Enough is enough. Peyton Manning is the greatest QB of all time.

[SethMode]

Yeah. Peyton put the Colts in position to win about as well as Jim Kelly put the Bills in position to win in Super Bowl XXV. And IIRC, the FG would have only tied the game for the Colts, not given them the win.

Yeah, it was 21-18.

 

[KoRnStARr]

Why do people bring up that Nick Harper play? The game was OVER when Peyton threw that pick to Polamalu in all actuality. The NFL tried to bail Peyton out and still couldn't do it, because instead of Manning try to move his team closer and closer to a touchdown or better FG range he kept throwing bombs into the endzone to Wayne and not go underneath to James and Stokley who were consistently wide open. Jeezus. And yes, they were down "3", although never should have gotten to that point.

 

[KoRnStARr]

How could you even pretend this is true?

I guess we can act like he didn't lead a 3 play 55 yard TD drive (all passes) to tie the Pats with 1:30 to go.

And I guess we can act like he didn't lead a 2 play 64 yard drive (all passes) to take the lead over the Steelers with like 2:30 to go.

It's not his fault and doesn't make him any less of a player just because his D didn't hold.

I guess we can also act like Warner doesn't have a better QB Rating, 1 less TD and more passing yards in the Superbowl despite only playing in 3 compared to Brady's 4.

You just subjectively assign praise and blame and don't use the same criteria for every player.



This

Wrong.

In the SB against the Pats Warner's offense did next to nothing, and he finally responded with a late drive to tie the game. Was a great drive, but he didn't go up, he finally started to muster up some kind of offense, he played terrible the entire game and even had a fumble go back for six I believe or maybe it was an INT. Regardless he played awful.

Against the Steelers he threw a CRITICAL pick six, and even had the ball with 45 seconds left again to do something with it. Instead, takes a sack and fumbles.

Now, don't get me wrong -- Warner is a pretty damn good playoff QB and actually maintains, and even elevates his level of play from the regular season unlike when Peyton gets into the playoffs. But those SBs he made some critical mistakes that ultimately cost his team the game.

 

[KoRnStARr]

I just don't see how anyone could ever say Manning > Brady...

When Brady has owned the head to head playoff games, has the rings, has an MVP of his own, has the TD record in a single season taking it AWAY FROM PEYTON, has most TDs in a single quarter, has put up good numbers his whole career with less then ideal weapons, multiple SB rings, and is a guy who is always getting his team to the post-season and being a clutch king. Makes no sense. Manning has career numbers on him, mainly being the beneficiary of better weapons his entire career, and a DOME to play in.

I immediately considered Brady the best QB in the league after he hung up 42 on the Steelers #1 ranked 2005 D, and went on to win his 2nd SB in a shoot-out. He's the man.

 

[Liquidrob]

Manning > Brady

 

[SethMode]

Manning > Brady

 

[Bear Pand]

I just don't see how anyone could ever say Manning > Brady...

When Brady has owned the head to head playoff games, has the rings, has an MVP of his own, has the TD record in a single season taking it AWAY FROM PEYTON, has most TDs in a single quarter, has put up good numbers his whole career with less then ideal weapons, multiple SB rings, and is a guy who is always getting his team to the post-season and being a clutch king. Makes no sense. Manning has career numbers on him, mainly being the beneficiary of better weapons his entire career, and a DOME to play in.

I immediately considered Brady the best QB in the league after he hung up 42 on the Steelers #1 ranked 2005 D, and went on to win his 2nd SB in a shoot-out. He's the man.

Brady won a playoff game against Manning where he threw for 150 yards while his defense and running game did the vast majority of the work: Over 200 yards rushing, held Colts to 3 points. The reason the Pats are 2-1 against Mannings Colts is certainly not because Brady > Peyton. The story was always Belichick's defenses shutting down Manning in the snow.

The year Brady threw 50 TDs he played all 16 games and threw 578 passes. When Manning threw 49 TDs he did it in 15 games (Colts rested their starters last game) and only threw 497 passes. It took Brady and extra game and 81 extra attempts to throw one more TD than Manning did. Plus that most TDs in a quarter isn't even a real record. McNabb held it before Brady did no one knew or cared then, why should we now?

Manning is a year older than Brady and the career totals aren't even close, and despite playing with better offensive weapons he's never had a defense nearly as good as those old Patriot Ds were.

 

[KoRnStARr]

Brady won a playoff game against Manning where he threw for 150 yards while his defense and running game did the vast majority of the work. The reason the Pats are 2-1 against Mannings Colts is certainly not because Brady > Peyton.

The year Brady threw 50 TDs he played all 16 games and threw 578 passes. When Manning threw 49 TDs he did it in 15 games (Colts rested their starters last game) and only threw 497 passes. It took Brady and extra game and 81 extra attempts to throw one more TD than Manning did. Plus that most TDs in a quarter isn't even a real record. McNabb held Brady did no one knew or cared then, why should we now?

Manning is a year old than Brady and the career totals aren't even close, and despite playing with better offensive weapons he's never had a defense nearly as good as those old Patriot Ds were.

Don't want to hear it, Brady didn't have the luxury of playing in 8 dome games AT LEAST during his record-setting year. He was stuck in shitty NE weather for the second half of that season.

I don't want to hear about the Pats D either, because if anything Peyton having a bad colts D for most of his career has HELPED his career totals with all the shoot outs he's had to be involved in, where as with a good D you simply grind games out when you're up big.

Can't have it both ways -- nice try, though.

 

[KoRnStARr]

Manning > Brady

Based on?

As a Steelers fan I'm shocked you said that..

We've seen what Brady has done to us in the playoffs...and how Manning has sucked against us.

 

[Bear Pand]

Wrong.

In the SB against the Pats Warner's offense did next to nothing, and he finally responded with a late drive to tie the game. Was a great drive, but he didn't go up, he finally started to muster up some kind of offense, he played terrible the entire game and even had a fumble go back for six I believe or maybe it was an INT. Regardless he played awful.

Against the Steelers he threw a CRITICAL pick six, and even had the ball with 45 seconds left again to do something with it. Instead, takes a sack and fumbles.

Now, don't get me wrong -- Warner is a pretty damn good playoff QB and actually maintains, and even elevates his level of play from the regular season unlike when Peyton gets into the playoffs. But those SBs he made some critical mistakes that ultimately cost his team the game.

It is what it is. Both games Warner came up with a TD drive with little time remaining and tied the game / took the lead. Both times his defense immediately let the other team score. Warner's postseason stats are better than Bradys, and he did it on teams with worse defenses and running games.

 

[KoRnStARr]

It is what it is. Both games Warner came up with a TD drive with little time remaining and tied the game / took the lead. Both times his defense immediately let the other team score. Warner's postseason stats are better than Bradys, and he did it on teams with worse defenses and running games.

Brady won those close games and made the plays to do it.

Warner made a play here and there but cost his teams the SB ultimately with those HUGE mistakes.

 

[SethMode]

Based on?

As a Steelers fan I'm shocked you said that..

We've seen what Brady has done to us in the playoffs...and how Manning has sucked against us.

Based on the fact that I look at more than a couple of games, and it's my opinion that he's the better QB than Brady, post season records or not.

 

[Bear Pand]

Don't want to hear it, Brady didn't have the luxury of playing in 8 dome games AT LEAST during his record-setting year. He was stuck in shitty NE weather for the second half of that season.

I don't want to hear about the Pats D either, because if anything Peyton having a bad colts D for most of his career has HELPED his career totals with all the shoot outs he's had to be involved in, where as with a good D you simply grind games out when you're up big.

Can't have it both ways -- nice try, though.

Having a bad D doesn't help an offensive player score more points. If anything it hurts them just as much as it helps since a major strategy against the colts has always been sit on the ball, keep Peyton on the sideline. Not "get into a shootout."

 

[KoRnStARr]

Having a bad D doesn't help an offensive player score more points. If anything it hurts them just as much as it helps since a major strategy against the colts has always been sit on the ball, keep Peyton on the sideline. Not "get into a shootout."

LMAO.

Please stop with that.

The more points score against you, simply means more opportunites for the offense to match the output or one up it. You can't even be serious. Those INDY D's gave up A LOT OF POINTS...

 

[Bear Pand]

Brady won those close games and made the plays to do it.

Warner made a play here and there but cost his teams the SB ultimately with those HUGE mistakes.

Warners postseason stats are better than Brady's and he's played in less games. There's really no way to spin it.

 

[KoRnStARr]

Warners postseason stats are better than Brady's and he's played in less games. There's really no way to spin it.

Key word: "stats". Peyton's had decent stats against some teams yet choked in playoff games. Stop with your nonsense.

Although I guess W's/L's aren't a playoff QB stat for you. They are for the HOF voters.

 

[DoubleDeuce]

Brady is a system quarterback.

Manning IS the system.

 

[Bear Pand]

Although I guess W's/L's aren't a playoff QB stat for you.

It's not. It's just a way for people to give credit to a player for something he doesn't have complete control over.

They are for the HOF voters.

How or why is this relevant when every QB mentioned in this thread is going to the HOF?

 

[KoRnStARr]

WHAT WE KNOW:

Brady has 3 rings, NFL record most TD passes in a single season, multiple SB MVPs, NFL MVP, numerous 4th quarter come backs and clutch plays. We also know that, when given weapons, he can put up similar or BETTER numbers then Manning DESPITE playing some bad-weather games, and not in a dome. We also KNOW that Manning has the better CAREER #'s because of a bad D for most of his career that gave up ton of points, talent surrounded him his WHOLE CAREER, and played in a dome.

With all these things known, how prolific of a passer Brady is with weapons, when you add up his rings, his playoff performances, his records -- there's no real true argument on why anyone can say, Manning > Brady. He's not as good of a playoff QB, only thing he has is better career numbers, which CAN BE EXPLAINED..

 

[KoRnStARr]

It's not. It's just a way for people to give credit to a player for something he doesn't have complete control over.

Then why do we give accolades for regular season wins, or for good numbers? No QB alone has complete control over that.

Face it, WINS for HOF QBs in the post-season is what seperates one from another, and adds up to their legacy. I know as a Manning/Colts fan that's hard for you to swallow.