SRS: Which QB would you rather have?

[ralaw]

I'm not saying they will, but I don't see why they couldn't. Mainly because as everyone has said, the 49ers don't have a lot to do with Alex Smith. They're doing a good job minimizing their problems and they don't beat themselves. They play good defense and run the football. That's a championship formula.

I wouldn't credit Alex Smith for a lot of it, but as long as he doesn't blow it up, it could definitely happen.

Unless you have an absolute stud defense (I'm talking truly elite:2000 Baltimore) your going to need your QB to make plays down the field (see Glen's post). I don't think Alex Smith can do that. The recipe for the 49ers is basically to run the ball, don't turn the ball over and kick field goals. You aren't going to beat the elite teams like that.

The 49ers will have to face a Green Bay or New Orleans offense (or both depending on what happens this weekend) and those teams are going to put up points on the 49ers. While the 49ers have a good defense people are giving them too much credit, because their pass defense is average at best. The 49ers weakness is Green Bay and New Orleans' strengths.

 

[Liquidrob]

Alex Smith easily

Alex Smith and his Wonderlic score > Tebow and the power of jesus christ

 

[bucky]

Whoa....did you just say Alex Smith is turning into Matty Ice? At this point I don't know if you are overrating Alex Smith or underrating Matt Ryan.

I said Smith is Matt Ryan like. They both need a good defense and run game. Ryan's better than Smith, but neither really wins games for there team like a Peyton Manning, Drew Brees or Aaron Rodgers. I think of Ryan as more of a game manager. Smith is more of a poor mans Ryan.

Either way, the 49ers aren't winning a champioship with Alex Smith at QB. Tebow has his flaws, but I'd rather take him simply becuase IMO he has greater potential. Alex Smith has always been mediocre and he will continue to be......he's having a career year.

49ers have a chance to win one this year with the defense and running game they have. They will have a difficult time slowing down New Orleans or GB's offense, but they have a real chance at the SB. Denver, not so much. Not with a RB at QB.

BTW, have you given Cam Newton is props yet?

He's a Rookie, I give him a pass. I'll wait till his 3rd year to see if he really learns how to play the position. If he does, he could be TOP TIER. For a Rookie, he's doing very well. Yes, I do give him props. He could end up being what I thought Mike Vick was going to be.

 

[bucky]

He's worked harder to get better every year.

How hard has he worked? His delivery is still shit and he can't throw the ball. WR's are almost useless with him at QB.

He only has one and about a quarter off-seasons under his belt and he's light years better than he looked in the Senior Bowl before the draft.

Well, if he is light years ahead, then he must have been really shit back then.

John Fox is even on the record as saying how much the lockout hurt Tebow's development heading into the year.

Rodgers changed his delivery (from that crap Tedford style) in one off season, on his own. That should have been the FIRST thing Tebow did when entering the NFL. His mechanics are shit.

Smith has now in his sixth season and still hasn't shown any ability to push the ball down the field (6.3 YPC)

He throws the ball much better than Tebow does.

Harbuagh has done a good job on minimizing Smith's ability to mess things up much the same way Fox has done with Tebow.

Like you say here, Fox is masking Tebow's major deficiencies by not letting him throw the ball very much. Denver has the perfect recipe for not going anywhere in the playoffs.

But the list of QBs who have made huge strides after their 7th season is much shorter than the list of those who make the jump after their second.

The list of horribly inaccurate passers making it in the NFL is pretty damn small too. And Rich Gannon with the Raiders was a late bloomer. So was Jim Plunkett, also with the Raiders. Smith may be having a career year (for him), but I don't want to even touch Tebow until he learns how to throw the damn ball.

 

[bucky]

Unless you have an absolute stud defense (I'm talking truly elite:2000 Baltimore) your going to need your QB to make plays down the field (see Glen's post). I don't think Alex Smith can do that.

Neither can Tebow.

 

[Aso]

Rich Gannon just never got an opportunity until Jon Gruden. Marty Shittyheimer started Steve Bono and Elvis Grbac over him? I've seen all three QB's play in the seasons where there were "QB controversies" and Gannon always played better than both. Marty sucked too much to commit to him.

/off-topic

Neither Alex Smith nor Tim Tebow will ever win a Superbowl so I pick neither.

 

[bucky]

Except Tebow has already won games with lesser talent around him in just his second season as a starter.

You mean the defense kept Denver from losing those games. Sorry, your giving Tebow WAY to much credit. The running game and defense is why Denver won those games. Denver was lucky to be in those games at the end.

Alex Smith has finally started to do something seven years in.

And the question is which QB would you rather have now, not 6 years ago or 6 years from now.

I remember when people were saying the same things about Smith's tiny hands that they were about Tebow's passing motion.

At least Smith can throw a pass. Right now, Tebow just sucks at it. He will have to change his entire mechanics for him to get much better at it.

And yeah Bucky, Tebow was much much worse in the Senior Bowl than he is right now. And unlike Smith, he hasn't been getting first team reps for the majority of his career and wasn't able to work with any of his coaches this offseason due to the lockout, something Smith didn't have to deal with going into his second year.

And Rodgers changed his throwing motion on his own initiative during an off season. Tebow should have done the same thing. Hired someone to help him retool his mechanics. After doing that, Rodgers ended up with one of the quickest releases in the game. Tebow is never going to be able to throw into tight windows with accuracy until he does the same thing. Tebow's offense is gimmicky and won't last.

Glenn, I know you are a fan of Denver's, but Tebow throws for shit. Right now, he's a gimmick.

 

[bucky]

Thank you. I was just about to say that Gannon didn't bloom late, he just finally got on the field in Oakland. When he would come in as a sub for KC he would play well.

He wasn't much in Minny. I just don't remember him being that great in Minny and we played them twice a year.

 

[Tailback U]

The 49ers can definitely win the Super Bowl with Alex Smith. The 49ers can beat any team in the league if they force turnovers and don't commit any of their own.

Their defense is good enough. Are they one of the best defenses of all time? No, but they are the best defense in the NFL.

If Brad Johnson won a Super Bowl with the Tampa Bay Bucs, then Alex Smith can win a Super Bowl with these 49ers.

If they have to play at New Orleans, I think they will lose. If they play NO in SF, then I think the 49ers can beat them.

I just saw a Chiefs team two weeks ago, eerily similar in design to the 49ers, beat the Green Bay Packers. Now, the game was at Arrowhead and a regular season game, but the bottom line is that the Chiefs won.

To say that the 49ers have no chance whatsoever is ridiculous to me, not because they are that good, but nobody else is, either.

 

[Aso]

He wasn't much in Minny. I just don't remember him being that great in Minny and we played them twice a year.

Well he wasn't a star early on in his career but not a lot of QB's are. If he ever got a single coach that really trusted in him from day one he would've been putting up the numbers he did in Oakland a lot sooner. If a coach committed to him from day one he would've ordinarily bloomed.

 

[Len B]

What the fuck is with people and comparing Tim Tebow to players who have been in the league for years?

This is Tebow's SECOND year as an NFL player, and hasn't even started 16 games yet as a QB. Alex Smith has been in the NFL for seven seasons. Seven seasons. Alex Smith better be better as a #1 pick in his 7th season than a QB who was listed as a project and is barely a pro yet. Alex Smith has a 74.8 qb rating his 2nd year, Tebow has a 75.9

BRB, gonna go compare Julio Jones to Calvin Johnson.

 

[Realist]

If I remember hearing correctly didn't Smith go through 3 different offense coordinators in 3 years.....that could be tough on a young QB.

7 in 7 and a lot of people don't want to give him the benefit of the doubt on that and blame it all on Smith saying he sucks. Smith has had 4 come from behind victories this year alone. http://inagist.com/49ers/150809411470893056/ Coaching does wonders.

Does anyone really think Alex Smith has progressed?

I see a guy that SEVERELY cripples an offensive game-plan. Most if not all completions are less than 5 yards in the three step passing game or roll-outs off of play-action. That tells me even Harbaugh doesn't have a ton of faith in him.

Just because Harbaugh is smart enough not to put Smith in bad situations like the past staffs doesn't make Smith a better quarterback. He's had four games this season with less than 200 yards passing AND 0 TD's (and he had one game with 201 yards and 0 TD's). He's thrown 3 TD's in one game all season. He has a total of 4 TD passes on the road in 7 games. His yards per pass attempt has exceed 9 yards only once.

If you look at his career stats lines, he's still the same old Alex Smith. He's just not making the critical mistake like in years past.

Having said that, Tebow does share his struggles. And as a supporter of his, he can really struggle throwing the football sometimes. I think the most important thing is consistency for a quarterback, even if he's consistently bad. I'd rather know what I was getting.

So, I'll take Smith. Build my offense around the running game and short passes/rollouts much like Harbaugh has done. It's not pretty, but I can win with it. Tebow is like a box of chocolates right now, and he does have some upside, but I need a little more consistency out of him first.

Not that it really matters but Smith suffers from a ton of drops every game. A lot of them are right in the endzone. I know he should have at least 5 more added to that TD total total. IMO Smith has played a lot better most of the time than the stats show. Smith is a completely different player from years past.

Has anyone pointed out that San Fran has the best D in football right now by the numbers? Not to mention the NFC West is shit outside of Seattle.

Just pointing that out because I know the D always comes up when Tebow talk arises. Niners D has just been crazy good this year.

NFC West argument means nothing when we are beating other teams.

Of course I'm going with Smith because I prefer a true QB. Tebow has played decent as well.

 

[Tailback U]

What the fuck is with people and comparing Tim Tebow to players who have been in the league for years?

This is Tebow's SECOND year as an NFL player, and hasn't even started 16 games yet as a QB. Alex Smith has been in the NFL for seven seasons. Seven seasons. Alex Smith better be better as a #1 pick in his 7th season than a QB who was listed as a project and is barely a pro yet. Alex Smith has a 74.8 qb rating his 2nd year, Tebow has a 75.9

BRB, gonna go compare Julio Jones to Calvin Johnson.

So compare them on this season alone. Forget about where they were drafted, how many offensive coordinators they've had, how old they are, etc.

Just by comparing them on this season alone, you'd think Alex Smith had done next to nothing compared to the amount of publicity Tebow has received even though he has been better in every statistical category including the most important one - wins.

 

[bucky]

Oh yeah the same defense that let Percy Harvin run wild on us and made Christian Ponder look like Joe Montana? The same defense that has been hot garbage the last two weeks?

During the winning streak, your QB was hot garbage for 58 minutes of the game while your DEFENSE kept you in the games. Then you ran into teams that scored and exposed your hot garbage QB. Tebow's young and has time to develop, but if he can't throw the ball, I don't have much hope for him.

And the running game is fueled by Tebow. Holes are there now that didn't exist before. Don't believe me?

Running game has been a lot more than Tebow. And Tebow running the ball and not being able to pass is still a gimicky offense. You saw what happens the last couple of weeks when the gimmick doesn't work. Get used to it until Tebow learns how to throw the ball. The guy is only going to take you so far and that's it until he completely retools his mechanics.

Take a look at the Miami game where McGahee only had 76 yards, the KC game where he had 17, the Jets game where he had 18, or the Bears game where he had 34. All those games, Denver victories.

McGahee's having a very good year. Hell, GB kept Forte to 13 yards in a game, that doesn't mean Forte is crap.

Funny I don't see the word now anywhere in the title

Funny, I don't see "six years from now" or "six years ago" in the title either. What QB would you take, without any qualifications, implies "NOW". You are really reaching here.

Alex Smith's QB stats his second season: 189.8 YPG 18 Total TDs 19 Turnovers 74.8 Rating

So what, we are not talking about his second season. Stay on topic. 5 years ago is irrelevant.

Tim Tebow's QB stats his second season: 228.2 YPG 18 Total TDs 6 Turnovers 78.9 Rating

And they won't improve much unless he reinvents himself as a QB. If he take the time to redo his mechanics and learns how to read defenses, then with his running ability, he could be a Steve Young. But he has to reinvent himself as a QB first. Will he do it. If he doesn't, then get used tot he gimick offense that doesn't take you very far.

And that's with Smith having a full offseason and first team reps. Let's give Tebow some time.

Rookies I give a complete free pass to. Tebow is in his second year and is still young. But he hasn't even started to do what he needs to do to become a good QB. Will he? And again, the question isn't, "Who would you take years from now when Tebow may turn into a good QB". The question was who would you take. Right now, I take the QB than can throw a fucking pass. My mind could change in a couple of years.

Rodgers motion was NEVER as bad as Tebow's. This comparison is a joke.

The comparison is not a joke. Rodgers motion was only going to take him so far. He realized it. Changed it on his own and now has one of the fastest/quickest deliveries in the game. Tebow's is FAR WORSE than Rodgers ever was (you're right about that), which only strengthens my point. TEBOW HAS YET TO EVEN TRY TO RETOOL HIS MECHANICS. And he throws a pass like hot garbage. NOT what I want in my QB.

Rodgers also had 3 years to sit and be groomed by one of the best QBs of all time while Tebow has a retread OC and a defensive head coach to help him along while being thrown into the starting role.

Now you're just fucking retarded. Favre didn't do shit for Rodgers except try and hold him back. Now if you said Rodgers had 3 years to be groomed by the Coaching Staff, then you would have something. Still, Rodgers retooled his delivery because HE WANTED TO BE MUCH BETTER. I have not seen that in Tebow. He still throws like shit.

Yeah but right now he's on the verge on one of the best in season turnarounds in NFL history so I don't really care.

That's OK with me that you don't care. You're gimmick offense will only take you so far. Tebow will need to retool himself (his throwing motion) and (like all young QB's) learn to read defenses. Then he could turn into something special. But even if he learns to read defenses, unless he retools his mechanics, he's NEVER going to be throwing into tight windows that are required which then limits the effectiveness of being good at reading defenses.

 

[Realist]

Got this from another site.

- 49ers lead the NFL in dropped passes per QB attempt.
- Alex Smith is 10th in the NFL in accuracy despite having the highest 'dropped passes' percentage.
- Of his incompletions : 18.2% = dropped passes in 7% of attempts,15.3% = forced incompletion in 5.9% of attempts. Statistically it is more likely that a WR will drop the ball than a DBack will force incompletion.
- Smiths' completion percentage is 61%.
- Over 80% of Smiths' sacks are under 1.8 seconds, of which 92% are caused by failed assignment on a blitz.

 

[Len B]

So compare them on this season alone. Forget about where they were drafted, how many offensive coordinators they've had, how old they are, etc.

Just by comparing them on this season alone, you'd think Alex Smith had done next to nothing compared to the amount of publicity Tebow has received even though he has been better in every statistical category including the most important one - wins.

I guess I missed the original point. So you're more upset that Smith isn't getting the media attention that Tebow is?

I think we all know why Tebow is getting more attention, but Alex Smith has quietly put together a career the last three seasons.

 

[Aso]

Got this from another site.

Now the question is how credible is the source? What site did you get that from?

 

[Tailback U]

I guess I missed the original point. So you're more upset that Smith isn't getting the media attention that Tebow is?

I think we all know why Tebow is getting more attention, but Alex Smith has quietly put together a career the last three seasons.

I'm not upset about anything, I just think it's interesting how everyone thinks Smith is the exact same player that he has always been but is playing like a top 10 QB this year.

If Smith was always this good, then coaching and the team around him was obviously the problem, and Smith has always been a top 10 QB then?

What would Smith's career look like if he had been in this system from year 1? How good would Smith be right now? Nobody knows, obviously, but it's worth thinking and talking about.

I understand that defense and special teams are drastically helping Smith this season. That is partially why I'm comparing him to Tebow, I believe they are similar in that way. I think both can be good to very good QB's in the right system; they need a good defense, special teams, scheme, and to take care of the football.

I guess it's pretty cliche, since all of those things will help any QB. But they have both shown a great sense of IQ when it comes to taking a sack, throwing the ball away, and avoiding turnovers. A lot of QB's struggle with that aspect of the game.

 

[uncle whiskers]

This would be an awful choice to have to make. 2 terrible QB's. I guess I'd take....ugh....Smith?

 

[Aso]

Initially Smith struggled with accuracy. Earlier in his career sometimes I'd see him throw a screen pass off the mark. Haven't seen him play too much this year but he must've changed something fundamentally to be a little bit more accurate.