Lets Revisit The 2005 Draft

[Woy]

I can't believe i got a Matt Jones jersey. FML

Please tell me you have a Ray J. Soward jersey also.

 

[Leftwich]

Please tell me you have a Ray J. Soward jersey also.

I don't buy Jaguars jerseys anymore. I got a Byron Leftwich, Matt Jones and Reggie Nelson one. Where are they know? Not on the fucking team.

 

[Woy]

I'll buy you a MJD one for your birthday.

 

[Tailback U]

What was the deal with Rodgers? Wasn't it because of Tedford that some felt Rodgers wouldn't be good? Hindsight is 20/20 but AR has the better arm, athleticism and everything...wtf?!

Smith was widely regarded as the more polished QB coming out of college. Reports suggest that Rodgers looked good, but scouts felt that he wasn't NFL ready and that Smith was better mechanically at that point in time.

That's what I heard on the radio from John Clayton at least.

 

[dave]

For all the people making Smith-Rodgers comparisons now, who's really to say how things would have turned out for Rodgers had the Niners drafted him.
They go through offensive co-ordinators like Pac-Man does $100 bills at the strip club, they would have forced him to play day one with crap talent, etc...
The best thing to happen to Rodgers was San Francisco making that decision to pass on him.

Hell, look at Steve Young. In Tampa Bay, he's on his way to being a bust. In San Fran, he becomes a hall of famer.

 

[Wildcard]

I got a Byron Leftwich, Matt Jones and Reggie Nelson one.

This may be the first time I have ever muttered these words, but coming from me, please take my statement with a grain of salt.

You sir, make horrible life decisions.

Thank you.

 

[Derrville]

Can Rodgers and Smith really be compared? I mean of course they will be cause they both came from the same draft but Smith was thrown out there from the start and Rodgers got to sit a while and learn from one of the greatest QBs ever.

 

[Rush]

Can Rodgers and Smith really be compared? I mean of course they will be cause they both came from the same draft but Smith was thrown out there from the start and Rodgers got to sit a while and learn from one of the greatest QBs ever.

Smith was thrown in the line of fire. Rodgers had 3 years to sit and grow his mustache. It was a great mustache at that.

 

[Hasselbeck]

Can Rodgers and Smith really be compared? I mean of course they will be cause they both came from the same draft but Smith was thrown out there from the start and Rodgers got to sit a while and learn from one of the greatest QBs ever.

The Niners assembled some talent for Smith to utilize the past several years.. and it didn't materialize.

Yeah, he got thrown in the fire during his first season.. but so did Sam Bradford this year. So did Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco in 2008. If you're cut out to be a starting NFL QB.. you're cut out to be an NFL QB. Clearly Aaron Rodgers is a starting NFL quarterback and Alex Smith is not.

 

[Hasselbeck]

Smith was widely regarded as the more polished QB coming out of college. Reports suggest that Rodgers looked good, but scouts felt that he wasn't NFL ready and that Smith was better mechanically at that point in time.

That's what I heard on the radio from John Clayton at least.

Basically nailed it. Mechanically speaking.. this picture shows what concerned scouts. Notice where he is holding the ball as a QB in college:

And notice it in the pros:

Major difference. Rodgers gets the ball out quicker with the pro delivery and is less susceptible to passes being knocked down as he is allowed to get more velocity on the ball. Not to mention if a blitzing DE or LB comes around, it's much easier to knock the ball out of his hands if it's up near the ear as opposed to around the chest.

So there was that concern. There was the concern he was more of a system QB, especially given how bad other Tedford QB's had flopped up until Rodgers (Trent Dilfer, David Carr, Akili Smith, Joey Harrington, Kyle Boller). There were concerns he wasn't a starter long enough at Cal (he started just under two full seasons at QB).

In the end though, Alex Smith was just as much a risk as Rodgers.. if not more. As Smith played in a very unorthodox offense as opposed to Rodgers playing in a Pro-Style attack. Supposedly both players were impressive in their workouts, but the Niners liked Smith a little bit more because they felt he was a bit more polished than Rodgers coming out of school.

Obviously they probably want that pick back, just like mostly everyone else in need of a QB with the opportunity to take him probably does.

 

[Woy]

Smith was thrown in the line of fire. Rodgers had 3 years to sit and grow his mustache. It was a great mustache at that.

Not as great as this man's.

 

[Tailback U]

The Niners assembled some talent for Smith to utilize the past several years.. and it didn't materialize.

Yeah, he got thrown in the fire during his first season.. but so did Sam Bradford this year. So did Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco in 2008. If you're cut out to be a starting NFL QB.. you're cut out to be an NFL QB. Clearly Aaron Rodgers is a starting NFL quarterback and Alex Smith is not.

I agree and disagree with this.

There are some guys, like Ben, Bradford, Ryan, Manning, etc. that are simply NFL ready the day they stop onto the field. Then there are other guys, who are simply not ready right out of college and need a lot of work before they are ready for a number of reasons. One being the coaches they learned from in college and the offense that they played in.

The guys that are NFL ready like Manning, Ryan, Bradford, etc. can get thrown in right away and learn to succeed. The guys that aren't, like Eli or Romo or Rodgers, probably need some time to develop and improve their mechanics and learn the playbook and how to break down coverages. These guys benefit greatly from sitting on the bench and learning from veterans like Warner, or Bledsoe, or Favre and eventually take over good teams with a stable coaching staff and offensive scheme.

 

[BazookaJoe5]

I wanted Clayton then...eb1920 remembers. Back on the MM board I was a total Clayton fan and wanted him more than anyone in the draft...too bad he didn't pan out, although I think if he stays in St. Louis with Bradford, he's gonna put up some good numbers.

 

[Bigpapa42]

I never really liked the Smith pick by the Niners. But I understood it. Can't really recall too many scouts putting Rogers over Smith back then. It wasn't a real strong draft class, and most seemed to have Smith as one of the top prospects. Seem to recall that the Niners were trying to trade down but couldn't get any value for it so they stayed put and took a guy they hoped would re-energize the franchise. It was a fucking terrible year to end up with the top pick.

 

[packersfan4eva]

Half those teams fucked themselves over by not picking Rodgers :smug:

But in all honesty, Rodgers wouldn't be as good as he is now without Favre. He has the velocity that Favre did, but he learned how not to use it--throwing balls as hard as he can into tight spaces where it gets intercepted. He learned how to make a play when things fell apart, when he has to scramble out of the pocket and find an open receiver on the other side of the field or blindly shuffle it to the receiver. Without Favre, his career is good, but he's by no means a star.

 

[shag773]

The Niners assembled some talent for Smith to utilize the past several years.. and it didn't materialize.

Yeah, he got thrown in the fire during his first season.. but so did Sam Bradford this year. So did Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco in 2008. If you're cut out to be a starting NFL QB.. you're cut out to be an NFL QB. Clearly Aaron Rodgers is a starting NFL quarterback and Alex Smith is not.

Those QBs have not had the coaching turnover that Smith has experienced. I'm not saying Alex was born to be a productive NFL QB, but I don't think many, if any QBs would have flourished in that shitfuck of a situation he was thrown into the last 6 years.

 

[Hasselbeck]

Half those teams fucked themselves over by not picking Rodgers :smug:

But in all honesty, Rodgers wouldn't be as good as he is now without Favre. He has the velocity that Favre did, but he learned how not to use it--throwing balls as hard as he can into tight spaces where it gets intercepted. He learned how to make a play when things fell apart, when he has to scramble out of the pocket and find an open receiver on the other side of the field or blindly shuffle it to the receiver. Without Favre, his career is good, but he's by no means a star.

Brett Favre groomed Aaron Rodgers to be quarterback as much as he groomed me to be QB.

 

[Hasselbeck]

I agree and disagree with this.

There are some guys, like Ben, Bradford, Ryan, Manning, etc. that are simply NFL ready the day they stop onto the field. Then there are other guys, who are simply not ready right out of college and need a lot of work before they are ready for a number of reasons. One being the coaches they learned from in college and the offense that they played in.

The guys that are NFL ready like Manning, Ryan, Bradford, etc. can get thrown in right away and learn to succeed. The guys that aren't, like Eli or Romo or Rodgers, probably need some time to develop and improve their mechanics and learn the playbook and how to break down coverages. These guys benefit greatly from sitting on the bench and learning from veterans like Warner, or Bledsoe, or Favre and eventually take over good teams with a stable coaching staff and offensive scheme.

I can agree with that to an extent. But even Eli Manning started 9 games his rookie year, the same number as Alex Smith.

Another point brought up is the constant coaching changes he dealt with.. but maybe if Alex Smith played a little better, those coaches stick around longer (with exception to Mike McCarthy and Norv Turner who took HC jobs). And usually if offensive coordinators are able to have success with young quarterbacks, they're pretty likely to get a HC job as well.. Another angle to look at.

I guess the point I'm making is.. if you're talented and cut out to be a starter in this league.. you'll show something in 6 years. If you're not, you're not.

 

[shag773]

Another point brought up is the constant coaching changes he dealt with.. but maybe if Alex Smith played a little better, those coaches stick around longer (with exception to Mike McCarthy and Norv Turner who took HC jobs). And usually if offensive coordinators are able to have success with young quarterbacks, they're pretty likely to get a HC job as well.. Another angle to look at.

I guess the point I'm making is.. if you're talented and cut out to be a starter in this league.. you'll show something in 6 years. If you're not, you're not.

Out of the 5 OC that Smith had, only 1 was actually fired by the HC that hired him. Martz was hired by Nolan, but let go by Singletary who wanted more of a ball control offense. Mike Johnson was not retained when Jim Harbaugh was hired.

So you can argue 4 of the 5 OC's Smith had left due to circumstances that had nothing to do with his performance on the field, but left for head coaching jobs or HC changes.

Before you start pointing fingers at Smith for the HC changes, remember Singletary and Nolan were defensive coaches who only produced 1 defense ranked in the top half of the league (4th in 2009) in 6 years.

Again, I'm not saying he would have been a good QB in a better situation. But under those circumstances, I'm not sure there are many that could.

 

[Awesometrax]

I don't buy Jaguars jerseys anymore. I got a Byron Leftwich, Matt Jones and Reggie Nelson one. Where are they know? Not on the fucking team.

Getting jerseys is almost like getting tattoos... get the wrong one and it looks unbelieveably stupid.