Jordan: 'I could have scored 100 points' in today's NBA

[ralaw]

Like Larry Bird said, the league could use a few more white superstars to bring in more white fans. It was true in Bird's time, and it's true now. In his autobiography Giant Steps, Kareem said it's easier for a white kid to relate to Bird than Magic. You need white players on Bird's level(or close to it) to market a predominately black league to suburban whites. Every group roots for its own. It may not be PC to say it(and its a sad commentary on the human race) but it's true.

I'm not sure that's entirely true, because the majority of fans at the games are white people. Black people support the league, but white people support the league while spending money. Don't get me wrong a really good white American born player would do great for the league, but the NBA hasn't seen one of them since Bird.

In sports I don't think white people have a problem with rooting for black people as much as they get tired of the culture that most of these young black stars associate themselves with. This brings up some interesting social topic of decisions for blacks that involve double consciousness.

 

[KINGOFOOTBALL]

In sports I don't think white people have a problem with rooting for black people as much as they get tired of the culture that most of these young black stars associate themselves with.

Again..this.

Hip hop culture scared away alot of fans. Especially with so many of these H.S kids coming in still stuck in there cornrows and tats "nah wah im sayin swag" filling the league. A bunch of immature kids holding on way too strong and trying WAY too hard to associate themselves with rappers.

The Iverson situation was a tough one for the league. The Pacer brawl cemented the view for alot of fans what the league had become.

 

[A Tasty Burgerr]

I think you are approaching this argument all wrong.

If you want to say the players now are more skilled, I think that's fair. But there is no way the benches are deeper now. Teams routinely ran 9 or 10 deep 20 years ago with good, useful players. Now, benches are littered with expansion bums and roster spots are used on under developed euros & underclassmen. The league doesn't even have 15 starting C's anymore, let alone viable backup 5's. Teams just play whatever 6'8" stiff they have hanging around who's too slow to guard a F.

I honestly have very little idea what you're talking about with this. The vast majority of teams in the league have at least 9 players in their rotation that are valid contributors, not "whatever 6'8" stiffs" or "expansion bums" whatever that means.

 

[Warner2BruceTD]

I honestly have very little idea what you're talking about with this. The vast majority of teams in the league have at least 9 players in their rotation that are valid contributors, not "whatever 6'8" stiffs" or "expansion bums" whatever that means.

I didn't say teams aren't playing 9 guys, I'm saying most teams aren't playing 9 quality guys. The league is too thin due to too many teams. Especially compared to the rosters 20 or 25 years ago. You would struggle to find 15 legitimate starting C's today. A lot of teams just throw slow PF's out there....whatever 6'8" stiffs they have eating a paycheck (see Dampier, Eric or Curry, Eddy). Good luck finding decent backups.

 

[A Tasty Burgerr]

I didn't say teams aren't playing 9 guys, I'm saying most teams aren't playing 9 quality guys. The league is too thin due to too many teams. Especially compared to the rosters 20 or 25 years ago. You would struggle to find 15 legitimate starting C's today. A lot of teams just throw slow PF's out there....whatever 6'8" stiffs they have eating a paycheck (see Dampier, Eric or Curry, Eddy). Good luck finding decent backups.

In the past 20 years there have been 3 new teams, and only 1 team in the past 15 years. I really don't think having more teams really is a factor to any lack of quality players that you see.

I don't know what your basing your judgment about benches not being as good now, I've never really heard that before and haven't really seen any evidence of it. Virtually every relevant team has a quality 9-man rotation. Eric Dampier is not even signed and Eddy Curry is not going to contribute to any team.

I'll agree that the overall quality of starting centers is not at the leavel it once was, the nature of the game has changed to a point that successful inside scorers now often rely more on athleticism rather than having skilled post games. Centers are drafted and developed to be defensive stoppers and rebounders much, much more often than they are to be scorers.

 

[Warner2BruceTD]

Let's look at the Atlanta Hawks franchise.

The 2009 Hawks won 50 something games and won a playoff round. The past few years, most observers felt the Hawks could win around 50 games, maybe win a playoff round or two, but never seriously contend for a championship. In this regard, they are very similar to the 80's Dominique Wilikins Hawks teams. Again, good teams that won a lot of games, but not good enough to get past the elite Eastern teams like Boston.

The 2009 Hawks essentially went 6 deep - the starting 5, plus arguably the best 6th man in the league in Jamal Crawford. Beyond that, trash. Nobody else on the team averaged 20 minutes, and the 7th and 8th men were fringe player Maurice Evans and washout Joe Smith. The entire bench (not counting Crawford) barely matched the scoring average of Joe Johnson (21.3 ppg).

Now let's look at the 1986-87 Hawks, who won 57 games and also lost in the second round.

Cliff Levingston was the 6th man. Not as good as Jamal Crawford, in fact, not even close. But look at the rest of the bench...Spud Webb, Jon Koncak, John Battle, Mike McGee...shit, Antoine Carr, a pretty good player who had a nice career, was the 10th or 11th guy on that team. Gus Williams, who averaged 20+ points in his prime, but granted was at the tail end of a very good career, couldn't even get off the pine.

There were 23 teams in the NBA in 1986. Fast forward that team to today, and Antoine Carr & Spudd Webb are likely starting for another team.

Im not arguing that the players from the mid 80's were more skilled than today (although in some facets of the game I would). I am arguing that expansion, among other factors (such as teams drafting largely for potential and high ceiling when it comes to Euros/underclassman and bypassing guys who would have been solid role players decades ago) has thinned out rosters and weakened the depth of most teams. Of course you still have a couple of deep teams scattered around the league, but it's not the norm. And it's my opinion that over expansion has hurt the NBA far more than MLB, and more than the NFL too, aside from the QB position.

 

[Houston]

Ok so to clarify, did Jordan mean if he played at his current age or when he was younger?

:facepalm:

 

[Bear Pand]

Why is this a bad thing?

Aside from the fact that the Hawks seemingly just tried to iso and fastbreak constantly last year they were a quality team despite not having much depth. I'd also argue that they're one of the more exciting teams in the league. I just don't see what the downside of their short rotation is. Yeah they had no shot at a title, and this is partly due to their bench, but the NBA has always been this way. A few serious title contenders, then a bunch of teams that are just there for the sake of being there.

I think a better example is a team like Golden State.

I do agree with what you're saying about teams drafting based on potential and other bullshit. Best example to me is the Grizzles drafting Hasheem Thabeet which I'll never understand. A lot of the bad teams in the NBA are never able to compete because they make sure horrid draft decisions every year. Teams realize they need a superstar so they reach real hard hoping to strike gold I guess.

 

[jeffx]

In sports I don't think white people have a problem with rooting for black people as much as they get tired of the culture that most of these young black stars associate themselves with. This brings up some interesting social topic of decisions for blacks that involve double consciousness.

If some fans are tired of the culture that these young cats are into, they need to get over it. Not everyone can be Tim Duncan or Grant Hill. As long as these kids are doing the right thing on or off the court, I could care less about cornrows or tats(shit, I wear both myself). I just think some folks have an agenda with the NBA. I see plenty of NFL players wearing the same shit, but the NBA always gets a bad rap as being a 'thug' league. I hear it all the time from people I talk to.

 

[FedEx227]

It's alway been hypocritical. I use to try and fight it but it's not worth it. NFL player does something wrong it's passed off, if an NBA guy does something it's a thug league. You'll never win.

NBA guy pounds his chest after a score and he's being cocky and arrogant. An NFL guy makes a tackle dances around, fakes that he's tasing himself, it's not a big deal.

You'll never win, not worth the fight honestly.

I think some of it stems from the wear on the field of play as well. NFL players are in helmets and bigger jerseys, they are seen almost as gladiators or robots. NBA players are front and center, you see their faces, you see their tattoos, etc.

 

[mgoblue2290]

It's alway been hypocritical. I use to try and fight it but it's not worth it. NFL player does something wrong it's passed off, if an NBA guy does something it's a thug league. You'll never win.

NBA guy pounds his chest after a score and he's being cocky and arrogant. An NFL guy makes a tackle dances around, fakes that he's tasing himself, it's not a big deal.

You'll never win, not worth the fight honestly.

I think some of it stems from the wear on the field of play as well. NFL players are in helmets and bigger jerseys, they are seen almost as gladiators or robots. NBA players are front and center, you see their faces, you see their tattoos, etc.

Was just about to post this. I agree 100% percent and believe this is definitely the reason. Its much easier to associate a player with the team when everyone is dressed identically and they are more removed from fans. Football players are definitely seen more as gladiators than actual people, whereas basketball players are seen differently.

 

[Warner2BruceTD]

Was just about to post this. I agree 100% percent and believe this is definitely the reason. Its much easier to associate a player with the team when everyone is dressed identically and they are more removed from fans. Football players are definitely seen more as gladiators than actual people, whereas basketball players are seen differently.

Which is exactly why the NFL is 100% right when it comes to the Nazi-like uniform standards and other "No Fun League" rules that fans always bitch about. There is a method to the madness. Give these young, testosterone filled males an inch, they will take a yard. Uniforms would look like absolute shit if you gave the players any freedom to wear them however they like, and you'd be dealing with similar image issues as the NBA. Same with the celebration stuff. Players can't handle freedom, the endzone stuff was spiraling out of control a few years ago. That stuff eventually hurts a leagues image. You're a professional, and employee of the NFL, look and act like one.

Stern acted too late with the dress codes and other rules. The damage was done.

 

[FedEx227]

Not that any of you give a shit, but we're gonna talk this topic (Jordan scoring 100 and the differences between today's NBA and yesteryear's) pretty heavily on my show tonight.

 

[chazmaniandevil]

only one way to prove a point. lets see you suit up mj

 

[FedEx227]

Don't tempt him. He probably will.