Brian Burke fired

[leaffan]

I can not understand for the life of me why Leaf fans are so high on Colborne. He is not that good in my opinion. I find it troublesome he is 23 already and can't crack a spot on the Leafs lineup. He is behind Grabovski, Bozak, McClement, Steckel and Aucoin. Seriously, he can't beat out one of those guys? And I believe Kadri is a natural center. Colborne is a 50/50 making it in the NHL guy.

McClement and Steckel are 3rd/4th line PK guys. Grabo is technically the first line C right now but plays on the second. You also have Bozak, Lombardi and glass man Connolly all with significant NHL contracts which basically leave them pencilled in to the NHL till the end of their deals. You also have Kadri who is still in front of Colborne. Its just too jammed pack with NHL contracts for him to be playing on the leafs and quite frankly I would rather him play more in the minors for the better ice time. He's currently 22 and has only 2 years of pro hockey played. He's just coming off a season ending injury last season. This is honestly a typical time period for guys in the NHL. I really don't know what your expecting although I do find it funny for years people were bitching and moaning that the leafs used to play their young players too early and they always suffered. Now they pretty much follow the Detroit model of grooming players and people are bitching because he can't make a lineup packed with centers.

 

[ssags11]

McClement and Steckel are 3rd/4th line PK guys. Grabo is technically the first line C right now but plays on the second. You also have Bozak, Lombardi and glass man Connolly all with significant NHL contracts which basically leave them pencilled in to the NHL till the end of their deals. You also have Kadri who is still in front of Colborne. Its just too jammed pack with NHL contracts for him to be playing on the leafs and quite frankly I would rather him play more in the minors for the better ice time. He's currently 22 and has only 2 years of pro hockey played. He's just coming off a season ending injury last season. This is honestly a typical time period for guys in the NHL. I really don't know what your expecting although I do find it funny for years people were bitching and moaning that the leafs used to play their young players too early and they always suffered. Now they pretty much follow the Detroit model of grooming players and people are bitching because he can't make a lineup packed with centers.

I understand what you are saying. I am not a Leafs fan, I watched a few games when he was in Providence. I just don't think he has what it takes. At 22 almost 23 he is too timid and afraid. He's a big kid that doesn't use his size at all. That's my opinion.

 

[Ravin]

Burke is giving a presser today at noon. This could be a glorious pipe bomb, or pure class. Either way should be fun. I hope he thanks himself for the service to the Maple Leafs.

 

[Ravin]

Typical Burke presser. Basically answered a lot of the questions either by saying "It is not my issue anymore" or "go as the board and the people who made the choice". Though it was funny to start the thing off with him saying he has a cold and wish they would have told me sooner before he went to Russia.

Plus also his blast on Steve Simmonds was awesome. Never have to talk to him again. You will never find a bigger idiot then Steve Simmonds.

 

[ThomasTomasz]

Typical Burke presser. Basically answered a lot of the questions either by saying "It is not my issue anymore" or "go as the board and the people who made the choice". Though it was funny to start the thing off with him saying he has a cold and wish they would have told me sooner before he went to Russia.

Plus also his blast on Steve Simmonds was awesome. Never have to talk to him again. You will never find a bigger idiot then Steve Simmonds.

Then you know he's already on the lookout for his next job. Should be interesting to see if he does end up somewhere else as a GM next off-season.

 

[ssags11]

Typical Burke presser. Basically answered a lot of the questions either by saying "It is not my issue anymore" or "go as the board and the people who made the choice". Though it was funny to start the thing off with him saying he has a cold and wish they would have told me sooner before he went to Russia.

Plus also his blast on Steve Simmonds was awesome. Never have to talk to him again. You will never find a bigger idiot then Steve Simmonds.

The best is, he started a war between Leaf and Hab fans by calling the Leafs the crown jewel of the NHL.

 

[leaffan]

I understand what you are saying. I am not a Leafs fan, I watched a few games when he was in Providence. I just don't think he has what it takes. At 22 almost 23 he is too timid and afraid. He's a big kid that doesn't use his size at all. That's my opinion.

He's quite the opposite on most nights and really what you saw was your typical college kid in his first season realizing he's playing with men and not kids anymore. He got first star in tonights ahl game and is really starting to come into his own. His talent analysis has him listed as:

Colborne is expected to play another season at the AHL level as he continues to mature as a pro player. Expectations are for him to compete for a full-time spot in 2012-13. He’s likely to see spot duty this season as injuries arise.

Projection: Top-six, offensive forward with size.

A top 6 center with size is something the leafs have been dieing for years now but thankfully they've left him to develop in the minors. I really don't know if you've watched him at all this year because his corner play and agressiveness has really gotten better. What you saw back in providence was a first timer.

 

[ssags11]

He's quite the opposite on most nights and really what you saw was your typical college kid in his first season realizing he's playing with men and not kids anymore. He got first start in tonights ahl game and is really starting to come into his own. His talent analysis has him listed as:



A top 6 center with size is something the leafs have been dieing for years now but thankfully they've left him to develop in the minors. I really don't know if you've watched him at all this year because his corner play and agressiveness has really gotten better. What you saw back in providence was a first timer.

Well that's encouraging. And yeah, that's exactly what the Leafs need. Personally, I want a good playoff Leaf team again. As much as I hate the Scabs, Rags and Laffs, I fundamentally root for the O6. I think when the O6 is doing well than the NHL is doing well. And the NHL needs it's biggest fan based team to do well again. So, if Colborne makes that happen, than I am all for it.

No, I haven't watched any Marlie games, so I haven't seen him play in quite a while. He never made the big club, so all I watched was a few mini-B games.

BTW I don't really hate the Leafs like I do the Scabs and Rags. It is a franchise I much respect with some of my favorite players that played there.

 

[dave]

At the end of the day, the Leafs are no better today than they were when Burke took over ... and an easy argument could be made that they're worst. Tyler Seguin is in Boston. The very franchise player Toronto needs.
I give Burke the Phaneuf trade ... he won that easily, but is Phaneuf a $6.5M franchise defenceman? No.

Burke is the Don Cherry of the current NHL. Rather than embrace the Detroit model of speed, skill and seeking out Euro talent in lower rounds, he's still about pugnaciousness or what-not. Those days are over.

 

[ssags11]

At the end of the day, the Leafs are no better today than they were when Burke took over ... and an easy argument could be made that they're worst. Tyler Seguin is in Boston. The very franchise player Toronto needs.
I give Burke the Phaneuf trade ... he won that easily, but is Phaneuf a $6.5M franchise defenceman? No.

Burke is the Don Cherry of the current NHL. Rather than embrace the Detroit model of speed, skill and seeking out Euro talent in lower rounds, he's still about pugnaciousness or what-not. Those days are over.

Not too sure I agree with that. The Leafs are better than they were and they have much better prospects than they did. The Leafs are close to a breakout.

Also, how does the "Detroit" model explain the Bruins, Kings, Blackhawks and to a lesser extent the Rangers success? I look at the Canadiens and see they are going the "Detroit" route and not having much success with it. The Habs can be pushed around and that is never a good thing in the playoffs. We saw what happened to the Canucks when you play too soft, and even Detroit is falling as they no longer have the grit they used to have like McCarty, Shannahan, Glichrist, LePointe, Draper, Chelios, Holstrom and have become an all skill team.

 

[dave]

Not too sure I agree with that. The Leafs are better than they were and they have much better prospects than they did. The Leafs are close to a breakout.

Also, how does the "Detroit" model explain the Bruins, Kings, Blackhawks and to a lesser extent the Rangers success? I look at the Canadiens and see they are going the "Detroit" route and not having much success with it. The Habs can be pushed around and that is never a good thing in the playoffs. We saw what happened to the Canucks when you play too soft, and even Detroit is falling as they no longer have the grit they used to have like McCarty, Shannahan, Glichrist, LePointe, Draper, Chelios, Holstrom and have become an all skill team.

Don't get me going on the Canadiens, they're my damn team. But good post ssags.
But, in my opinion, speed and skill are more important than truculence in this era of NHL hockey. The Bruins had killer goaltending, the Kings too. Truculence didn't win their cups, IMO. Blackhawks? Honestly, not sure.
Skill, speed and great goaltending way more important than employing goons in your bottom six IMO.

But, again, I applaud your post. Nice response.

Where my Habs are concerned: they have made way too many cap mistakes.

Gomez, Kaberle, Bourque, giving Markov guaranteed money despite his injury history.

The Habs have been morons where the cap is concerned. I hope Bergevin can turn this around.

 

[ssags11]

Don't get me going on the Canadiens, they're my damn team. But good post ssags.
But, in my opinion, speed and skill are more important than truculence in this era of NHL hockey. The Bruins had killer goaltending, the Kings too. Truculence didn't win their cups, IMO. Blackhawks? Honestly, not sure.
Skill, speed and great goaltending way more important than employing goons in your bottom six IMO.

But, again, I applaud your post. Nice response.

The Hawks have some toughness in them. They have Carcillo, Oduya, Mayers, Bolland and Toews, Keith, Seabrook are a tough players. I wouldn't call them tough like a Philly built team but they don't get pushed around in the corners either.

The game has changed, very true. Fighting is not as important as it used to be. But look at the Bruins, they have 6 guys that can more than fight and handle whoever they fight. Also, all 6 of those guys have talent and skill too. Shawn Thornton is a good example of the new prototypical goon the NHL needs more of. He got talent to go along with those fighting skills he has. I believe you need those players on your team. Gone are the days of BGL but you still need a Thornton on your team too. In some media publications, Bruins and Rangers are considered the favorites going into this season. Both teams are very similarly built. Lots of grit and toughness with zero superstars. Yes, I know I guess Chara is a superstar but not in the classic sense.

 

[dave]

I absolutely think Chara is a superstar. Agreed, not in the classic sense. He dominates a game without traditional stats.

 

[leaffan]

At the end of the day, the Leafs are no better today than they were when Burke took over ... and an easy argument could be made that they're worst. Tyler Seguin is in Boston. The very franchise player Toronto needs.
I give Burke the Phaneuf trade ... he won that easily, but is Phaneuf a $6.5M franchise defenceman? No.

Burke is the Don Cherry of the current NHL. Rather than embrace the Detroit model of speed, skill and seeking out Euro talent in lower rounds, he's still about pugnaciousness or what-not. Those days are over.

Your first sentance is beyond wrong. Hell a lot of what you said is wrong.

When Burke first came to this team it was a straight up horror show and was basically the trail end of a team that was decimated by years of trading away first rounders for older players and a minor system which was fairly thin in youth talent. I think I had a post at one point outlining some of the hilariousness of early 2000's leaf trades especially recklesly sending first rounders for rentals. They usually had a decent AHL team though especially when the "saviour" Justin Pogge was still around.

The top 2 lines when Burke was hired were Jason Blake/Matt Stajan at Center, Alexei Ponikarovsky/Niklas Hagman at left and Nokolai Antropov/Lee Stempniak. I shudder even typing that. Goalies included an end of career Curtis Joseph and another saviour goalie in Vesa Toskala who ended up being a massive bust. The leafs also were playing Martin Gerber near the end.

Fast forward a bit and what you have now is a team built on speed and puck movers. The truculance days never really had time to arrive (although they are coming. A lot of burke draft picks will be coming up soon). The embrace the detroit model of speed and skill and seeking out Euro talent is hilarious because thats exactly what the leafs have done. Kulemin and Grabovski (not north american btw) are fairly fast although they don't match up against a healthy Lombardi (the leagues fastest skater).

 

[dave]

The Leafs are still a horror show and still not a playoff contender.

 

[ssags11]

I absolutely think Chara is a superstar. Agreed, not in the classic sense. He dominates a game without traditional stats.

I almost shit a brick when I found out Chara had his best statistical season last year. He is so awkward to watch, not very graceful at all. He is the poster child for a hall of famer making it in with absolutely shitty stats. Assuming he does make it in, I think he needs one more Norris and probably one more Cup. He has the first and second team selections with 5 so he is close. Being a Slovak and first Iron Curtain born and trained player to captain a team will be a big influence.

 

[dave]

IMO, Chara (despite the Pacioretty hit) is a first-ballot hall of famer.

 

[leaffan]

The Leafs are still a horror show and still not a playoff contender.

So instead of saying your wrong (like normal) this is your response. Cool story.

 

[dave]

So instead of saying your wrong (like normal) this is your response. Cool story.

So ... would you keep Burke on board?

 

[ssags11]

The Leafs are still a horror show and still not a playoff contender.

I dunno man, the Leafs are way better than 5 years ago. Burke has made some shrewd trades that have panned out for the Leafs. The Laffs are one goalie, one skilled winger and true number one center away from being a force again. Granted that might be alot but it's better than what they were.

Personally, and I will say it again, the league needs the Leafs, Habs, Rangers, Red Wings, Bruins and Blackhawks to be playoff teams year in and year out. They are the powerhouse money teams and for a healthy league, they all need to be doing well.