The General Wrestling Thread

[Warner2BruceTD]

So i've spent the better part of the day watching TNA main event promos going back to late 2008/early 2009 (Main Event Mafia era), attempting to track the various factions (Immortal, Fortune, etc), heel/face turns, etc. I was going to do a big write up on who hates who and why, make fun of the lack of logic, all kinds of good stuff, but...

The shit is so convoluted and confusing that it's impossible to even make enough sense out of it to shit on it. And with some of the recent stuff, it's nearly impossible to tell teh heels from the faces. And not in a "everyone is a shade of gray" way, just in a "this shit is garbage" way.

[Kuzzy Powers]

Otguna looks like a star to me, until he opens his mouth and its just disastrous.

[Bigpapa42]

So i've spent the better part of the day watching TNA main event promos going back to late 2008/early 2009 (Main Event Mafia era), attempting to track the various factions (Immortal, Fortune, etc), heel/face turns, etc. I was going to do a big write up on who hates who and why, make fun of the lack of logic, all kinds of good stuff, but...

The shit is so convoluted and confusing that it's impossible to even make enough sense out of it to shit on it. And with some of the recent stuff, it's nearly impossible to tell teh heels from the faces. And not in a "everyone is a shade of gray" way, just in a "this shit is garbage" way.

Jesus Christ, you really are a masocist, aren't you?

TNA has reached the point with that stuff that its almost like a lot of the fans have stopped trying to care because TNA has clearly stopped trying to follow any sort of "logic" at all. Some of the most ardent TNA supporters on a couple boards I visit seem to be getting tired and bitter at their crap, with them finding fewer and fewer ways to justify the garbage.

I just feel bad for the actual talented workers that TNA has who put in some amount of effort to get fuck all in return but a paycheque. If they were even halfway competently run, they could be doing so much better.

[BigBiss]

that has to be the most wrestling on a raw in awhile, even with the opening forever HHH promo (that was atleast intresting) I like the fact that the midcard is being built, Kofi and Del rio has been going for awhile, still working on Killings and Morrison and Rey and Miz have something going. all this with seeds of Del Rio moving up to the main, Miz or Rey moving back at some time. also seem to be starting Dolph and Riely witch if they can find a way to streatch out for awhile will make things intresting. you guys are expecting Rome to be rebuilt in a Day, this is some of the most intresting TV in a very long time, and with the same cookie cutter writing staff from the last what 5 years, for the most part. Its still New York but atleast its something diffrent.

[BigBiss]

So i've spent the better part of the day watching TNA main event promos going back to late 2008/early 2009 (Main Event Mafia era), attempting to track the various factions (Immortal, Fortune, etc), heel/face turns, etc. I was going to do a big write up on who hates who and why, make fun of the lack of logic, all kinds of good stuff, but...

The shit is so convoluted and confusing that it's impossible to even make enough sense out of it to shit on it. And with some of the recent stuff, it's nearly impossible to tell teh heels from the faces. And not in a "everyone is a shade of gray" way, just in a "this shit is garbage" way.

Sting is doing a shitty Heath Ledger inpersonation ... in 2011 how much farther can you fall

[EmpireWF]

Sting is doing a shitty Heath Ledger inpersonation ... in 2011 how much farther can you fall

shitty is too good a description for it.


For what it's worth, Cabana wrestled a dark match before the SD tapings tonight.

[s@ppisgod]

I used to really like TNA despite it's obvious drawbacks. But it's gone from flawed to just throwing darts to see who is a face or a heel or who will get a push this month. Hogan and Bischoff made that place 100x worse than it aready was. Russo is garbage, as usual. Dixie is a dingbat. They've fallen so far since having Cornette and D'Amore around. Nobody in the process has 3/4ths of half a clue. I went from buying 3, maybe 4 PPVs a year in 06/07 to not even watching Impact but about twice this year. It's worthless.
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[SHOGUN]

Sting is doing a shitty Heath Ledger inpersonation ... in 2011 how much farther can you fall

I think he's more Cesar Romero than Heath Ledger. There's no dark edge to this Sting at all.

[IamMedellin]

I think he's more Cesar Romero than Heath Ledger. There's no dark edge to this Sting at all.

Seems more Jim carrey, its very over the top and wince inducing

[dave]

Sting is doing a shitty Heath Ledger inpersonation ... in 2011 how much farther can you fall

Sting should just sign his Wrestlemania 28 contract and end the career after it.

[dave]

This angle is dead, finished, over, killed, done.

I shouldn't be surprised that they blew it, because they drop the ball on anything that is gift wrapped and easy to book.

-WCW invasion
Agree completely. I think they should have kept WCW a separate brand for a while and just put it on Smackdown.

-ECW revival
There was a market for this, but McMahon didn't understand that market. He could have easily had a solid minor league talent feeder here and made money.

-NWO return
IMO, this was ruined by Hulk's WM match with The Rock. I don't really blame this one on Vince, Hulk's fans wanted him back, Scott Hall was deteriorating and Kevin Nash was old.

-Goldberg
Not sure how Vince could have done with Goldberg. I get the impression Goldberg was simply in it for the pay check at this point.

-Ric Flair vs. Hulk Hogan
This angers me to this day. Could have been the event of the century (frankly as big as Andre-Hogan), and Vince destroyed it. I loved how WCW tried to re-create it a few years later ... and failed big time.

-Summer of Punk II
Just came back waaaaaaayyyy too early ... and they're letting HHH be his equal on the mic, which is stupid. Everyone is coming off as a face here - Cena, HHH and Punk. That never works.


All paint-by-numbers, million dollar angles HANDED TO THEM ON A SILVER PLATTER, all blown to varying degrees because they tried to get too cute and put their personal stamp on every single one.

-WCW, booked to look like geeks, dominted by WWE side at every turn, burned through months of storylines in ONE NIGHT at the RAW where the "merged" with ECW. Oh, and Stephanie McMahon was involved, killing it for the demo the needed to capture to make it work. FAIL.

-ECW, monster DVD sales, monster PPV burate, ZERO follow up for nearly ONE YEAR because they did not want to admit the success. Then Vince declared that "only 1,000 east coast fans care about the old ECW", choosing to ignore that waaaay more than 1,000 people bought the DVD and the PPV. FAIL.

-NWO, no edge and booked in goofy storylines like hitting The Rock with a truck. FAIL.

-Goldberg, all they had to do was repeat the winning streak and leave him alone. The people wanted it. Instead, they changed his music, changed his tights, and had him doing comedy skits with Goldust on his first night. How the hell do you whiff on GOLDBERG? FAIL.

-Ric Flair vs Hulk Hogan, the most anticipated match possibly ever. Easy to book, just have the heel Flair talk shit about Hogan until WrestleMania, keep them apart until then, and boom, one million buys minimum. Nope. Wrestled every night on a house show loop, killing the novelty of the first match. Flair's character WWE-ized by dropping the trash talking playboy act, and turning up the volume on the insane wildman act all the way up. Flair, imo, never recovered from this and was never the same.

-Summer of Punk II, another layup, just keep the guy away for a couple of months, let him do more "shoots" at random indy shows and public appearances, and have him tell the world that he is showing up at SummerSlam. NEVER MENTION HIS NAME ON TV. It's 2011, viral marketing does the work for you, especially for the hardcores who fell for the gimmick hook, line, and sinker. Instead, they keep him away ONE FUCKING WEEK, and all of the edge and "coolness" of the angle is sucked away when he walks out on RAW 8 days after MITB. Innovative, cutting edge angle dead, same old boring uninteresting shit alive and well. Punk went from breaking through to pop culture to latest McMahon family TV foil. It's over.

What connects it all? None of these things were created by Vince, so in his mind, they can't possibly be good ideas or work unless they manipulate them. What connects and doesnt connect with the audience is subtle. Ringmaster fails, Stone Cold is the biggest star ever. Tom Magee fails, Hogan is an icon. You change the dynamic, ever so slightly, you yield different results. By changing the dynamic of these simple stories, Vince McMahon has left millions on the table, and its why I always say he's the least successful sometimes billionaire ever. If it wasnt for Hogan, and then Stone Cold, Vince is likely out of business like everyone else.

See above.

[s@ppisgod]

The only thing that matters in the Punk angle is they took it from something new, interesting, and captivating and turned it into another cookie-cutter angle. It doesn't matter if Trips or Vince is in charge, it doesn't matter if Cena or Rey are intirim. The only thing that mattered was CM Punk going out, selling the "no contract" thing and saying things he wasn't supposed to. Things like the Comic Con run-in was what made this angle a bigger deal than even some of their biggest angles in recent history. Things like that belt pose-down made it irrelevant. The people who still care about this angle are the E fans who care about any main angle they have. The critics, who were pretty much unanimous in how good it was, are also united in how bad it's gotten.
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[EmpireWF]

HHH is playing a subtle heel. Eventually they have to be doing Punk vs. HHH...whether they ever actually wrestle or not, I guess we can assume they will.

[dave]

HHH is playing a subtle heel. Eventually they have to be doing Punk vs. HHH...whether they ever actually wrestle or not, I guess we can assume they will.

The problem so far is HHH is coming out feeling like a face. To his credit, he's doing a great job in these promos. Never been a HHH fan, I find his in-ring style boring and most of his success based on Shawn Michaels and Stephanie McMahon. Without either, he's a mid-carder IMO.

[EmpireWF]

The problem so far is HHH is coming out feeling like a face. To his credit, he's doing a great job in these promos. Never been a HHH fan, I find his in-ring style boring and most of his success based on Shawn Michaels and Stephanie McMahon. Without either, he's a mid-carder IMO.

In 99, Shawn had no influence and there was no relationship with Stephanie and that's when he really became a main eventer.

As for whether he gets the breaks he did in 1997 if he wasn't friends with Shawn, that's a logical debate.