EA license with the NFLPA good for another few years

[buckeye]

http://www.metacritic.com/game/xbox-...5/user-reviews

XBOX 360:

65 Positive
11 Mixed
40 Negative

PS3:

22 Positive
12 Mixed
35 Negative

XB1:

42 Positive
6 Mixed
22 Negative

PS4:

41 Positive
11 Mixed
27 Negative

Small sample size, but you get the picture.

That means zero... there are several people that haven't played the game on that list... nice try though. Some of them are the same users under different accounts on the same IP. Metacritic knows this ;)



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[buckeye]

I apologize for going off the original topic and battling about opinions though. Facts only.

But you are correct... the NFL should hand the license over to a company that couldn't sell the game when they had it. Makes absolutely perfect sense.

;)

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[Primetime]

That means zero... there are several people that haven't played the game on that list... nice try though. Some of them are the same users under different accounts on the same IP. Metacritic knows this ;)



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And this can't be done with the "study" you mentioned? I'd like to see the study btw.

[Sven Draconian]

Uh... no you weren't Lol. They used to invite guys down from the community every year to test games. The ones who didn't get invited back that I'm aware of were the ones who went down and provided little feedback or provided positive feedback when they were there then when the game released said the exact opposite.

Several major members of the community lost the ability to attend after doing that. When site views and e-cred are more important than honesty then it defeats the purpose. Several of the guys at a major site did that back in 2010 I believe... not giving any names.

That is horseshit. It was a cool event, glad I got the opportunity to go (twice) and I'm not going say anything negative about it, but that statement is absurd.

[PP]

That is horseshit. It was a cool event, glad I got the opportunity to go (twice) and I'm not going say anything negative about it, but that statement is absurd.

Weird how Sven and Dave (both whom are upstanding individuals) are calling bullshit.

[Houston]

If I'm ever on trial for a crime that I actually committed, I'm appointing Buckeye as my lawyer. Even if all the evidence was stacked against me, he'd never rest.

[MrBill]

If I'm ever on trial for a crime that I actually committed, I'm appointing Buckeye as my lawyer. Even if all the evidence was stacked against me, he'd never rest.

I think it is more that perception is stacked against him, the facts are actually on his side.

[buckeye]

That is horseshit. It was a cool event, glad I got the opportunity to go (twice) and I'm not going say anything negative about it, but that statement is absurd.

Didn't say you did I? I said some....

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[buckeye]

I think it is more that perception is stacked against him, the facts are actually on his side.

Exactly... I'm the only one apparently not getting bent about it Lol. Doesn't matter to me either way what people think. They can hear the actual truth or they can create their own "truth". As long as I put it out there... that's all that matters to me.

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[buckeye]

Weird how Sven and Dave (both whom are upstanding individuals) are calling bullshit.

They can call what they want from their experience... they were there before it became what it is today. I can tell you there have been guys going down there (when I was there) that say one thing to the dev team...then go back and say something opposite when they get home. Those guys don't make it back.

As far as 2K fans that have made it down... only 3 that I have met are good honest dudes (Sim, Smitty, Azure) and they provide valuable feedback from a football standpoint. The "big names" in the 2K football community, are there to help gather hits on their channels and pull some seriously shady stuff after they leave. They aren't "champions of sim football" they are champions of lining their pockets.



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[dave]

They can call what they want from their experience... they were there before it became what it is today. I can tell you there have been guys going down there (when I was there) that say one thing to the dev team...then go back and say something opposite when they get home. Those guys don't make it back.

You know, there's probably some truth to that. I went to the event and I didn't rip these guys to shreds, because yes they were nice people and I know they work hard. So here I am at this event, thrilled to be there no doubt, and I admittedly had rose-coloured glasses on. After playing the retail game, I was thrilled to see things I suggested like (teams go for it on the 38 yard line ... they don't punt) still not working.
My biggest issue with Madden is not the developers, I know they work really hard and are nice guys. My issue is with a game that's been shipping with the same mistakes for years.
And, hell, the wind direction meter still not correct? Really? To me, that should be a simple fix. Adaptive AI almost worked in one year (the year playmakers had special symbols), then disappeared in the next. This game still screws up franchise stats incredibly, and for the life of me, will they ever get presentation or gang tackling? The commentary in this game would have been fine at the end of the PS2's life cycle, but now? On PS4/Xbox1?

And while I think next-gen Madden is a step up from current-gen, it's nothing Earth shattering. Frankly, it feels like a pretty port with slightly better AI. Honestly, and maybe I'm being unrealistic, but I think today's game on next-gen should have near-human AI tendencies. Maybe I'm being a bit unrealistic.

And a simple thing ... 8 weeks into the season, shouldn't Russell Wilson trot out with his current 2013-14 stats? Is it so difficult for Madden to bring an NBA2k Today element in?

[ThunderHorse]

? One company was gonna get the exclusive... EA got it. Take Two had a chance as well, NFL decided to go with EA... what went into that, no one knows. Take Two can still make football games without a license, they have already and basically no one bought them. The games they released were incomplete and buggy and very poorly received. Backbreaker was touted as the "Madden Killer" but was laughably bad.

There is plenty of room to make an unlicensed game especially with the loss of Collegiate games. No one is willing to sink the money into it. Someone NEEDS to do it... but I think the only one willing would be EA.

The only thing we know is the NFL is the entity still insisting on exclusivity. That is their business model among ALL products... it won't change no matter how much whining happens from the 100k that enjoyed other series. There are MILLIONS more that would blow a gasket if it were the other way around. The NFL knows that.

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Ignorant.

100K people? really? 5 times that amount bought the last 2K title...

Further more, 2K only released one generic football game. That was APF 2K8. Backbreaker was from 505 Studios and was never intended to be a legitimate "Madden Killer" as you're trying to suggest. It was an attempt to show off the Euphoria engine's physics and show what a physics based football game looks like. IMO it proved that a football game can't be entirely physics based and that animations are actually pretty important.

The only loyalty I have is to provide facts. I don't work on assumptions or misinformation. I dont work for EA... if i did, i wouldnt even respond because really there isnt any value in responding. I am responding because I still get lost on how folks still get heated over this. Facts are there, yet they want to twist them to suit their own arguments while ignoring what's been out there for years.

I'm not saying the license should be exclusive... I'm just saying it is and that is how the NFL operates. They aren't going to change it for a small minority of people still being butthurt 10 years down the road...

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"Provide Facts" but little of what you're saying is actually true. You assert that 2K fans are twisting things up to make an argument when you're doing the exact same thing.

Please tell me more about how only 100K people want a non EA football game and how 2K put so much work and advertising in Backbreaker.

I think part of the reason for NFL "making available" an exclusivity license is so that it can have better control over how the NFL is portrayed in the games that have their name on it. NFL has been increasingly more so protective of its image and how its portrayed as we have all noticed.

Don't know if its just me, but I haven't seen someone go out with a "concussion" or "severe concussion" in madden 25

This is the real issue.

Lets be serious. The NFL could give EA a small discount, allow another company to make a game but pay for the license, and make even more money. But the truth is it's easier for the NFL to control one game, than control two or even three.

Having one company that's clearly desperate to keep that license is an asset and makes it easier to control things like this.

APF 2K8 had real time injuries. Players will get hurt during the play and you will see them get hurt, you can actually see the pain in some of their faces and their body movments. I don't think we'll ever see this in Madden, but it happens every Sunday.

Is that acceptable? For those of us who just want a good fundamental game, it's not. For the ones who just want a good NFL game, it apparently is.

[ThunderHorse]

When Madden was beating out 2k it's because they were actually trying. Competition in the market forced them to invent real new features like the hit stick to keep people coming back.

Even if 2k didn't outsell Madden when it came back, it would at the very least force EA to give us more than the $60 roster update they are churning out right now.

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The first thing and the only thing that matters in all of this.

Another NFL game means 2K fans get what they want, The NFL makes a little more money, and Madden gets pushed to actually innovate and improve their game instead of stretching out improvements over a console generation.

Anyone remember how long it took Madden to get an announcing team on Current Gen? yeah.

None of that will happen though because the NFL has no interest in trying to micromanage how the game is displayed in two seperate games.

This is not good news if you want a better football game, regardless of anyone's "fanboyish" loyalty.

Comparing sales and how good a game is can be pointless. Advertising plays a big part too. NFL2k5 played really well. So did AllPro. The fact is competition breeds better development and games. It puts developers on notice. We need it back for Hockey, basketball, as well.

The Advertising for All Pro was minimal at best. A lot of people never knew the game even existed.

It was a great game and it is still the most fundamentally sound football game ever made.

If by quite obvious what 2k would do with another cycle... do you mean put out sub par broken games like 2K8 and BB? They had plenty of time to get those right since they were built off of 2K5...

The AI was worse in 2K8, and BB than any Madden during those times.

How many years did 2K work on APF2K8? How many for BB? More than 1 that is for sure... yet they both were massive failures with broken game modes. You don't need a license to have playable games modes... I'm sorry but that is where your argument goes down the toilet. NBA 2K has a license and yet many XB1 users cannot play game modes outside of play now. Yet somehow having the NFL license would fix their inability to have a functioning game... let alone online play That is... and has been the MO for those developers for a while.

Facts my friend ... not assumptions or opinions.

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Facts? lol.

Facts like 2K produced a game that, you know, they never actually produced.

In addition to that I know you can't legitimately tell me why the AI in APF 2K8 is worse than that in Madden 25.

All pro had it's bugs but the game was built off of a consistent engine. When things happen in APF you can explain them and see why, The same doesn't apply for Madden.

Madden still hasn't even gotten a pocket right. seriously.

-----

Like Krulmichael said, This is surprising to no one.

I don't really care because I want to see another generic game anyway. At this point, where the NFL is even legislating it's own video game to death, I think a generic football game can actually emulate the real game better.

I want to see concussion hits, I want to see players get hurt and actually limp off the field during the play. I want to see players get in eachother's faces. I want to see sidelines that are actually alive and react to what's happening on the field in a realistic way. 2K8 got that down pretty good, Next Gen Madden's attempt at it is laughable at best. I want to see weather affect play on the field.

I want to see mechanics like defensive shading work like they did in All pro. Where I can shade a DB inside when I know my opponent wants to throw the slant in order to give myself a better chance to make a play on the ball.

I want to see legitimate differences in how players play. All Pro is the only game I've ever played where an elite outside linebacker can be a crushing run stopper like Dave Wilcox but could also be a dangerous pass rusher off the edge like Derrick Thomas. Where a "good" cornerback like Lester Hayes will get better press and jam animations than another "good" corner like Lem Barney, who can cover but is also a dangerous return man.

2K8's idea of a balanced game that focuses on gameplay was a good one. By leveling out all the ratings in the game (all generics have the same numerical ratings in the game) but hiding their numerical values, it forced players to choose NFL greats based off of their abilities, not their numerical speed or acceleration rating. The ability focus of that game was tremendous because it gave it a feel that you put you're scheme together based on the talent you had and what abilities they offered your team.

I could make a team with Raymond Berry at Wide Receiver and he would kill defenses with precise route running and tough routes in the middle of the field, but I could also put James Lofton at Wide Receiver and watch him run past deep coverages all day. What really made it special was that both guys had different skill sets that called for different plays and therefore you ended up creating different schemes. So my Raymond Berry team is going to have pretty different plays for different situations compared to my James Lofton team.

I want a game where the Quarterback feels the pressure. In APF pressuring the quarterback is fundamental. If you let an Elite quarterback throw the ball in a clean pocket, he's going to complete almost everything. If you get him off his spot, you can force poor throws and turnovers. You don't have to touch the quarterback in that game to make him throw a hurried pass, just rush him into the throw. (Something that was subtly great about this BTW, is that you can see how effectively the QB threw the ball based on the spiral. Rushed throws turn into wobbly footballs while clean throws result in tight spirals.) In addition, Quarterback play tremendously increased based off of tier of player. Top tier players play better than bottom or middle teir players. This is evident in Madden too but for different reasons. In Madden, they dumb down your defenders to make for better quarterback play. Trying to make a tough throw with Peyton? the DB won't be able to make a play on the ball because he'll false step and pull himself out of the play. In ALL Pro, if I'm trying to make a tough throw with Marino, Marino will put it where the DB can't get it. You can go to the replay, watch it in slow motion, notice the DB's great coverage, and marvel at how Marino will consistently put it an inch or two out of his reach where only the receiver can get it. Obviously both games are pulling the DB in some for or another, but when I play the 2K game I never scratch my head and way WTF, I just know It's an elite QB and unless I force some pressure he'll make those throws all game. In Madden, I end up banging my head against the table because my DB will do something really retarded to open up the passing lane for my opponent.

The Abilities also gave your players a personality and truly differentiated them. Madden is trying to get better about this but it's never consistent.

Like I said in the Previous thread. I don't think I even want to play another NFL football game at this point because I think it's pretty much set in stone now that Madden will never be able to truly emulate this game when the NFL is handcuffing them.

[PP]

TH I am with you that AllPro was a fantastic game gameplay wise.

[Price]

https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/end-ea-sports-exclusive-partnership-nfl/LRCTV3Fp