UFC 105: Couture vs. Vera

[Steel Mamba]

The Vera/Couture fight just sums up so many problems with MMA scoring in the states, one guy stops the other guy from doing what he wanted to do, Vera stuffed almost every TD attmept, Vera got the a TD and mount and landed the only damaging shot of the fight and still lost because a guy pushed him into the cage for the majority of the fight

Not saying Vera did anything special or beat up Randy, but I really dont know how guys win decisions like when they do nothing but press you up against the cage, you keep giving guys decision wins like this and thats what they will keep doing

I think you gotta mount some offense to win a round, just being defensive isn't enough. Yeah, what Couture did wasn't exciting, but it's not like Vera was left without an option, get him off of you, stay off the cage, and attack. He couldn't do that so I agree with the judges on this one. But, this is another perfect example of 3 rounds not being enough for a pro MMA fight. You drop one round in a close fight and you're done.

 

[SHOGUN]

I think the fights last night (not only the Couture fight) showed exactly why some people prefer the ring to the cage.

Yup.

Randy Couture's song and dance would be damn near useless with a ring and would force him to strike or actually get a takedown. Ideally, he'd lose 10% of his purse and get carded.


Ring > Cage.

 

[Liquidrob]

Yup.

Randy Couture's song and dance would be damn near useless with a ring and would force him to strike or actually get a takedown. Ideally, he'd lose 10% of his purse and get carded.

Ring > Cage.

 

[KINGOFOOTBALL]

The Vera/Couture fight just sums up so many problems with MMA scoring in the states, one guy stops the other guy from doing what he wanted to do, Vera stuffed almost every TD attmept, Vera got the a TD and mount and landed the only damaging shot of the fight and still lost because a guy pushed him into the cage for the majority of the fight

Not saying Vera did anything special or beat up Randy, but I really dont know how guys win decisions like when they do nothing but press you up against the cage, you keep giving guys decision wins like this and thats what they will keep doing

What does one ((i.e the people in charge)) have to do to change it ?

Im getting tired of the refs/judges. Takedowns mean to much "holding" means too much and is allowed for too long.
And I dont mean guys who are actually trying to gain position. Hard to describe but BJJ guys who seem to be setting up for a shift or sub get seperated alot quicker than a wrestler just pinning a guy down.



BTW on a completely seperate note. I think its time guys start coming up with some new submissions. Leg locks are extinct , kimuras/armlocks guys are getting nullified left and right. Last UFC sub I was impressed by was thet kid from TUF who pulled off a Peruvian necktie or whatever he called it.
I wanna see more! Bring Aoki in just to mix it up.

 

[Warner2BruceTD]

I fell asleep half way through Couture/Vera, and had no desire to go back and watch the rest of it (despite having it on the DVR). Two fighters who do nothing for me, in a boring fight.

As for cage vs. ring, please. It's a non debate. The ring leads to sloppy fights with guys falling between the ropes, the refs constantly moving the guys to the middle, and guys grabbing the ropes. Besides being incredibly unsafe, the fighters also lose the ability to use the cage for leverage which is a huge stratigical part of MMA. The ring os for boxing, the cage is for MMA. Even DREAM has begun the transition.

 

[Kuzzy Powers]

I think its becoming pretty evident with judging that they give the edge to established, or likeable fighters.. or in the instance of Machida, the champion.. as opposed to doing what they're supposed to and fucking doing real judging. Theres no question ive seen bias in some of the decisions ive seen lately in the UFC.

 

[Liquidrob]

What does one ((i.e the people in charge)) have to do to change it ?

Im getting tired of the refs/judges. Takedowns mean to much "holding" means too much and is allowed for too long.
And I dont mean guys who are actually trying to gain position. Hard to describe but BJJ guys who seem to be setting up for a shift or sub get seperated alot quicker than a wrestler just pinning a guy down.



BTW on a completely seperate note. I think its time guys start coming up with some new submissions. Leg locks are extinct , kimuras/armlocks guys are getting nullified left and right. Last UFC sub I was impressed by was thet kid from TUF who pulled off a Peruvian necktie or whatever he called it.
I wanna see more! Bring Aoki in just to mix it up.

Education is the only way, these judges just dont know what they are looking at

You have Cecil Peoples saying Machida beat Shogun because Machida stopped all his takedowns, etc..when Shogun outstruck Machida than you have Vera stopping pretty much every TD and landing one of his own and it holds no weight it seems and he did the most damge standing, no one knows what they are watching or what to judge

I dont like scoring rounds, but that probably wont change, so atleast educate these guys on what they are watching, not ex boxing guys who dont know what a sub attempt is, etc...

 

[Liquidrob]

lol, just seen this posted on the UG

"I had a conversation with Doug Crosby, and he said that during one of the [UFC] fights, one of these boxing people that have come over and started judging MMA...someone was attempting a submission, and this person turned to him and said, 'what is he doing?' How CRAZY is that? This is a professional mixed martial arts judge at the highest level of the sport, someone who is judging an Ultimate Fighting Championship bout, between two guys that are professional fighters....their careers are on the line, it's a huge contest, two equally skilled guys in a hotly contested match, and the judge has literally no idea what's going on."

Joe Rogan on Gross Pointe Blank-

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/podcasts/josh_gross/

 

[SHOGUN]

"I had a conversation with Doug Crosby, and he said that during one of the [UFC] fights, one of these boxing people that have come over and started judging MMA...someone was attempting a submission, and this person turned to him and said, 'what is he doing?' How CRAZY is that? This is a professional mixed martial arts judge at the highest level of the sport, someone who is judging an Ultimate Fighting Championship bout, between two guys that are professional fighters....their careers are on the line, it's a huge contest, two equally skilled guys in a hotly contested match, and the judge has literally no idea what's going on."

 

[Warner2BruceTD]

Education is the only way, these judges just dont know what they are looking at

You have Cecil Peoples saying Machida beat Shogun because Machida stopped all his takedowns, etc..when Shogun outstruck Machida than you have Vera stopping pretty much every TD and landing one of his own and it holds no weight it seems and he did the most damge standing, no one knows what they are watching or what to judge

I dont like scoring rounds, but that probably wont change, so atleast educate these guys on what they are watching, not ex boxing guys who dont know what a sub attempt is, etc...

This.

These judges are boxing/kickboxking/karate/etc guys, because the athletic commissions dont have enough knowledgable MMA people to do the job.

You cant let UFC/Strikeforce/whoever choose the judges, due to coflict of interest. It's a rock and a hard place.

I think the refs should rotate and double as judges. Either that or media types like Stephen Quadros and Dave Meltzer...guys like that know what they are doing, and judged in the early days before the commissions took over.

 

[Kuzzy Powers]

lol, just seen this posted on the UG



http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/podcasts/josh_gross/

Thats fucked up..