VSN's Top 10 NFL Quarterbacks.

[Gonzo]

Actually, let's take Len's case a step further.

Let's put Drew Brees in New England a couple years ago, where New England would have beaten New York, and finished with a perfect season. So, let's add on a few post season victories and a super bowl ring to Drew Brees career, since the incompetent douche bag can't seem to do it himself.

Len, you ever think about becoming a sports agent?

Drew Brees would love you. Hell, I know of a lot of players that would love you.

 

[Nukleopatra]

No. Ha. We just learned all he is doing is trolling and arguing for the hell of it. So we quit wasting our time

See, Len and I put Drew Brees in New England two years ago, where he finished the season 19-0, including the super bowl victory, of course. So, we add 19 games to his current total, a super bowl ring, and he also would have thrown for 50 TDs, so my question to you... Is Drew Brees a hall of famer now? He has the ring, the has the record for passing TDs, and we'll also assume that he would have lead New England to the playoffs in '08, where Cassel failed. Possibly even the super bowl? Should we give him another ring, or maybe another appearance?

What do you guys think?

 

[Len B]

Actually, let's take Len's case a step further.

Let's put Drew Brees in New England a couple years ago, where New England would have beaten New York, and finished with a perfect season. So, let's add on a few post season victories and a super bowl ring to Drew Brees career, since the incompetent douche bag can't seem to do it himself.

Len, you ever think about becoming a sports agent?

Drew Brees would love you. Hell, I know of a lot of players that would love you.

Yes, because that's exactly what I said.

Don't let the word "Brees" make you go into a frenzy where you start spitting out gibberish and changing people's words around.

Brees and Warner statistically were as equal as you can get. 96.9 QB rating to 96.2 QB rating. In their careers, they are statistically equal in close/late games.

They both played on equal talent teams, so to say Warner carried a bad team and say that Brees is a loser for not getting the Saints to the playoffs is a bad argument.

Division placement is the only reason the Cardinals made it to the playoffs this year. They went just 9-7 with one of the worst schedules in the league.

No idea how you spun equal QB's on equal teams into "Drew Brees has an undefeated season and wins the SB".

 

[Nukleopatra]

Yes, because that's exactly what I said.

Len, can we put me in New Orleans, since Drew is in New England? I'm quite capable of leading New Orleans to at least last place in the division, behind a rookie quarterback who took over one of the worst teams in the NFL.

Oh, please? Can we? can we?

 

[Len B]

No. Ha. We just learned all he is doing is trolling and arguing for the hell of it. So we quit wasting our time

PS Merge the NFL and NCAA footbal forums already

I see what you mean. He just randomly comes up with things no one said to keep the argument going.

 

[Len B]

Len, can we put me in New Orleans, since Drew is in New England? I'm quite capable of leading New Orleans to at least last place in the division, behind a rookie quarterback who took over one of the worst teams in the NFL.

Oh, please? Can we? can we?

This makes me the... 5th? 6th? person in this thread that you just gave up having a legit argument with and starting spewing out 5 year old babble.

 

[Nukleopatra]

This makes me the... 5th? 6th? person in this thread that you just gave up having a legit argument with and starting spewing out 5 year old babble.

Wha.....?

Since your argument in based on assumptions, why can't I assume I could finish last place in the NFC South behind a rookie quarterback who took over one of the worst teams in the NFL? You assumed that Brees would lead Arizona to 9-7, plus a super bowl. What? I'm not allowed to play?

That's not fair!

 

[Len B]

There's a reason no one likes debating with you. Figure it out.

 

[Gonzo]

Len, can we put me in New Orleans, since Drew is in New England? I'm quite capable of leading New Orleans to at least last place in the division, behind a rookie quarterback who took over one of the worst teams in the NFL.

Oh, please? Can we? can we?

Anyone can spout of statistics in their favor.

 

[Nukleopatra]

There's a reason no one likes debating with you. Figure it out.

So, are you saying that I couldn't take over the Quarterback spot in New Orleans and finish last place in the NFC South? Well, I think I'm more than capable, so - whateva!

And since you don't seem to know - Drew Brees plays for New Orleans, not Arizona. If we try hard enough, I'm sure we can all think of a situation where even that fucking loser would come out looking like a winner. Unfortunately for Drew, he has to do it himself.

Nice arguing with you, though.

 

[Len B]

No one said Brees was a winner. But if you think that the Cardinals wouldn't win the division with Brees at QB you're taking your Warner man crush to all new heights.

You used an argument that said Warner took a statistically bad team to the Superbowl. No, Warner took a statistically bad team to the top of a shit fest division, then helped lead a team that got hot to the Superbowl.

What they did in the regular season had no baring on the playoffs. Brees took the same level of talent team to 8-8 with a much harder schedule.

And FWIW it wasn't an argument. I brought stats, you brought in the "I don't want to reply so I'll beat around the bush".

I was expecting at least one piece of evidence for a counter, but you disappointed me.

 

[Nukleopatra]

No one said Brees was a winner.

This is the problem. You people don't get my point. I'm not saying he's a bad quarterback, Len. He's on my top 10. All I'm saying is, he's a loser. And if you honestly think that a 55 - 51 career record, with 1 playoff victory in 7 seasons, is a winner, then of course I'm going to mock you. Drew Brees hasn't won shit since high school, and that's a fact. Don't assume that he'd be better on another team, that's ridiculous. I'm ready to put this entire argument to rest, if you answer this one question for me, which I've been begging to get answered, and you pretty much already have... but I'll ask again.

Is Drew Brees a winner? Yes or no.

I don't need any long winded speech spewing out empty stats, or how he'd win if he was playing here or there, or with this guy or that guy. Is Drew Brees a winner?

 

[Len B]

Did I say Drew Brees was a winner?

Until I say "Drew Brees would win the Superbowl with Arizona this year", I'd ask that you stop pretending that I did.

Here's what I said:

-Both QB's had equal regular seasons on equally skilled teams
-Warner was fortunate enough to be in a horrendous division with a horrendous SOS, to give himself a shot at leading his team to the SB

I have all the respect in the world for Warner, and think he did an amazing job by leading his team to the Superbowl. Would Brees lead that team to the Superbowl? No idea. However, your argument for this season, didn't make any sense.

 

[Nukleopatra]

I have all the respect in the world for Warner, and think he did an amazing job by leading his team to the Superbowl. Would Brees lead that team to the Superbowl? No idea. However, your argument for this season, didn't make any sense.

What's with all the Warner bullshit? It's not Warner's fault that Drew Brees can't win important games, Len. Why even compare a winner like Warner to Drew Brees? It doesn't even make sense. Did some MM member tip you off, that by mentioning Kurt Warner's name, will force me to forfeit? My dislike for Drew Brees goes deeper than Kurt Warner.

So, let's toss Warner out of this.

Is Drew Brees a winner? Not Kurt Warner - Drew Brees? Yes or no?

 

[Len B]

I'm amazed, as a Patriots fan even I don't give Tom Brady 100% credit for all three SB rings, and he's the one QB who most people would say should deserve the credit.

Brees has done all he could to lead his teams to victory in the playoffs. Both QB's have posted over 90.0 QB ratings in their career in the post season. If you want to discredit Brees' defense for allowing 39 points to the Bears and hold it against him, then go ahead.

Before this season Brees was 47-43 as a starter, while Warner 48-37. Peyton Manning "wasn't a winner" until the age of 31 and is arguably the best QB of this generation. The best QB of the previous generation wasn't a "winner" for his entire career.

You're using a team concept to apply who is the better individual player. Not sure how that works.

 

[Nukleopatra]

Brees has done all he could to lead his teams to victory in the playoffs.

Are you referring to the 6 interceptions he threw against Atlanta/Tampa Bay, two games that could have helped the team make the playoffs? Yeah. I completely agree with you - Drew Brees has done everything he can.. My point is, his best, isn't good enough.

So, I take it you won't give me a yes or no answer?

55- 51, 1 playoff victory in 7 seasons? Does that define a winner?

 

[Len B]

If the thread title was called "most successful careers" you'd have some good points.

Trent Dilfer better than Donovan McNabb?

By your definition that a SB is the only way to be a winner, Brees is not a winner (just so you stop asking it).

 

[Gonzo]

Yes. Drew Brees is a winner. 55 > 51. More wins than losses. He's a winner.

/thread.

 

[Len B]

Kurt Warner is a career 56% winner
Drew Brees is a career 52% winner

Over the span of ten seasons (roughly a player's career, still on the short side) the two players would equate to:

Warner - 90 wins out of 160 games
Brees - 83 wins out of 160 games

Not sure why you're pointing out Warner's .7 wins per season advantage as the main reason he's better than Brees.

Done with this thread, as I see what everyone means by the Nuk endless cycle. It's like a fucking merry-go-round that you paid a quarter for and the merry-go-round won't let you off because it's bored.

 

[Nukleopatra]

Trent Dilfer better than Dan Marino?

Oh, now it's Marino's fault that Drew Brees is incompetent?

Dan Marino has 8 post season victories, 1 super bowl appearance.

If Drew Brees can at least match that, he'll be a winner in my book.

1 playoff victory in 7 seasons? Sorry, Len, that won't cut it.

Edit: Lol @ bringing up Warner again.