the match and if they got worked, I probably wouldn't bother watching.

                            Arsenal don't look sharp at all, at least through the first half. Koscielny is a fucking menace and I'm not sure he's a Prem-caliber defender at all. Arteta was poor. Walcott was Walcott (means he did fuck all). Its more than a surprise to get a result out of this match

                            Comment

                            • 1ke
                              D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F
                              • Mar 2009
                              • 6641

                              #15
                              BP, You went to the game???

                              Comment

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