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The Puro Thread

FedEx227 said:
I agree, I just wanted to start a dialogue to see if they'd be able to bring that gap. I think the other issue is — wrestling isn't cool. It's been destroyed to the point where people think "wrestling" is beer baths, promos and contract signings. A sport-oriented promotion may not work anymore, which is just a god damn shame.
Click to expand...

At the same time, modern New Japan isn't 1990 All Japan or 2003 NOAH. Yes, there is a clear in ring focus, but there are plenty of North American style elements, from Bullet Club to Yujiro to Yano's antics to Iizuka killing the announcer etc etc. I think with English commentary explaining a lot of this stuff, most of it would get over.

I do think if more people were willing to give it a chance they could recapture some of the people who are disenfranchised with wrestling and don't watch anymore, but yeah, they would definitely need more English speaking stars in order to make a real dent.
 
That's my hurdle "people giving it a chance".

I can't tell you the amount of friends I've said: "HERE...HERE is the link to one of the best matches you'll ever see" that can't be bothered to watch it. At least with most of my age group, turning on WWE is just habit and they aren't really into seeking out new wrestling, they just know on Monday around 8pm there will be some wrestling on.

It's an uphill battle that nobody wants to fight, because you'll likely take your hits like WCW did with the introduction of Nitro. If they stick it out and keep building I think it could be successful but I think it would take years before the masses would give the show a chance and realistically before they would support it.
 
It's hard for people to watch an out of context match. Sure, you can tell them that Shibata vs Ishii is this great match, but what do they see? A guy in plain black tights and a chubby 40-year old. They don't know Shibata is this dangerous shooter and Ishii is this little bowling ball of a man who takes unreal punishment whose gimmick is no skill/all heart.

Part of what makes the Okada/Tahahashi matches in the history between the two.

You are asking people to invest a lot of time to understand these things. It is an uphill battle. I don;t have any doubt the stories and the booking is good enough. Clearly the matches are. People really don't know what they're missing.
 
3OJ9ejm.jpg



This made me hyped to see this match. It needs to happen.
 
Warner2BruceTD said:
At the same time, modern New Japan isn't 1990 All Japan or 2003 NOAH. Yes, there is a clear in ring focus, but there are plenty of North American style elements, from Bullet Club to Yujiro to Yano's antics to Iizuka killing the announcer etc etc. I think with English commentary explaining a lot of this stuff, most of it would get over.

I do think if more people were willing to give it a chance they could recapture some of the people who are disenfranchised with wrestling and don't watch anymore, but yeah, they would definitely need more English speaking stars in order to make a real dent.
Click to expand...

The way they have their roster set up, with a group of core factions, a lot of the issues with English could be negated with "English Spokesmen" aka managers of some kind. There are ways around some of these guys speaking no English at all.
 
LiquidLarry2GhostWF said:
The way they have their roster set up, with a group of core factions, a lot of the issues with English could be negated with "English Spokesmen" aka managers of some kind. There are ways around some of these guys speaking no English at all.
Click to expand...

Yeah, this was the original plan for DGUSA, to have one english speaker in each unit, until the entire original concept got blown up when Dragon Gate got bored and decided to send CIMA, Tozawa, and one token guy to Gabe per show.
 
FedEx227 said:
That's my hurdle "people giving it a chance".

I can't tell you the amount of friends I've said: "HERE...HERE is the link to one of the best matches you'll ever see" that can't be bothered to watch it. At least with most of my age group, turning on WWE is just habit and they aren't really into seeking out new wrestling, they just know on Monday around 8pm there will be some wrestling on.

It's an uphill battle that nobody wants to fight, because you'll likely take your hits like WCW did with the introduction of Nitro. If they stick it out and keep building I think it could be successful but I think it would take years before the masses would give the show a chance and realistically before they would support it.
Click to expand...

The good thing is, is New Japan is making money hand over fist right now, and continuing to grow. Broadcasting to an American Audience would be playing with house money.

I wouldn't even start trying usurp TNA with Spike...why not try for a show on Fox Sports 1 or some shit.
 
If wrestling gets hot again, networks will come looking.

Until then, nobody is going to put wrestling on TV, especially a product from a different culture.
 
Nakamura has done such a great job elevating that title.

North America should take notes on how to handle secondary titles. That thing was a toss away when MVP & Tanaka held it, just like the NEVER title, and now look at it.
 
So, you're saying it may not be a good idea for the IC Title to be on the preshow and defended once in a blue moon on actual TV?

Or maybe that your secondary champions should win matches and not fodder for the stars?

Weird booking philosophy.
 
FedEx227 said:
So, you're saying it may not be a good idea for the IC Title to be on the preshow and defended once in a blue moon on actual TV?

Or maybe that your secondary champions should win matches and not fodder for the stars?

Weird booking philosophy.
Click to expand...

Ambrose is the U.S. champ.

Without looking it up, I honestly have no idea who the IC champ is atm.
 
Warner2BruceTD said:
Nakamura has done such a great job elevating that title.

North America should take notes on how to handle secondary titles. That thing was a toss away when MVP & Tanaka held it, just like the NEVER title, and now look at it.
Click to expand...

The World Heavyweight Title IS the secondary title in the WWE. Now whether or not you think it is a throwaway title is another story.

The IC and US Title are the equivalent of the NEVER Title or a TV Title or some sort. The days when the IC Title was the B-Circuit belt is long over...now its the WHC.
 
LiquidLarry2GhostWF said:
The World Heavyweight Title IS the secondary title in the WWE. Now whether or not you think it is a throwaway title is another story.

The IC and US Title are the equivalent of the NEVER Title or a TV Title or some sort. The days when the IC Title was the B-Circuit belt is long over...now its the WHC.
Click to expand...

Right. But it doesn't have to be that way, is my point.

And imo, yes, the WHC is a throwaway. It doesn't draw or elevate. Beating that champion never means anything. It curtain jerks WrestleMania.
 
Warner2BruceTD said:
Right. But it doesn't have to be that way, is my point.

And imo, yes, the WHC is a throwaway. It doesn't draw or elevate. Beating that champion never means anything. It curtain jerks WrestleMania.
Click to expand...

The WHC, like the IC title is given to either the token latino "star" (Tito Santana, Rey Mysterio, Del Rio) or a guy they want to elevate (Savage, Steamboat, Warrior, Perfect, Bret, Shawn, Triple H, The Rock, Batista, Edge, Cena, Punk, Danielson)...occasionally, you'll get your Honkey Tonk Man or Greg Valentine in there when they don't know what to do with it (Kane, for example).

The intent is still there...execution on the other hand...well, not so much...they play around with too many guys in that WHC spot for it to mean as much as it did when there were far less shows when the IC title was legit.

I'm not sure if there are many examples where you have a ton of titles meaning something in a single company...I am sure we can perfect book these titles to mean something, but you know that'll never happen, especially when they have so many. I'd say that the NXT Title is more important than the IC or US Title.
 
Latest New Japan fighter roster, I post this every few months, with approximate ranks adjusted a bit by me

NEW JAPAN PRO-WRESTLING
- Hiroshi Tanahashi
- Tetsuya Naito (NEVER Openweight Champion)
- Hirooki Goto
- Togi Makabe
- Yuji Nagata
- Hiroyoshi Tenzan (IWGP Tag Team Champion)
- Satoshi Kojima (IWGP Tag Team Champion)
- Manabu Nakanishi
- Wataru Inoue
- Captain New Japan
- Super Strong Machine
- Takaaki Watanabe
- Sho Tanaka
- Yohei Komatsu

NEW JAPAN PRO-WRESTLING JR. HEAVYWEIGHTS
- Kota Ibushi
- Ryusuke Taguchi
- Tiger Mask (GHC Jr. Heavyweight Tag Team Champion)
- Jushin Thunder Liger (GHC Jr. Heavyweight Tag Team Champion)
- KUSHIDA
- Alex Shelley
- BUSHI
- Hiromu Takahashi
- Kyosuke Mikami

CHAOS
- Kazuchika Okada (IWGP Heavyweight Champion)
- Shinsuke Nakamura (IWGP Intercontinental Champion)
- Toru Yano
- Masato Tanaka (ZERO1)
- Yujiro Takahashi
- Tomohiro Ishii
- Takashi Iizuka
- YOSHI-HASHI
- Rocky Romero
- Alex Koslov
- Gedo
- Jado

BULLET CLUB
- Prince Devitt (IWGP Jr. Heavyweight Champion)
- “The Machine Gun” Karl Anderson
- King Fale
- Tama Tonga
- Nick Jackson
- Matt Jackson

SUZUKI GUN
- Minoru Suzuki (Pancrase)
- Lance Archer (NWA World Tag Team Champion)
- Davey Boy Smith Jr. (NWA World Tag Team Champion)
- Shelton "X" Benjamin
- TAKA Michinoku (K-DOJO) (IWGP Junior Heavyweight Tag Team Champion)
- Taichi (IWGP Junior Heavyweight Tag Team Champion)

LAUGHTER7
- Kazushi Sakuraba
- Katsuyori Shibata

NEW JAPAN FACTORY (MMA)
- Katsuhiko Nagata
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I don't care what anybody says, obviously CHAOS are babyfaces, at worst tweeners. Okada, Nakamura, Ishii are definitely faces. Yano, Iizuka, Yujiro, Tanaka and the rest are probably heels, but even Yano gets face reactions. But Forever Hooligans were the face team when they faced TAKA & Taichi.

SUZUKI GUN are clearly heels, although Suzuki was a clear face vs Yano.

To me, Bullet Club has replaced CHAOS as the second heel group.

I included Young Bucks, since they are headlining all tour long and appear to be more than a one shot deal. I expect them to win the Junior Tag League that starts Friday morning.
 
NJPW, 10/25/13 (Samurai! TV/USTREAM iPPV)
Tokyo Korakuen Hall

1. Super Jr. Tag Tournament 2013 – Round 1: KUSHIDA & Yohei Komatsu vs. Valiente (CMLL) & BUSHI
2. Super Jr. Tag Tournament 2013 – Round 1: Brian Kendrick & Baretta vs. Matt Jackson & Nick Jackson
3. Super Jr. Tag Tournament 2013 – Round 1: Jushin Thunder Liger & Tiger Mask vs. Jado & Gedo
4. Super Jr. Tag Tournament 2013 – Round 1: Rocky Romero & Alex Koslov vs. TAKA Michinoku (Kaientai Dojo) & Taichi
5. Sho Tanaka vs. Minoru Suzuki
6. Hiroyoshi Tenzan & Captain New Japan vs. Manabu Nakanishi & Tomoaki Honma
7. Hiroshi Tanahashi, Togi Makabe & Yuji Nagata vs. Toru Yano, Takashi Iizuka & Tomohiro Ishii
8. Tetsuya Naito & Kota Ibushi vs. Masato Tanaka (ZERO1) & Yujiro Takahashi
9. Kazuchika Okada, Shinsuke Nakamura & YOSHI-HASHI vs. Karl Anderson, Prince Devitt & Bad Luck Fale
 
Warner2BruceTD said:
NJPW, 10/25/13 (Samurai! TV/USTREAM iPPV)
Tokyo Korakuen Hall

1. Super Jr. Tag Tournament 2013 – Round 1: KUSHIDA & Yohei Komatsu vs. Valiente (CMLL) & BUSHI
2. Super Jr. Tag Tournament 2013 – Round 1: Brian Kendrick & Baretta vs. Matt Jackson & Nick Jackson
3. Super Jr. Tag Tournament 2013 – Round 1: Jushin Thunder Liger & Tiger Mask vs. Jado & Gedo
4. Super Jr. Tag Tournament 2013 – Round 1: Rocky Romero & Alex Koslov vs. TAKA Michinoku (Kaientai Dojo) & Taichi
5. Sho Tanaka vs. Minoru Suzuki
6. Hiroyoshi Tenzan & Captain New Japan vs. Manabu Nakanishi & Tomoaki Honma
7. Hiroshi Tanahashi, Togi Makabe & Yuji Nagata vs. Toru Yano, Takashi Iizuka & Tomohiro Ishii
8. Tetsuya Naito & Kota Ibushi vs. Masato Tanaka (ZERO1) & Yujiro Takahashi
9. Kazuchika Okada, Shinsuke Nakamura & YOSHI-HASHI vs. Karl Anderson, Prince Devitt & Bad Luck Fale
Click to expand...

TONIGHT - $15

First of FOUR New Japan iPPV's over the next month. Here, TAKE ALL MY MONEY.

11/6 Korakuen is Junior Tag League semis & finals - #$15
11/9 Power Struggle from Osaka - $25
11/23 World Tag League (Korakuen) - $15

Love the tired pricing structure, they don't try to gouge you for Korakuen shows, only the major traditional PPV's.
 
Warner2BruceTD said:
NJPW, 10/25/13 (Samurai! TV/USTREAM iPPV)
Tokyo Korakuen Hall

1. Super Jr. Tag Tournament 2013 – Round 1: KUSHIDA & Yohei Komatsu vs. Valiente (CMLL) & BUSHI
2. Super Jr. Tag Tournament 2013 – Round 1: Brian Kendrick & Baretta vs. Matt Jackson & Nick Jackson
3. Super Jr. Tag Tournament 2013 – Round 1: Jushin Thunder Liger & Tiger Mask vs. Jado & Gedo
4. Super Jr. Tag Tournament 2013 – Round 1: Rocky Romero & Alex Koslov vs. TAKA Michinoku (Kaientai Dojo) & Taichi
5. Sho Tanaka vs. Minoru Suzuki
6. Hiroyoshi Tenzan & Captain New Japan vs. Manabu Nakanishi & Tomoaki Honma
7. Hiroshi Tanahashi, Togi Makabe & Yuji Nagata vs. Toru Yano, Takashi Iizuka & Tomohiro Ishii
8. Tetsuya Naito & Kota Ibushi vs. Masato Tanaka (ZERO1) & Yujiro Takahashi
9. Kazuchika Okada, Shinsuke Nakamura & YOSHI-HASHI vs. Karl Anderson, Prince Devitt & Bad Luck Fale
Click to expand...

Review here: http://www.voicesofwrestling.com/20...wrestling-road-to-power-struggle-1025-review/
 
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