The UFC will be embrassed 2 weekends in a row

[calgaryballer]

thats means nothing how it turned for Fedor and Hendo, the point is that Strikeforce signed guys the UFC wanted

you're grasping for something that isnt there

It means everything! If they had wanted Hendo, they would have had Hendo, just at an exorbinant price. If they had wanted to give Fedor everything he wanted, they'd have had him too.

 

[Liquidrob]

It means everything! If they had wanted Hendo, they would have had Hendo, just at an exorbinant price. If they had wanted to give Fedor everything he wanted, they'd have had him too.

No, they wanted both, they didnt get either, so your 'The UFC has money to scoop up most of the top fighters' statement is highly exaggerated

 

[calgaryballer]

No, they wanted both, they didnt get either, so your 'The UFC has money to scoop up most of the top fighters' statement is highly exaggerated

Having the money and using it wisely are two entirely differently things. Not sure why you can't understand that.

Hypothetical - Tim Sylvia beats some OK guys (as he has) on the indie circuit. Both the UFC and SF have some interest. He wants $500k/fight because Monte Cox is a moron. UFC passes, while SF ponies up. Is this an example of the UFC 'not getting a guy they want', or an example of spending their money wisely?

 

[Bigpapa42]

No, they wanted both, they didnt get either, so your 'The UFC has money to scoop up most of the top fighters' statement is highly exaggerated

Not at all, Rob. Unless you can provide some proof that the UFC actually could not afford to pay the contracts wanted by those two, then "choosing not to" is obviously not the same as "cannot".

Be logical. Less trollish.

 

[Liquidrob]

cb has gone off the deep end, you make statements than cant back them up or throw out lines that mean nothing as support

I deal in facts, not made up PPV buys, popularity contests, hype and branding, once you started talking UFC cast offs and 'the big show' you bascially have given up

 

[calgaryballer]

“I’m still hoping to come to terms with the UFC, until I heard this,” he said. “And I will be exploring other options for sure, but I definitely need to make sure I get paid.”

Henderson acknowledged a stalemate with the promotion since he became a free agent in early August. In late September, he met with White and UFC co-owner and CEO Lorenzo Fertitta in Las Vegas, but remained at a distance on the numbers needed to secure his future services.

Henderson, however, said he hasn’t made a final decision to leave the UFC and is still open to negotiations. His agent had talked with the promotion as recently as this week.

Hendo wanted to get paid. SF paid him what he wanted, the UFC passed. I don't think this at all an example of the UFC not having money.

 

[Liquidrob]

Not at all, Rob. Unless you can provide some proof that the UFC actually could not afford to pay the contracts wanted by those two, then "choosing not to" is obviously not the same as "cannot".

Be logical. Less trollish.

Like I said, I deal in facts, not stuff you guys think is facts

The UFC wanted Fedor and Dan Henderson, those are facts, that is not made up

Did the UFC get Dan Henderson and Fedor? No they did not, that is another fact

So to say they UFC gets who they want, or they have all this money to get who they want is false, because since Strikeforce got the Showtime deal they have gotten as many 'big names' as the UFC

CB made a statement he can not back up with facts, I am not trolling either

I love how the 'MMA fan' and I use that term lightly loves to worship who has the most money

 

[calgaryballer]

cb has gone off the deep end, you make statements than cant back them up or throw out lines that mean nothing as support

I deal in facts, not made up PPV buys, popularity contests, hype and branding, once you started talking UFC cast offs and 'the big show' you bascially have given up

If you could just type up a quick summary of the 'facts' you've provided, I'd appreciate that.

 

[calgaryballer]

Like I said, I deal in facts, not stuff you guys think is facts

The UFC wanted Fedor and Dan Henderson, those are facts, that is not made up

Did the UFC get Dan Henderson and Fedor? No they did not, that is another fact

So to say they UFC gets who they want, or they have all this money to get who they want is false, because since Strikeforce got the Showtime deal they have gotten as many 'big names' as the UFC

CB made a statement he can not back up with facts, I am not trolling either

I love how the 'MMA fan' and I use that term lightly loves to worship who has the most money

Any stat head will tell you 'correlation does not equal causation'. You are seeing 'SF got them, UFC didn't = SF must be best!'

You're ignoring the fact that SF came in to both the Fedor and Hendo negotiations after the UFC made their negotiating position clear. In business, there becomes a point that no matter how much you want an asset, you have to look at both the pros and cons. If Dana could have got Hendo at the $x he valued him at, then he'd be in the UFC still. Hendo valued himself at above that number, and as is his right, went to SF. Don't kid yourself, if Dana had ponied up, he'd still be in the UFC.

Dana also had first shot at Fedor, and there is probably a reason that both M-1 and Fedor continue to bring up the UFC.

 

[Liquidrob]

If you could just type up a quick summary of the 'facts' you've provided, I'd appreciate that.

um, do I have to type it again? seriously this is getting stupid

you said

And it has the money to scoop up most of the best fighters

I would assume that Fedor and Dan Henderson are some of those 'best fighters' who were free agents, I would assume Mousasi, Overeem, and other names I named already fit the bill

The UFC does not have them, Strikeforce does, I will also throw in guys like Alvarez who Bellator signed

Are these facts not good enough for you?

 

[EmpireWF]

Only reason Strikeforce gets most of those names mentioned is because they don't have exclusive contracts. If they did deal in exclusivity, then guys like Mousasi and Overeem would not be there. Even Alvarez is exclusive to Bellator now and how many SF fights did he end up having?

As for Hendo and Fedor.

Hendo got paid by SF. The UFC did not value him as much so they did not want to pay him.

Fedor would be in the UFC if not for the M-1 craziness.

I wish Strikeforce would increase their roster (find 135ers and 145ers, etc.) and # of shows but I doubt they can do that. Besides, they only have 4-5 fights per show make television and they don't even tape the preliminary fights.

 

[Bigpapa42]

I deal in facts, not made up PPV buys, popularity contests, hype and branding, once you started talking UFC cast offs and 'the big show' you bascially have given up

No, you clearly do not. You are asserting that by choosing not to pay what they felt was too much, the UFC therefore cannot afford to. Without any proof to back up that as fact. Unless you are going to try to point to the partial sale again (which W2B has already addressed). If you are going to blast others for "not using facts or proof", then the least you can do it try to follow that yourself.

 

[calgaryballer]

Since signing Mousasi, he's fought 3 times outside of SF. I think FEG signed him actually.

Since signing Overeem, he's fought 7 times outside of SF (in MMA only).

If a fighter signs a contract and never fights, did he really sign?

 

[Liquidrob]

Any stat head will tell you 'correlation does not equal causation'. You are seeing 'SF got them, UFC didn't = SF must be best!'

You're ignoring the fact that SF came in to both the Fedor and Hendo negotiations after the UFC made their negotiating position clear. In business, there becomes a point that no matter how much you want an asset, you have to look at both the pros and cons. If Dana could have got Hendo at the $x he valued him at, then he'd be in the UFC still. Hendo valued himself at above that number, and as is his right, went to SF. Don't kid yourself, if Dana had ponied up, he'd still be in the UFC.

Dana also had first shot at Fedor, and there is probably a reason that both M-1 and Fedor continue to bring up the UFC.

and like I said, your statement about the UFC's money doesnt mean much, if they dont use it, who gives a shit how much money they have, they prefer to keep fighters for cheap wages besides there top hype machines like Brock

Carwin main evented the BIGGEST HW FIGHT IN UFC HISTORY for 40k

Stop worshipping Zuffa's money, it doesnt help the MMA fan at all

 

[Liquidrob]

No, you clearly do not. You are asserting that by choosing not to pay what they felt was too much, the UFC therefore cannot afford to. Without any proof to back up that as fact. Unless you are going to try to point to the partial sale again (which W2B has already addressed). If you are going to blast others for "not using facts or proof", then the least you can do it try to follow that yourself.

I never, not once said the UFC couldnt afford them, please quote me if I have

Listen, I know you love CB and want to defend him for his busted arguement, but just relax and read what I posted

 

[calgaryballer]

I never, not once said the UFC couldnt afford them, please quote me if I have

Listen, I know you love CB and want to defend him for his busted arguement, but just relax and read what I posted

Rob, you are essentially congratulation SF for using their money stupidly

 

[Liquidrob]

This is what I said

Also another gross exaggeration of the famous ‘UFC money’ that gets passes around as fact

As is, that the UFC pays huge amounts of money to fighters and like CB said 'can scoop up most of the best fighters'

that would be wrong and I proved it with fighters who has not signed with the UFC who are some of the 'best fighters'

 

[Liquidrob]

Rob, you are essentially congratulation SF for using their money stupidly

How was is stupid? Is Strikeforce bankrupt like stations casinos yet?

Is Strikeforce going under any time soon? Did they cancel the January shows yet? Did they stop signing fighters?

OMG, Strikeforce is paying fighters to fight! Sound the alarm!

 

[EmpireWF]

If Rob could do what he says we should, ENJOY THE FIGHTS, he'd be so much cooler.

 

[calgaryballer]

One of your buddies has a car. He drives it for a while, and it does him good, giving him some good memories.

It comes time to get some repairs though, and the guy quotes him a huge number. He decides that while he likes the car, it's just not worth it.

Seeing this, you decide not only to buy the car and pay for the repairs, but to go over the odds.

Does this seem like a smart business decision? Especially when the first time you take it out for a spin it just sits there?

/terrible analogy