Sports Illustrated's "Baseball's Greatest"

[dell71]

Sports Illustrated's Greatest Shortstops

1. Honus Wagner
2. Cal Ripken Jr.
3. Derek Jeter
4. Ozzie Smith
5. Ernie Banks
6. Arky Vaughan
7. Alex Rodriguez
8. Barry Larkin
9. Robin Yount
10. Joe Cronin

 

[dell71]

My initial reaction to SI's list of shortstops is if you're calling A-Rod a SS how is he behind anyone not named Wagner? The rest of it just feels like the order is way off, but I'll see what I come up with in comparison.

Now for my guy who should be eliminated from the HoF. It hurts a bit because he's a Yankee. The truth is that even when I was a (relative) youngster who had never heard of Bill James or SABRmetrics and the Vet's Committee elected him mostly because his fans loudly campaigned for it, I never thought Phil Rizzuto should be in the Hall. No claims could be made that he was ever among the greatest shortstops of all time and pales in comparison to many of his own contemporaries.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/r/rizzuph01.shtml

 

[dell71]

Okay, going with this at SS...remember I slotted A-Rod @ 3B...

1. Honus Wagner
2. Cal Ripken Jr.
3. Derek Jeter
4. Arky Vaughan
5. Barry Larkin
6. Ozzie Smith
7. Robin Yount
8. Ernie Banks
9. Luke Appling
10. George Davis

As if I need to say it, Ozzie gets a spot that high because of the glove, greatest of all time in the field by both the old and new standards and it's really not that close. Yount and Banks spent substantial time elsewhere, but both had the best years at SS. I know, Yount won an MVP as a CF. That doesn't change the fact that his peak was really at short. Right around 9, it got to be a cluster-fuck of guys that are very similar. I went with Appling and Davis, but could've gone with Lou Boudreau, Alan Trammell, or Joe Cronin. Pee Wee Reese is another outstanding glove man, but I couldn't quite sneak him past any of the others.

Of course, if I wanted to include A-Rod, I'd drop in the 2nd slot and he'd be a whole helluva lot closer to Wagner @1 than Ripken @3.

The big 'what if' of this position is what if Nomar Garciaparra had stayed healthy? I think he could've cracked this top 10.

There are a few interesting cases among current players. Jimmy Rollins, Hanley Ramirez, and Jose Reyes have the potential to get there. However, the most fascinating person is Troy Tulowitzki. He seems to be the most legitimately on his way to cracking this list.

 

[dell71]

Sports Illustrated's Greatest Left Fielders

1. Ted Williams
2. Stan Musial
3. Rickey Henderson
4. Barry Bonds
5. Al Simmons
6. Carl Yastrzemski
7. Joe Jackson
8. Willie Stargell
9. Lou Brock
10. Manny Ramirez

 

[dell71]

Wanted to get back to this. My take on LF...

1. Ted Williams
2. Barry Bonds
3. Stan Musial
4. Rickey Henderson
5. Joe Jackson
6. Manny Ramirez
7. Al Simmons
8. Ed Delahanty
9. Carl Yastrzemski
10. Willie Stargell



Musial is intriguing because you could realistically put him as a first baseman or a right fielder. He played over 1000 games at 1st, but about 1800 in the OF with more than half coming in LF. So I'm fine with leaving him there. The difference between Williams and Bonds for the top spot is really kind of thin. Just from a counting stat standpoint, it's still remarkable where Williams could've wound up had he not missed three years due to military service. If he just had his average season for each of those, he ends up with in the neighborhood of 620 career homers AND doubles, and 2200 RBI. Since these would have been his age 24 through 26 seasons, it's reasonable to believe he had a good shot at going even beyond that. Still, his last season might be his most remarkable. He only played 113 games, but hit 29 HR with a .316 BA, .451 OBP, .645 SLG (higher than his career mark), 190 OPS+ (equal to his career mark) and 4.8 in oWAR (3rd in the AL). He was 41 years old.

Some other guys that I feel were close: Ralph Kiner, Billy Williams, Tim Raines, Goose Goslin.

Among actives, I considered Berkman, but can't put him ahead of any of the "close" guys. Matt Holliday is the most interesting case of the actives. If he continues the way he's going there are going to be some heated debates about his HoF candidacy. Not sure he could crack the top 10, though. Another is Ryan Braun. We'll have to wait and see what kind of player he is post-scandal.

 

[dell71]

Sports Illustrated's Greatest Center Fielders

1. Willie Mays
2. Ty Cobb
3. Joe DiMaggio
4. Mickey Mantle
5. Tris Speaker
6. Ken Griffey Jr.
7. Duke Snider
8. Oscar Charleston
9. Kirby Puckett
10. Cool Papa Bell

 

[dell71]

Bump...going to get back to this in the next day or two.