Eli Manning...

[Liquidrob]

I think HOF criteria should be fluid for all players. Every career is different. Stats, achievements, all of that needs to be placed into context.

Why should we be locked into this train of thought of, "well, that's SB number two, he has top be in, that's that"? Shouldn't we be more sophisticated in our thought process than that, instead of repeating media narratives based on standards somebody came up with 30 years ago?

Somewhere along the way, thanks in part to slow motion, dramatic NFL Films footage and the enormity of what the game has become, we have turned the performances of QB's in this game into mythology. When the team wins, of course. Had Brady stuck it in the end zone on the final drive, suddenly Eli isn't as clutch anymore. Huh?

Eli has had 2 amazing runs in the playoffs to win 2 Super Bowls, it's not like he was a long for the ride on great defensive teams

He is Money in the 4th quater and has made it his game to 'win' coming from behind, I am not a 'rings' guy either and Dan Marino is better than almost any QB ever IMO, but when a guy wins 2 Super Bowls and has the run he had in both playoffs, road wins, underdog against an 18-0 team, come from behind and throws that were amazing, etc... he has a strong case to make it when his career is OVER, not right now, but when it is over

Eli is a different case than the classic HOF guy, he has had his ups and downs, but he has put on great games in big games, made great runs, etc...he is not Vinny T, Bledsoe, and the like some guys keep throwing out there either

Is Eli a John Elway? hell no, but he has his place with what he has done so far and he still has some good years left

[Tailback U]

I agree with you, Warner. I think most do. I think a lot of us are just saying he is going to get there and this 2nd super bowl certainly helps his chances and it should.

Eli took down what mosh considered the best team in the NfL and SB champs on the road, the best defense in the league on the road, and Bill Belichick and Tom Brady in the Super Bowl. He has had 2 amazing post seasons now and he is only 31. Im not going to say he is a hall of gamer yet, but I expect him to get there.

Sidenote, I thought it was interesting to watch the Pats let the Giants get that TD but I can't say I disagree with the move.

Correct me if I'm wrong but there was 1:09 left on the clock
and the Pats had 2 timeouts left when they got the ball back?

[MrBill]

Wow, I'm impressed. Just when I think we've successfully navigated a thread about NFL quarterbacks without Mr Bill shoehorning a perceived slight against Brett Favre into it, he manages to prove everybody wrong.

It's also accurate. You can't use an extrapolation of current production for one Manning and not the other

[shag773]

It really is, I can't believe the failure to comprehend this.


The idea that, well, Eli has two SB's now, he should be in because of that, is what brings this full circle.

Why do we have to think this way? Can't we dig deeper, examine the entire picture, and put things into context?

I'm not sure if anybody here is thinking this, but you just know there are writers and pundits and fans and observers and experts and bloggers who are putting him in Canton today, yet wouldn't be had Brady led a TD drive at the end of the game. And that makes no sense to me and never will.

I get what you're saying.

Really, I do.

I don't want to dig deeper. I don't have the time. Even if I had the time, I wouldn't waste it analyzing plays he made, didn't make, should of made, could of made, or would of made.

I see a guy who won two super bowls, leading game winning drives in each game, and being named MVP in both games. Last time I checked, the list of players with 2 or more SB MVPs or did not include Bledsoe or Testaverde.

Call me lazy. Call me a bad fan. Whatever. He's going in the HOF, and I don't have a problem with it.

[Liquidrob]

I agree with you, Warner. I think most do. I think a lot of us are just saying he is going to get there and this 2nd super bowl certainly helps his chances and it should.

I thought it was interesting to watch the Pats let the Giants get that TD but I can't say I disagree with the move.

Correct me if I'm wrong but there was 1:09 left on the clock
and the Pats had 2 timeouts left when they got the ball back?

They had 1 time out left I believe

[Warner2BruceTD]

LOL and it's the "stat geeks" who have removed the subtleties and nuance from sports. Right.

The "stat geeks" the ones who are ignoring context, not the mouth breathers who parrot studio banter as if its canon. Right.

And the irony here, is I didn't bring stats into this. It was the Eli fan club that dragged his numbers into it.

I'm squarely on the Eli HOF fence (but leaning no at this point), despite the fact his stats are not HOF worthy (and make no mistake, he does not have HOF numbers). If he's getting in, it's because of peripherals, not numbers, and i'm ok with that. A stat geek would never put him in, because he doesn't cut it on a statistical standard.

His performance last night shouldn't tilt the scale. Unfortunately, for some, it will.

[FirstTimer]

Come from behind wins is one of the most overrated stats in football, especially in dealing with QB to QB comparison.

[shag773]

Come from behind wins is one of the most overrated stats in football, especially in dealing with QB to QB comparison.

Agreed. However, game winning TD drives in the last 2 minutes of the SB is not. It's actually underrated, especially in Eli's case....

[FirstTimer]

Agreed. However, game winning TD drives in the last 2 minutes of the SB is not. It's actually underrated, especially in Eli's case....

No need for the comeback if Eli plays better the rest of the game.

[Champ]

Eli did this in a year where the critics were doubting him from day one. He lost his go to guy in Steve Smith and his other safety basket in Kevin Boss.

[Liquidrob]

And the irony here, is I didn't bring stats into this. It was the Eli fan club that dragged his numbers into it.

I'm squarely on the Eli HOF fence (but leaning no at this point), despite the fact his stats are not HOF worthy (and make no mistake, he does not have HOF numbers). If he's getting in, it's because of peripherals, not numbers, and i'm ok with that. A stat geek would never put him in, because he doesn't cut it on a statistical standard.

His performance last night shouldn't tilt the scale. Unfortunately, for some, it will.

Why shouldnt it tilt the scale? You come off like you just want to talk about his stats but than say it's not just about stats the next time or whatever

The facts are he played a great game and had another great playoff run, lead the team on a great drive and made an awesome throw, of course it tilts in his favor, Super Bowls are not everything (to some they are) but they always add to it, especially when you play like Eli did and out playing Brady in the process

I would lean towards him getting in at this point

[shag773]

No need for the comeback if Eli plays better the rest of the game.

[MrBill]

I would lean towards him getting in at this point

I think any reasonable person would lean towards him getting in if he maintains his average level of production for another 5 seasons. He doesn't even have to win another title. He should almost get in for holding the record on the number of road wins in the playoffs alone but the two Super Bowl wins and MVP trophies cement that provided he puts up some more stats.

[FirstTimer]

Why shouldnt it tilt the scale? You come off like you just want to talk about his stats but than say it's not just about stats the next time or whatever

The facts are he played a great game and had another great playoff run, lead the team on a great drive and made an awesome throw, of course it tilts in his favor, Super Bowls are not everything (to some they are) but they always add to it, especially when you play like Eli did and out playing Brady in the process

I would lean towards him getting in at this point

Arguable at best.

[mgoblue2290]

By the time all of the QBs finish their careers that played in this era with Eli, his average production level will not look all that special. A ton of guys playing right now are going to end up top 15 and guys after them will also break in. When deciding if a guy is HOF worthy you have to view it in the context in which they played. Eli, right now, is not a HOFer based on that. Sure if you compare to him guys who played in the 70's he looks wonderful, but so do a bunch of other guys.

That said, the Giants fans in this thread have it right. Who gives a fuck about the HOF, Eli has helped bring them 2 Super Bowl wins and that is what matters. Anyone who has played sports competitively, even if its just a pick up game, knows that the win is more important than individual performance.