Whitlock is now pushing it..

[EmpireWF]

The hamburglar had me rollin'

 

[bcransom]

http://msn.foxsports.com/collegefoo...s-so-wheres-the-outrage-jason-whitlock-110110

Two articles in a week on this?

Now he is just seemingly exploting this kids death for columns.

The entire tone of this story is "Why didn't anyone pay attention to my column last week?"

This. Exactly. Give Kelly a break, Jesus fucking Christ. The man must be in a hell of guilt, and to question the sincerity of his apology is just classless and wrong.

 

[FedEx227]

Actually judging by Kelly's comments in the aftermath and his actions during I don't think he is under a ton of guilt.

The first thing he mentioned when asked about the wind conditions was something to the effect of "well we still had a very productive practice"

 

[FirstTimer]

Actually judging by Kelly's comments in the aftermath and his actions during I don't think he is under a ton of guilt.

The first thing he mentioned when asked about the wind conditions was something to the effect of "well we still had a very productive practice"

Not so much.

He said the intention that day was to have a safe and productive practice when asked why he was practicing in the conditions.

I think it's a tad ridiculous and overlooking the obvious as to why Kelly hasn't said much of anything other than saying the expected "we are sad etc etc"

I would imagine Notre Dame has a good amount of lawyers telling people what to say and when to say it. Did anyone really expect Kelly to come out and say "all my fault" the day after this thing happened?

 

[FedEx227]

Not so much.

He said the intention that day was to have a safe and productive practice when asked why he was practicing in the conditions.

He did though.

"You have to be able to look at the weather conditions and find out whether you believe it's going to be a productive day, first. We believed it to be productive, it was productive, obviously up until the tragedy," Kelly said, speaking to reporters after Notre Dame's 28-27 loss to Tulsa.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=5744730

 

[ralaw]

I would imagine Notre Dame has a good amount of lawyers telling people what to say and when to say it. Did anyone really expect Kelly to come out and say "all my fault" the day after this thing happened?

I know President Jenkins has come out and said Notre Dame is responsible for the death of Sullivan. I'm not sure of Kelly's involvement, but I'd assume there is much blame that could go around to all involved.

"Declan Sullivan was entrusted to our care, and we failed to keep him safe," Jenkins wrote. "We at Notre Dame, and ultimately I, as president, are responsible. Words cannot express our sorrow to the Sullivan family and to all involved."

I can't say I'm surprised be this admission though, because it's was just the plain facts of the incident. I thought it was funny that supporters of ND where saying, "lets wait for the facts," because the facts where that Sullivan was obviously told by someone to get up there (or wasn't told to get down), which equates to ND being negligent and responsible.

 

[FirstTimer]

He did though.


http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=5744730

That's not the first thing he said though.

Those comments were after the Tulsa game 3 days later.

His initial comments on late Wednesday or early Thursday were the ones I posted above.

 

[FirstTimer]

I know President Jenkins has come out and said Notre Dame is responsible for the death of Sullivan. I'm not sure of Kelly's involvement, but I'd assume there is much blame that could go around to all involved.



I can't say I'm surprised be this admission though, because it's was just the plain facts of the incident. I thought it was funny that supporters of ND where saying, "lets wait for the facts," because the facts where that Sullivan was obviously told by someone to get up there (or wasn't told to get down), which equates to ND being negligent and responsible.

I think that was more a reaction to people calling for Kelly's head/job. I don't think any Notre Dame fan felt like Notre Dame or people there weren't responsible. I just think the "wait for the facts" thing was a response aimed at people like Whitlock and some others who were calling for Kelly's job before anyone really knew who told him to get up there or stay up there.

 

[Hitman]

“I made the decision that we could have a productive and safe practice outdoors,” Kelly said. “Productive because the conditions were such, although windy, were not unlike many days that I had practiced at other universities, including here at the University of Notre Dame. Productive practice is important obviously within our offense, as well. Throwing the football, you have to be able to look at the weather conditions and find out whether you believe it’s going to be a productive day first. We believed it to be productive. It was productive, obviously up until the tragedy.

“The next thing that is important is that it’s a safe session, that the practice must be safe.”

Kelly has no idea he has the whole thing backwards. He is in charge of kids. Safety trumps all other priorities, including productivity. Safety is not “the next thing.” It’s the only thing. Football is a dangerous game by nature. Physical risks are built into the game for everyone involved. Adults are put in charge of “games” first and foremost to oversee safety concerns.

This is where Whitlock loses me in this particular article. I'm trying to look at this objectively, like I hadn't read any of his drivel before.

They aren't kids. Kelly isn't responsible for the safety of 9 years olds here. All of the people on that field are 18+. All adults. If the guy thought it might not be safe for him to be up there, it is ultimately his responsibility to ask to be brought down.

Now, I'm not saying that Kelly has no responsibility here; he shouldn't have had the guy up there in the first place if there were 50 mph winds etc, but it isn't all his fault. There was a lot of common sense not being used that day.

 

[ralaw]

They aren't kids. Kelly isn't responsible for the safety of 9 years olds here. All of the people on that field are 18+. All adults. If the guy thought it might not be safe for him to be up there, it is ultimately his responsibility to ask to be brought down.

I'm not sure how true that is. President Jenkins even said, "Sullivan was entrusted to our care, and we failed to keep him safe". I understand a majority of the players are 18+, but I'm not sure the "he's 18..he's an adult" excuse would apply and if it were it certainly would be in bad taste. The responsibility goes far beyond Sullivan just saying "eh, I'm not going up there," as there are federal and state workplace safety rules and standards that must be maintained.

 

[Hitman]

I'm not sure how true that is. President Jenkins even said, "Sullivan was entrusted to our care, and we failed to keep him safe". I understand a majority of the players are 18+, but I'm not sure the "he's 18..he's an adult" excuse would apply and if it were it certainly would be in bad taste. The responsibility goes far beyond Sullivan just saying "eh, I'm not going up there," as there are federal and state workplace safety rules and standards that must be maintained.

Bad taste it is. But sometimes you have to say things in bad taste to get a point across. If the guy thought it was unsafe, he shouldn't have been up there. I'm sure he had been on this scissor lift many many times before. As an adult, 18 or 40, it is ultimately my responsibility to decide if it is worth me getting hurt or losing my life or whatever for a job.

This isn't like people working in a factory and not having sufficient fire escapes available. I doubt the guy would have been fired if he said,"Hey guys, it's pretty windy, I think I should come down until this wind lets up."

 

[ralaw]

Bad taste it is. But sometimes you have to say things in bad taste to get a point across. If the guy thought it was unsafe, he shouldn't have been up there. I'm sure he had been on this scissor lift many many times before. As an adult, 18 or 40, it is ultimately my responsibility to decide if it is worth me getting hurt or losing my life or whatever for a job.

This isn't like people working in a factory and not having sufficient fire escapes available. I doubt the guy would have been fired if he said,"Hey guys, it's pretty windy, I think I should come down until this wind lets up."

It is understood that he could have said that he wasn't going up there, but that point is irrelevant in this discussion, because as I said the school is ultimately responsible, as there are safety regulations that must be maintained.

Sullivan saying he wasn't going up there possibly could have avoided the situation, but that can't be proven. The responsibilty ultimately goes on ND for allowing him (or not stopping him) from going up there in the first place. As I said there are federal and state workplace safety rules and standards that must be maintained and ND failed to meet those standards.

 

[Hitman]

It is understood that he could have said that he wasn't going up there, but that point is irrelevant in this discussion, because as I said the school is ultimately responsible, as there are safety regulations that must be maintained.

Sullivan saying he wasn't going up there possibly could have avoided the situation, but that can't be proven. The responsibilty ultimately goes on ND for allowing him (or not stopping him) from going up there in the first place. As I said there are federal and state workplace safety rules and standards that must be maintained and ND failed to meet those standards.

I agree completely. ND is responsible legally for this happening. What I was saying is that blaming them completely for the accident isn't fair. In the matter of a lawsuit, which is sure to be coming if it hasn't already, ND should be found liable.

In reality the guy lost his life because he was up on a platform in 60 mph winds. He is an adult. It is his responsibility that if he doesn't feel safe in a situation to remove himself from that situation.

It may be callous and in bad taste to say it, but sometimes life requires people to not be worried about others feelings and tell them what the reality of situations are. You can't baby people forever.