Jim Zorn

[Nukleopatra]

Zorn played for an expansion team.
Yeah, he may have thrown a few too many INTs, but he has nothing to apologize for..

He should be apologizing to the fans and players whose time he wasted by being a completely worthless pile of shit, that's what he should be apologizing for. I've already come to the conclussion that when it comes to the NFL, you're about worthless, so just move on.

I'll wait for BIG AD to give me his definition of ''good,'' because ''good'' is not the best way to describe Jim Zorn's NFL career.

[celtsxpatsxsox]

What does Zorn's playing career have to do with his coaching? I am pretty sure a lot of the coaches in the NFL were mediocre to average football players at best aside from a few.

[Nukleopatra]

Good player, bad QB...that's my thought on Zorn

So, basically, what you're saying is, he had the heart and desire to be good, he just wasn't born with the ability to pull it off? I can agree with that. I have the heart and desire to be an NFL quarterback, too, I just couldn't brainwash enough people into thinking I had any ability whatsoever. So, in that regard, Jim Zorn was a fine salesman. Just a really bad NFL quarterback.

[dave]

His lack of ability to read more than Steve Largent kinda screwed him...

Who else in Seattle could he read?

[Nukleopatra]

He could have tried reading the playbook for once in his life.

If it wasn't for Dave Krieg back in '84, they wouldn't have even made the playoffs. Dave Krieg actually managed to throw 32 TD passes that season, after they finally realized what a hack Zorn was back in '83. After replacing Zorn, Krieg still managed to go 5-3, with 18 TD passes, and 11 Interceptions.. Might look like average numbers, but compared to Jim Zorn, it was a step in the right direction.

I seriously laugh at this entire conversation about Zorn's NFL career.

[Golden Taters]

He could have tried reading the playbook for once in his life.

If it wasn't for Dave Krieg back in '84, they wouldn't have even made the playoffs. Dave Krieg actually managed to throw 32 TD passes that season, after they finally realized what a hack Zorn was back in '83. After replacing Zorn, Krieg still managed to go 5-3, with 18 TD passes, and 11 Interceptions.. Might look like average numbers, but compared to Jim Zorn, it was a step in the right direction.

I seriously laugh at this entire conversation about Zorn's NFL career.

I would say the conference championship appereance was due to Curt Warner more than Dave Krieg.

[Nukleopatra]

I would say the conference championship appereance was due to Curt Warner more than Dave Krieg.

It's a bit easier to make a difference when your QB is somewhat competent.

If they don't bench Zorn, they don't make the playoffs.

[Bmore]

I saw him in a Seattle game because I was tryin to learn WR moves from Steve Largent and found out Largent's best move was turning and hoping Zorn wasnt sacked

LMAO, pretty funny

But realistically shouldn't sacks count more toward the O-line... I mean sure a QB can hold onto the ball to long (Aaron Rodgers) or have no mobility (Carson Palmer) but sometimes your O-line just sucks (2002 Texans...)

[Senser81]

Well, yes, I do realize those points. I thought it'd be interesting to see because I did see a lot of him in seattle.

There is no way you saw a lot of him in seattle. First, you are probably 16 years-old. Second, its as if you are surprised that Zorn is bad on the Packers. If you really did see a lot of Zorn in Seattle, then you'd understand that by the time he was on Green Bay his mobility was gone. It would be like judging Mark Brunell's career based on his performance with the Redskins.

Yes, Dave is right, Zorn had a GOOD, but not great career. Steve Largent helped in Seattle, Green Bay sucked...

Zorn was a QB for the expansion Seahawks. He almost single-handedly made them the most competitive expansion team in history. I think they had a winning record in their 3rd year, and immediately had one of the best offenses in the NFL. You are making it seem as if all Zorn had to do was drop back and lob the ball to Largent.

Marino, when good had Mark Duper, Mercury Morris run game, and a solid core around him.

LOL at Marino and Mercury Morris. Off by only a decade. Neal Anderson was instrumental in Rex Grossman's development, too.

[Senser81]

He could have tried reading the playbook for once in his life.

If it wasn't for Dave Krieg back in '84, they wouldn't have even made the playoffs. Dave Krieg actually managed to throw 32 TD passes that season, after they finally realized what a hack Zorn was back in '83. After replacing Zorn, Krieg still managed to go 5-3, with 18 TD passes, and 11 Interceptions.. Might look like average numbers, but compared to Jim Zorn, it was a step in the right direction.

I seriously laugh at this entire conversation about Zorn's NFL career.

Krieg was a better passer than Zorn, but by that point the Seahawks had developed a solid O-line, a good run game, and a great defense. Take a look at the amount of sacks, turnovers, and defensive TDs the 1984 Seahawks had. Its really one of the best defenses in NFL history.

Again, Zorn's mobility and play-making ability made him a great QB for an expansion team with no O-line and very few good players. He was definitely a good QB for the Seahawks at that time.


[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQf1rhAE_34&feature=related"]YouTube- Seahawks 1979 - Lesson in Creative Football[/ame]

[Senser81]

Actually I did see a lot of him in Seattle, I tried to learn WR movements and positioning back in jr. high and high school from tapes of him figuring I could be able to become a better player. I realized it was Largent's moves that made him a good WR. Zorn didnt have the mobility to begin with.

If you did see a lot of him in Seattle, then you wouldn't say that Zorn "didn't have the mobility to begin with" (whatever that means...so Zorn learned how to be mobile?). Zorn's mobility was his greatest asset.

I agree that Dave Krieg was the big reason they made the playoffs. It's like judging Mark Brunell on making the jags good (even though it was all McCardell and Fred Taylor if you ask me...)

What are you even trying to say here? I don't get it.

I was off by the decade there with Morris...i thought he was still on the team...(I never watched Miami cept for the 84 super bowl. lol)

You weren't even close.

Secondly, Im a little older than the 16 yr old high school kid dude...try another 7-8 years...I grew up watching the guys right after he retired and tried to learn from films from the Zorn, rookie Marino, Montana, Griese eras...

Well, you obviously still have a lot to learn.

I never said I was surprised by it. I said now I realize why he really did not do well as a coach...

But if you had seen Zorn in Seattle, then why would it take your recent viewing of a 1985 Bears-Packers game to draw a conclusion from Zorn's playing career? According to you, you've already seen Zorn play.

In sum, we already have ram29jackson in this section of VSN, and we don't need another know-it-all person who completely lacks both factual knowledge and logical reasoning.

Please go away.

TY

[dave]

Again, Zorn's mobility and play-making ability made him a great QB for an expansion team with no O-line and very few good players. He was definitely a good QB for the Seahawks at that time.


YouTube- Seahawks 1979 - Lesson in Creative Football

You and I agree on something.
Hell has frozen over.
I better hit a singles bar, I'm due to get lucky this week.

[steeljake]

You and I agree on something.
Hell has frozen over.
I better hit a singles bar, I'm due to get lucky this week.

the magic 8 ball says: outlook is not good.

[Bmore]

Dont give a shit who he is, thanks. And Zorn wasnt mobile...I still to this day don't believe he was.

I didn't draw the conclusion from it, i simply stated a game that he did terrible in. Yeah...so I chose a bad game to decide it on. GTFOH with I lack factual knowledge and reasoning. The dude was not good.

And if you read the entire thread (Which obviously you lack the brains to read an entire paragraph and just like to dissect random statements to prove your point...) you would've realized I was talking about what nucleo was with Krieg coming in after 5 games in Seattle to send them to the playoffs.

Now tell me that's a statement the guys was good? You've got to be kidding me.

I mess up the Dolphins starters in the 80s because I dont watch them (which I admitted)...they still had an extremely solid run game, which I was right on. That made Marino good.

I said Brunell wasnt the reason for the Jags success in the late 90s either. Know for a fact the Jags had FRED TAYLOR and KEENAN McCardell....Solid run + good receivers + good line = good QB. So you're saying Zorn was good, had mobility, whatever.

Where's your stats to prove it? The dude got INTs and sacks....His best season was in 1979, he put up over 3,000 yds passing 20 td and 18 int. But guess what, 57% completion...yeah, decent one year. That's like saying larry brown was good as a career just because of one season with dallas and Deion on the other side...he wasnt good. Offenses exposed him everywhere else he played.

I don't know it all, if you read last night and knew i was drunk you'd realize i wasnt paying attention to every little detail...

You can argue til your breath runs out...I still ain't leaving and Zorn was pretty bad...

He was 40-60 in 126 GS and 107 TDs and 133 INTs....201 sacks and a 67.9 passer rating...that's as good as rick mirer....

There's a point...speaking of bad O-Lines when Mirer was in Sea for 3 years, he amassed over 100 sacks on him...that's where id give benefit of the doubt to mobility.

Stats don't mean everything. If that was the case Carson Palmer would be a good quarterback.

[Nukleopatra]

Stats don't mean everything. If that was the case Carson Palmer would be a good quarterback.

People still insist that he is.

If any other quarterback had managed to throw 187 yards per game, while having both a top 10 running attack and defense, they'd be laughed at and belittled nonstop. What is it about Crapson Palmer that makes people like him? Now, this isn't another anti-Brees thing here, because even when I bashed Brees, he was a very good QB, but Crapson Palmer on the other hand, is complete shit. Now I'm hearing all this ''I want TO to sign with Cincy,'' like his stone fucking hands will help Crapson Palmer be even close to what he once was, even if it was for a short period of time.