Brady sucks now

[bucky]

My point was to explain why people are moronically throwing around a label, not to label anyone, because I didn't. The examples given are irrelevant.

And yet your examples were bias pro Brady and anti Manning. And then a few posts later you repeated how horrible Manning was on THAT ONE THROW. I would have left your post alone if you would have also added a Manning Clutch and Brady Choke example. That would truly have been emphasizing "not throwing around a label". Showing players will both choke and be clutch.

[killgod]

And yet your examples were bias pro Brady and anti Manning. And then a few posts later you repeated how horrible Manning was on THAT ONE THROW. I would have left your post alone if you would have also added a Manning Clutch and Brady Choke example. That would truly have been emphasizing "not throwing around a label". Showing players will both choke and be clutch.

My point was to explain why people are moronically throwing around a label, not to label anyone, because I didn't. The examples given are irrelevant.

[Liquidrob]

The Patriots are a normal team now? Cause a normal team has perfect regular seasons, pass records broken, a couple conference championships, endless division titles?

This is normal? For who?



I'm not labelling anyone here, but you cannot look at the singular play and say that wasn't absolutely terrible on Manning's part.

A normal team in the playoffs pretty much like the rest of the league, obviously they are still a top nfl team, they just are not unbeatable in the playoffs like they were when they were cheating and the record proves it

[Liquidrob]

I love how fans just dismiss there cheating like it didn't mean anything, lol, they were just doing it for fun, had no impact on anything, yeah right

Go look at there record when they play teams a second time during spygate, look at it afterwards, looks at there playoff record, look at it afterwards, yeah, no biggie

[bucky]

My point was to explain why people are moronically throwing around a label, not to label anyone, because I didn't. The examples given are irrelevant.

When trying to make a point, examples are relevant. And why are you getting all flustered over all the Spygate stuff in this thread? Just ignore it.

[killgod]

I'll let you guys carry on this terrible attempt at discussion.

[Senser81]

I'll let you guys carry on this terrible attempt at discussion.

My god...you choked in this thread...big time. Hard to continue posting with both hands around your throat.

[killgod]

My god...you choked in this thread...big time. Hard to continue posting with both hands around your throat.

Between bucky being dense about examples, rob and rams trolling, I got triple teamed like some cheap whore. I concede and will return to avoiding this section like the plague.

[bucky]

Between bucky being dense about examples

Please, your examples were biased. The biased examples take away from the point you were trying to make. I just pointed that out.

, rob and rams trolling. I concede and will return to avoiding this section like the plague.

True.

[Senser81]

Between bucky being dense about examples, rob and rams trolling, I got triple teamed like some cheap whore. I concede and will return to avoiding this section like the plague.

Yeah...even Brett Favre retired after losing to the Saints.

[ram29jackson]

You're trying to say Brady wasn't clutch cause he lead his team to a Super Bowl winning FG, instead of a TD.

Trolling, honey.

TD passes are obviously more clutch then "hey, good job, you got us into field Goal range. Now go sit down and hope he makes it so you indirectly look good ."

[ssags11]

I love how fans just dismiss there cheating like it didn't mean anything, lol, they were just doing it for fun, had no impact on anything, yeah right

Go look at there record when they play teams a second time during spygate, look at it afterwards, looks at there playoff record, look at it afterwards, yeah, no biggie

And tell me how extra video taping gives any sort of leg up. Also prove other teams were not doing it because the scuttlebutt back then was many teams were doing it including Mangina's Jets.

This story is way overblown and you're trolling. I don't want stats, I want reasons why you think extra videoing gives a big advantage.

[jms493]

And tell me how extra video taping gives any sort of leg up. Also prove other teams were not doing it because the scuttlebutt back then was many teams were doing it including Mangina's Jets.

This story is way overblown and you're trolling. I don't want stats, I want reasons why you think extra videoing gives a big advantage.

its certainly doesn't hurt your strategy....

[Bear Pand]

Your point continues to be utterly retarded.

In short it's nothing more than, lets ignore the 3 titles and 2 MVPs...and now he's equal to Manning! Ta-Da! They are the same label guize!

Lets compare a whole career to another, but shave off all their top end success! BRILLIANT!


Stop throwing around your moronic definition of choking. For fuck's sake, flat out losing a game to another team in every fucking facet is not a choke on the QB or any individual player.

Choking = Being put in a critical situation and failing to perform at the level you are capable of, or failing your assignment.

Rahim Moore choked the coverage on Jones. He blew the simple zone assignment, terrible positioning and lost track of the WR. Critical situation and he failed to do the fucking basics. CHOKE.
Peyton Manning choked the OT drive by throwing a terrible INT. Like that was amateur, throwing back across his body into coverage. You're out of the damn pocket and it's 2nd friggin down. JUST THROW IT AWAY. Nope, he CHOKED this play and did something completely under his level of ability as an NFL QB. CHOKE, CHOKE FUCKING CHOKE.
Billy Cundiff. 30 some odd yard FG to tie the AFC title game, something he does and kickers do with relative ease and high success. Critical situation. He CHOKED.
Wes Welker. Twice, one in the Super Bowl, one in the AFC title game. Critical moments, dropped passes he regularly catches. He CHOKED.

Do you fucking understand yet?


John Elway - The Drive. CLUTCH.
Adam Vinatieri - SB on the line. CLUTCH.
Dwight Clark - The Catch. CLUTCH.
David Tyree's catch. CLUTCH.
Brady's drive vs the Rams. CLUTCH.

These plays were clutch. These players were in critical situations in big games and either delivered and may even had to do something incredible or beyond their norm to succeed. This is being clutch in a moment when you need to be one or the other.


Good god this shit is retarded listening to idiots thinking losing a game defines the ability to make plays in critical moments. You take these situations and see how the player performs over his career to gauge their ability in those moments. To define clutch or choke on simply winning or losing a football game, as a team? Are you a god damn handicap to think that makes any fucking sense?

LOL at you getting upset and resorting to generic boateng comments. The hilarious thing about boateng is that out of all the people who actually got upset with it you actually took the bait / took it the hardest. I remember you literally wrote a five paragraph essay on how MM was on the decline and it was dude to posters like boateng. Started a State of MaddenMania PSA thread and shit. You thought it was a real poster! Even if we're gonna sit here and act like it was such a lame/obvious troll that we should still point out several years later...you fell for it. That's another story though.

First of all I'm not putting Brady and Manning on the same level. I'm pointing out that Brady's career 05-12 falls perfectly in line with the standard definition of choking. What is that definition? Based on what I've seen it's things like: throwing huge interceptions, giving away massive leads, losing as a big favorite , taking a high powered offense into the postseason and coming out flat, multiple turnover games, accumulating a ton of regular season Ws only to get bounced at home, historic upsets... Things Brady manages to accomplish yearly. It's not my definition of choking, I'm using the standard I see being applied to other quarterbacks.

Brady against the Broncos in 05: NOT CLUTCH
against the Colts in 06: NOT CLUTCH
Giants in 07: NOT CLUTCH
Knee in 08: NOT CLUTCH
Ravens in 09: NOT CLUTCH
Jets in 10: NOT CLUTCH
Giants in 11: NOT CLUTCH
Ravens om 12: NOT CLUTCH

Do YOU fucking understand yet?

And I don't know how many times I have to explicitly point out that I don't believe in or support that choking definition. If you want to argue that it's stupid you're arguing with the wrong person. I personally think the whole choking thing is overblown and doesn't make any sense. I've mentioned that several times ITT. I don't know how many times I have to say this. I just want fans and media to be consistent when handling QBs and applying the choking label to them. They obviously intend on continuing to use it, so do it fairly across the board.

Looks like you're taking the bait a second time.

[Bear Pand]

I love how quickly you Manning homers are to disregard the BIG GAMES of his career because his play wasn't up to his regular season standings.


Manning is the GOAT cause he can thrash the previously weak AFC South year in and year out, but when it comes to the playoff.....wait no....playoffs don't mean anything cause it's a team game and cause of weak defence and cause of you being a Patriots fan and blah blah (subsequently this all doesn't apply in the regular season tho? no?)


Give me a fucking break you jokers.


You disregard the playoffs because he's never been as good in the playoffs as the regular season. You won't admit it though. If Manning was boss in the playoffs, you'd be all over how great his play in big games is......you'd be lying if you say you wouldn't.

This doesn't apply to Brady over nearly the last decade? He feasts on a weak AFC East and then when it comes playoff time...well you know.

The reason is simple. The Greatest players of any position, in any sport, rise to the occasion when it's commanded of them. This is something he's not done very well.

Colts fans (in this thread) return fire with, well he's fucking king shit in the regular season and it's the defence's fault he loses (despite the defence being the key reason they made and won his only super bowl)

Sounds like Brady friend.

You wanted to pimp out this OMG HE DOESN'T PERFORM IN BIG GAMES bullshit lazy ass argument and now when it's applied to Brady you want to catch feelings. Oh but he won 3 SBs nearly a decade ago. Well despite the defence/defense being the key (especially in the first SB run check his numbers) reason. Sorry Brady doesn't get a pass for not rising to the occasion when it's commanded from him over the last 9 years. This is something he's not done very well by any measure.

As I said in the other thread.

Peyton has 2 TD's in 2 Super bowls. One from a blown coverage where Wayne had nobody within 20 yards of him and the other was taking advantage of an injured starting CB.


Who's fault is it that Peyton does dick all in the big game?

Is it the kicker's fault?

Is it the defenses fault?

No.

He's in control. He runs the offence, he picks his plays and he throws the ball. His guys catch just as well as any other QB's targets so it's not their problem.

It's all on him.

This same argument applies for Brady in the last two SBs against the Giants. 14 points each time oh god! Who's fault is it that Brady does dick all in his last two SB games?

Is the the defenses fault they gave up two late TD drives? Nah.

Is it Welkers fault for dropping key pass(es)? His guys catch as well as any other QB's targets so it's not their problem.

He's in control it's all on him.

What does that have to do with 8 Colts drives and 1 TD pass?

:dontknow:

First SB vs the Giants, 18-0. 50 reg season TDs, 37-38 ppg offense. 9 drives 1 TD pass. Ha.