NHL Random Thoughts Thread

[ThomasTomasz]

So the Capitals are playing the Blues tonight, and Halak decided that it was "too soon" to play against his former team :joker:

 

[leaffan]

Good point with Buffalo and Vancouver. The Capitals have picks and prospects that they could afford to deal, so they could look at the trade market instead of making a big move in FA.

An odd thing that I think no one really has picked up on is most teams still have a lot of their original picks. There's only been 1 trade for a first round pick this year (Anaheim got Ottawa's first for Ryan) and that's it. I don't think I've seen that before especially at this point in the season. The last 2 years have seen a lot of teams retain picks and prospects so there's a lot of teams in that same position.

 

[ThomasTomasz]

An odd thing that I think no one really has picked up on is most teams still have a lot of their original picks. There's only been 1 trade for a first round pick this year (Anaheim got Ottawa's first for Ryan) and that's it. I don't think I've seen that before especially at this point in the season. The last 2 years have seen a lot of teams retain picks and prospects so there's a lot of teams in that same position.

Then it should be a sellers market this off-season, we will have to wait and see what it holds for us. A lot of eyes will be on Buffalo for sure, they aren't finished moving some of their pieces. At the very least, Ehrhoff is being moved I think.

 

[ThomasTomasz]

Leafs officially eliminated from playoff contention last night

 

[leaffan]

Then it should be a sellers market this off-season, we will have to wait and see what it holds for us. A lot of eyes will be on Buffalo for sure, they aren't finished moving some of their pieces. At the very least, Ehrhoff is being moved I think.

I've been sitting quietly just hoping the leafs make a play at Ehrhoff. His contract is so god dam good because of the front loaded stuff from the old CBA and he's a solid two way player.

 

[leaffan]

Leafs officially eliminated from playoff contention last night

For hilarious radio go ahead and check all the Toronto radio stations today. I think everyone is going to be fired by the end of the day haha.

 

[leaffan]

Oh forgot to point out Mark Giordano from the flames is going to be another Dman that if they can get him to waive his NTC would be another solid piece to a team looking for Dmen help. Calgary has the chance to cash in on some solid prospects here.

 

[ThomasTomasz]

I've been sitting quietly just hoping the leafs make a play at Ehrhoff. His contract is so god dam good because of the front loaded stuff from the old CBA and he's a solid two way player.

Oh forgot to point out Mark Giordano from the flames is going to be another Dman that if they can get him to waive his NTC would be another solid piece to a team looking for Dmen help. Calgary has the chance to cash in on some solid prospects here.

Ehrhoff is likely gone, I am not sure if Giordano would waive his NTC. The Flames aren't going anywhere soon, so he would be smart to waive it, but we've seen players stubborn and refuse it. Jimmy Rollins in MLB is the most recent one that comes to mind. I would like Ehrhoff too, a good defenseman who plays well at both ends for a $4 million cap hit, and then the actual money keeps going down. If the Sabres start a bidding war, they can get a good return on him.

 

[Obst]

So it's the opposite up in Canada? The Leafs fall in the spring?

 

[dave]

Phaneuf is worth the 7mil he's going to get. That's a hell of a bargain but he doesn't fare well playing a ton of mins (he was well north of 25 for the first 30 games this year) and as shown this year he's prone to breaking down.

You really think so? When he signed that deal my thoughts were "What the hell are the Leafs thinking?" Don't get me wrong, I think Phaneuf is a good defenceman, but he is not a franchise player. A co-worker of mine, a lifelong Leafs' fan and an old dude like me, hates Phaneuf. Says Phaneuf consistently makes bad decisions and what-not. My feeling is you don't drop $7M a year for 7 years on any player who isn't an absolutely indisputable franchise-level player. Phaneuf is not that.

 

[PP]

Leafs are a joke. Giving 7 million to Dion was fuckin stupid. Him as your captain is why the leafs will be mediocre for years. That deal was stupid.

Bruins with #1 seed and looking like we have to play Detroit round 1? Gonna be real tough. That Kings/Sharks first round matchup in the West is gonna be crazy good too.

 

[leaffan]

You really think so? When he signed that deal my thoughts were "What the hell are the Leafs thinking?" Don't get me wrong, I think Phaneuf is a good defenceman, but he is not a franchise player. A co-worker of mine, a lifelong Leafs' fan and an old dude like me, hates Phaneuf. Says Phaneuf consistently makes bad decisions and what-not. My feeling is you don't drop $7M a year for 7 years on any player who isn't an absolutely indisputable franchise-level player. Phaneuf is not that.

Dave stop talking and tell your leaf buddy he's a fuckin moron and is part of the reason why I'm beginning to hate this fan base more and more.

People that spew off things like he's not a franchise player or he makes bad decisions and blah blah simply don't watch the games. The guy has this huge target on him and I really don't understand why. Maybe it's because he has a terrible attitude all the time or maybe it was because he has such a huge contract.

I'm on my phone so I can't post some articles talking about this exact problem but I can't get the link to work.

 

[leaffan]

Now that I'm home and have my laptop onto the article I was talking about. This is probably the best one from last year.

http://www.fiveminutesforfighting.com/2013/01/dion-phaneuf-doesnt-suck.html

There's a shit ton of reading there but basically I'll post some more notable quotes from it: (quick fyi this article is from last year in Jan.)

Furthermore, the Leafs do not have enough quality defencemen to utilize Phaneuf's minutes effectively. He played more minutes on both the power play and the penalty kill than any Leaf did last season, and is well on his way to doing so again this year. That isn't necessarily the norm for top-pairing defencemen. For example, Drew Doughty played top minutes in a shutdown role for the Kings last year, but Darryl Sutter used Willie Mitchell and Matt Greene as the primary penalty kill tandem, which allowed Doughty to spend more time on the power play and made him more effective at even strength.

First thing that people really need to realize is Carlyle has to play Phaneuf an utter shit ton (because the leafs defense has blown for a while). He's proned to breaking down after long stretches and makes a lot of mistakes like anyone when they gets tired.

Last season (this was 2011-2012 btw) Phaneuf finished with 44 points, good enough for 12th highest among defencemen. However, Phaneuf was used in radically different situations than the vast majority of the other high-scoring defencemen. According to Behind the Net, among the top 15 defencemen in scoring, only two faced tougher competition than Phaneuf—Shea Weber and Ryan Suter—and only four started a larger percentage of shifts in the defensive zone—Weber, Suter, Zdeno Chara and Kevin Bieksa. In addition, Phaneuf played more minutes than all but eight defencemen last year, and logged the fifth most ice time on the penalty kill among defencemen in the top 15 in scoring.

So from this not only did Phaneuf actually score and contribute well offensively he was constantly playing in defensive zone and starting there as well as being on the penalty kill an utter ton. Phaneuf this year has really cooled off offensively. I think his defensive zone start numbers are staggeringly bad now and Morgan Reilly and Gardiner ate into his Powerplay time. He's also been severly beat up this year because he played a crap ton of mins in the first 50games. The year before he was 10th in pts for defensemen.

Player A: Quality of Comp: 1.049, Off. Zone Start%: 50%, Corsi Relative: 3.3
Player B: Quality of Comp: 1.099, Off. Zone Start%: 49.8%, Corsi Relative: 1.7

Player A is Dion Phaneuf. Player B is Brent Seabrook.

Both performed very similar in almost identical roles for their respective teams last year, but Phaneuf finished with 10 more points—likely because of the extra minute of power play time he saw a game—while Seabrook was a plus-21 compared to Phaneuf's minus-10. This discrepancy is not because of wildly different defensive abilities, however. It is likely attributable to the Blackhawks being vastly superior to the Leafs. Seabrook has the luxury of playing alongside Duncan Keith every night, in addition to elite forwards like Jonathan Toews, Patrick Kane, Marian Hossa, and Patrick Sharp, not to mention Dave Bolland, a worthy Selke Trophy candidate himself.

Brent Seabrook is a No. 1 defenceman and so is Dion Phaneuf.

Last point which I think is a good one and makes sense:

Phaneuf is relied upon more heavily than Doughty, who is an unquestioned No. 1 defenceman, and produced a better Corsi relative (3.3 vs 1.5) under tougher usage.

But Phaneuf still receives a great deal of criticism, much of which stems from his inability to fit people's perception of a No. 1 defenceman. Many assume that a No. 1 defenceman is supposed to be like Chara or Weber, two players who are not only No. 1 defencemen, but are "No. 1 defecemen", the proverbial player who logs 30 minutes a night, doesn't tire, plays a shutdown role, throws thunderous checks, and scores points for good measure. It doesn't matter who you play that defenceman with—Weber is currently turning Roman Josi into a top-pairing defenceman—or who you play them against. They are going to look like a Norris Trophy winner on a nightly basis. Phaneuf is not that player. That player is exceedingly rare, and just because Phaneuf is not that player doesn't mean he isn't a quality defenceman.

Essentially people seem to want this guy to Shea Weber but fail to realize there's only 1 Shea Weber in the entire league. Stupid comments like what Dave and PP have posted are the exact reason I am tired of defending critism towards the guy. He's been making 6.5mil for the last 5 or 6 years and is going to be making 7mil for 7 years. That's dam good for a contract of today and will pan out over time.

 

[ThomasTomasz]

After missing the playoffs, Leonsis vows to not make "quick decisions" in the wake of it. Leonsis was minority owner of both the Capitals and Wizards under Abe Pollin, where he learned about patience and loyalty to the front office and coaches. While that certainly is great to have to not make rash decisions, it is clear where the problem is with this team, and it's been that way for some time. Since it seems McPhee hasn't been able to fix it, it's about time he goes.

I don't see that happening this year. Leonsis is going to give him another year to fix it.

 

[Ravin]

Got to vote today for the Ontario Hockey League's Most Valuable Player during the regular season. Out of the options available, it was an easy selection of Connor Brown from Erie, who had an amazing season, leading the Otters and league in points, playing on the leagues top line.

Just funny I'm in WHL country and still voting for OHL.

 

[PP]

Now that I'm home and have my laptop onto the article I was talking about. This is probably the best one from last year.

http://www.fiveminutesforfighting.com/2013/01/dion-phaneuf-doesnt-suck.html

There's a shit ton of reading there but basically I'll post some more notable quotes from it: (quick fyi this article is from last year in Jan.)



First thing that people really need to realize is Carlyle has to play Phaneuf an utter shit ton (because the leafs defense has blown for a while). He's proned to breaking down after long stretches and makes a lot of mistakes like anyone when they gets tired.



So from this not only did Phaneuf actually score and contribute well offensively he was constantly playing in defensive zone and starting there as well as being on the penalty kill an utter ton. Phaneuf this year has really cooled off offensively. I think his defensive zone start numbers are staggeringly bad now and Morgan Reilly and Gardiner ate into his Powerplay time. He's also been severly beat up this year because he played a crap ton of mins in the first 50games. The year before he was 10th in pts for defensemen.



Last point which I think is a good one and makes sense:




Essentially people seem to want this guy to Shea Weber but fail to realize there's only 1 Shea Weber in the entire league. Stupid comments like what Dave and PP have posted are the exact reason I am tired of defending critism towards the guy. He's been making 6.5mil for the last 5 or 6 years and is going to be making 7mil for 7 years. That's dam good for a contract of today and will pan out over time.

There are intangibles that don't show up in stats. Like being a winner. Dion Phaneuf is not a winner. He is a bitch. I am glad you are happy he is being paid 7 million for 7 years. Another 7 years being stuck being mediocre just like Dion.

sidenote: Mad jealous he bangs Cuthbert

 

[Ravin]

There are intangibles that don't show up in stats. Like being a winner. Dion Phaneuf is not a winner. He is a bitch. I am glad you are happy he is being paid 7 million for 7 years. Another 7 years being stuck being mediocre just like Dion.

sidenote: Mad jealous he bangs Cuthbert

So I guess by this logic, John Tavares and Eric Staal are bitches too. They are not winning either.

 

[MVPete]

 

[leaffan]

There are intangibles that don't show up in stats. Like being a winner. Dion Phaneuf is not a winner. He is a bitch. I am glad you are happy he is being paid 7 million for 7 years. Another 7 years being stuck being mediocre just like Dion.

sidenote: Mad jealous he bangs Cuthbert

So no counter argument outside of not being a winner.

These are the sort of stupid ass things that people who don't watch a certain player or team say when they don't know what their talking about. I'm kind of surprised it wasn't dave saying something that dumb though.

 

[Obst]

Just our top defenseman prospect sniping in the national championship game.