Burke: Concerned about the NHL's direction on Fighting

[Fappin Raptor]

Come at me bro.......................s!

 

[leaffan]

Yes it is, partially. We've been told repeatedly here that fighting helps pump the team up etc etc, helps them win etc as well.

Goal scoring or the prevention of it is how hockey games are won. It's also easier to score goals if the players are protected.


As for keeping players in check..if the NHL FO wasn't so limp dicked they could do more about it.

I've always held the opinion that fighting is around to keep players in check first and foremost and to prevent injuries that could be caused by it not being around.

This will indirectly help you win.

The NHL front office comment is what Burke was talking about in the article.

 

[FirstTimer]

This will indirectly help you win.

Like I said originally it all directly or indirectly ties back to goal scoring. Keeping the goal scorers protected obviously would help goal scoring. How much...is what the article was trying to dig for overall.

 

[leaffan]

Like I said originally it all directly or indirectly ties back to goal scoring. Keeping the goal scorers protected obviously would help goal scoring. How much...is what the article was trying to dig for overall.

The article like I've already said does a poor job at that though.

 

[FirstTimer]

The Burke situation is odd. Not that I trust the NHL FO to ever really do anything well...but one would think that if fighting, dirty play etc was punished more severely by the FO it would be drastically reduced. I think money and lots of it sends a clearer message rather than a fist to the face over the long term.

I don't think the NHL FO is doing nearly enough now to curtail fighting as "needed" in the sport..whether by design or ineptitude I'm not sure at this time. But the entire Bettman "we will have to see more research on brain injuries before we make a choice" sounds a lot like the idiotic BS that was coming out of the NFL commissioner 3 years ago.

The article like I've already said does a poor job at that though.

I don't think it did a "poor job" I think it was trying to do the best it could with what information it had to work with. I don't for a second think it's conclusive but the method may be going down the right track to a certain extent.

 

[killgod]

The league isn't trying to curtail fighting though, so of course you aren't seeing them trying to punish fighters...


Dirty play is being punished more severely, guys are suspended almost daily right now...


?????????

 

[leaffan]

The Burke situation is odd. Not that I trust the NHL FO to ever really do anything well...but one would think that if fighting, dirty play etc was punished more severely by the FO it would be drastically reduced. I think money and lots of it sends a clearer message rather than a fist to the face over the long term.

I don't think the NHL FO is doing nearly enough now to curtail fighting as "needed" in the sport..whether by design or ineptitude I'm not sure at this time. But the entire Bettman "we will have to see more research on brain injuries before we make a choice" sounds a lot like the idiotic BS that was coming out of the NFL commissioner 3 years ago.



I don't think it did a "poor job" I think it was trying to do the best it could with what information it had to work with. I don't for a second think it's conclusive but the method may be going down the right track to a certain extent.

It's funny because thats exactly what the NHL is doing but is also the most scrutinized by fans and the PA.

 

[FirstTimer]

The league isn't trying to curtail fighting though,

You misunderstood what I was saying.

I said "I don't think the NHL FO is doing nearly enough now to curtail fighting as "needed" in the sport".

Which is to say they aren't punishing dirty play, illegal/unsafe play etc enough to to the point help where fighting isn't a needed way of policing the on ice action.

I was somewhat agreeing with leafs idea that fighting is "needed" still at this point because the FO isn't doing enough...or taking it far enough at this point.

 

[FirstTimer]

It's funny because thats exactly what the NHL is doing but is also the most scrutinized by fans and the PA.

The backlash will only get worse because I don't think they are doing it severely enough.

Backlash I am all too familair with with following the recent explosion of NFL player safety rules.

 

[Ravin]

I'm fairly sure if the NFL had fighting, that MFer Harrison from Pittsburgh wouldn't be head hunting on hits because he would have got the fuck beat out of him by now.

 

[FirstTimer]

I'm fairly sure if the NFL had fighting, that MFer Harrison from Pittsburgh wouldn't be head hunting on hits because he would have got the fuck beat out of him by now.

:yao:

That's cute.

 

[Ravin]

:yao:

That's cute.

So is you talking about hockey. :giggity::giggity::giggity:

 

[FirstTimer]

So is you talking about hockey. :giggity::giggity::giggity:

Ditto.

 

[wr50l]

I think money and lots of it sends a clearer message rather than a fist to the face over the long term.

So wait, why did you punch that annoying girl in the ovaries? Should have just fined her.

 

[FirstTimer]

So wait, why did you punch that annoying girl in the ovaries? Should have just fined her.

Bitch was poor.

 

[wr50l]

I'd be inclined to give you the extra 2 for instigator nonetheless.

 

[wr50l]

Was her name Sean Avery? That would make a whole lot more sense than it should.

 

[sraczk2011]

The Burke situation is odd. Not that I trust the NHL FO to ever really do anything well...but one would think that if fighting, dirty play etc was punished more severely by the FO it would be drastically reduced. I think money and lots of it sends a clearer message rather than a fist to the face over the long term.

Unless you're Andy Sutton, who's lost 32% of his salary so far this year to suspension.

 

[leaffan]

This popped up on twitter today and its an article from PowerScoutHockey in which they measure fighting in terms of momentum using NHL numbers from the current NHL:

http://powerscouthockey.com/blog/me...um-and-scoring-well-potential-coachs-strategy

It has a bunch of graphs and shit in it which is why I didn't just copy and paste the whole thing. Their main conclusion is:

The data analysis of 1,563 fights suggests the following findings:

1. If a fight occurs there is a 50/50 chance your team will have an increase in momentum. If so you can expect to gain about 0.1 of a goal in scoring if this happens randomly. Hence it will take just over 60 fights to get a win.

2. If a fight happens when the team is playing poorly, team scoring can be boosted to about 0.2 of a goal because team momentum increases. In this case it will take about 30 fights to achieve a win.

3. There is no home ice advantage to fighting.

CONCLUSION: Overall these results suggest that fighting by itself does not significantly help a team score more goals or win more games, but it can often increase short-term momentum (i.e. the RATE at which they are getting shots) for one or both teams. Statistically speaking, if fights happen randomly it will take about 60 fights to equal one win, but if their timing is managed by the coach it could take as few as 30 fights to equal one win. PowerScout has uncovered many other factors that can provide a much greater contribution to winning than fighting, such as having a good penalty killing unit.

For interest sake, further study into the impacts of fighting on team momentum could add more context to these results. Other factors that could influence the fight/momentum analysis include 3 minutes after the fight versus other time ranges, who won the fight, the score, period, shots by line, powerplay opportunity, time in period, time of year, and quality of opposition. These will be explored with future research depending on availability of the data required.

A little more precise with their numbers but it shows how fights help swing momemtum which they measure by shots on goal.

 

[spiker]

Well Columbus should just hire a few MMA guys to skate around and beat the shit out of people then if they plan on making the playoffs.