The General Wrestling Thread

[s@ppisgod]

At the time, coming off of the red hot Jericho match, they were probably going to go all the way with the 'Bryan Danielson' thing, but like a lot of the shit they start, it likely got lost in the shuffle, or they changed their minds 19 times, and it was either forgotten or thought better of.

Who knows.

Why bother with a guy who can actually wrestle when you can get Michael Cole over as a massive heel with cheap heat?
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[EmpireWF]

At the time, coming off of the red hot Jericho match, they were probably going to go all the way with the 'Bryan Danielson' thing, but like a lot of the shit they start, it likely got lost in the shuffle, or they changed their minds 19 times, and it was either forgotten or thought better of.

Who knows.

Even after they muffed that up, even after they fired him over spitting/tie-choking, they brought him back and made him look like a million bucks (in his Summer Slam return).

Then it won't no where.

[dave]

Why bother with a guy who can actually wrestle when you can get Michael Cole over as a massive heel with cheap heat?
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You can't blame them with the Michael Cole or Vickie Guerrero characters. They work.
It's a sad statement that they are the WWE's most effective heels, but they are.

[Warner2BruceTD]

You can't blame them with the Michael Cole or Vickie Guerrero characters. They work.
It's a sad statement that they are the WWE's most effective heels, but they are.

With Vivki, it's fine because she is essentially a heel manager, and there have been plenty of times a heel manager has been the most over heel in a territory.

But with Cole, there is no end game or escape plan, unless you bring in a new lead commentator. Its hard to get storylines over when you also have to get yourself over as a heel. Why should the viewer listen to you? You're a heel!

[s@ppisgod]

You can't blame them with the Michael Cole or Vickie Guerrero characters. They work.
It's a sad statement that they are the WWE's most effective heels, but they are.

It's not that those characters are the best heels, it's that they dedicate SO much of every show to get these people over. If they gave someone like Ryder or McIntyre or Rhodes the same devices to make them come off as a giant heel EVERY week for what, 1/5th of Raw, like they did Cole week in/week out, they'd be over like crazy as heels too. Only difference is, you could actually do something with it. The payoff with Cole was a few terrible matches with King, and a god awful Swagger tie-in.
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[dave]

It's not that those characters are the best heels, it's that they dedicate SO much of every show to get these people over. If they gave someone like Ryder or McIntyre or Rhodes the same devices to make them come off as a giant heel EVERY week for what, 1/5th of Raw, like they did Cole week in/week out, they'd be over like crazy as heels too.

I disagree.
If Ryder, McIntyre or Rhodes captivated an audience they would be bigger than they are.
It didn't take Vickie's heel character more than five seconds to captivate a crowd, yes Cole gets a lot of air time, but the hate for him is visceral.
Drew McIntyre got a shot and didn't get an audience, Cody Rhodes has had more than one shot and didn't get an audience, Zack Ryder might still get his ... but it's more an Internet thing.

[EmpireWF]

I disagree.
If Ryder, McIntyre or Rhodes captivated an audience they would be bigger than they are.
It didn't take Vickie's heel character more than five seconds to captivate a crowd, yes Cole gets a lot of air time, but the hate for him is visceral.
Drew McIntyre got a shot and didn't get an audience, Cody Rhodes has had more than one shot and didn't get an audience, Zack Ryder might still get his ... but it's more an Internet thing.

Zack Ryder doesn't even get a chance on television. Crowds chant for him, have signs for him, and yet they purposefully hold him off TV to spite....the fans I guess, and themselves. It's to the point where other wrestlers on twitter and elsewhere on the net voice their amazement he's not utilized past Superstars.

[s@ppisgod]

I disagree.
If Ryder, McIntyre or Rhodes captivated an audience they would be bigger than they are.
It didn't take Vickie's heel character more than five seconds to captivate a crowd, yes Cole gets a lot of air time, but the hate for him is visceral.
Drew McIntyre got a shot and didn't get an audience, Cody Rhodes has had more than one shot and didn't get an audience, Zack Ryder might still get his ... but it's more an Internet thing.

Cole was on 'E TV for 10 goddamn years without "captivating" an audience. But magically started doing that when they pushed him down people's throats for months on end as a vital part to EVERY show. How would Cole NOT get over as a heel that way?

Thats what I've hated about the E. They'll do that with Vince or Vickie or Cole, but they'd never dedicate that much to get a fresh faced WRESTLER over as a heel unless he was Trips' good buddy or Vince had an unusually large boner for him (Orton). These guys like Ryder don't have a shot in hell, and by captivating an audience outside of WWE TV, he's damaging his already-horrific chances. You can't tell me that they could push someone like Rhodes or Ryder equally hard as they did Cole and he wouldn't get booed heavily every week. Remember, this is the WWE Universe. They'll like whatever Vince tells them to like. The only hard part is getting Vince to remember what he himself likes...
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[EmpireWF]

JR tweeted about a new DVD coming out in October covering Bret and Shawn's careers plus "impact/behind the scenes" of Montreal.

Not sure what the format is but he said it was the three of them talking. Wonder if it's like the roundtable stuff but just the three or if it's a bunch of interviews or what.

[SHOGUN]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZumLXraa0U[/ame]

[s@ppisgod]

JR tweeted about a new DVD coming out in October covering Bret and Shawn's careers plus "impact/behind the scenes" of Montreal.

Not sure what the format is but he said it was the three of them talking. Wonder if it's like the roundtable stuff but just the three or if it's a bunch of interviews or what.

They milked that shit dry the last 13+ years. Nobody cares anymore. The only thing left was to see him on WWE TV again. They did that, and it wasn't in Canada so nobody cared. Everyone knows what happened. Bret's talked about it, Shawn's talked about it, Meltzer explained it in great detail. If they did this in, say, 2001, it would have been interesting. But it's ancient, already rehashed a million times history.

Not to mention, I think they already have 2 DVDs out on HBK's career and Bret's. Between that and the Nitro DVD after MNWars and Rise and Fall of WCW, it's pretty ridiculous. All they put out anymore are shitty, Hollywood-grade money grabs.
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[EmpireWF]

Sure WWE has driven all that into the ground, but a DVD featuring Bret, Shawn and JR together talking history should be awesome.

They milked that shit dry the last 13+ years. Nobody cares anymore. The only thing left was to see him on WWE TV again. They did that, and it wasn't in Canada so nobody cared. Everyone knows what happened. Bret's talked about it, Shawn's talked about it, Meltzer explained it in great detail. If they did this in, say, 2001, it would have been interesting. But it's ancient, already rehashed a million times history.

Not to mention, I think they already have 2 DVDs out on HBK's career and Bret's. Between that and the Nitro DVD after MNWars and Rise and Fall of WCW, it's pretty ridiculous. All they put out anymore are shitty, Hollywood-grade money grabs.
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[s@ppisgod]

Sure WWE has driven all that into the ground, but a DVD featuring Bret, Shawn and JR together talking history should be awesome.

The problem with that is that Shawn isn't a giant douche anymore, and the most Bret would say about him/history would be in his books already. So chances are, not a ton of new (interesting) info, nobody calling the other out. Just cookie-cutter, PC answers and BS "how you felt when ______" talk and plenty of matches that we've already seen on other DVDs. I'd much rather hear a DVD focused on the Hart/Hart feud or the USA/Canada feud. Not this trash again.
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[EmpireWF]

The problem with that is that Shawn isn't a giant douche anymore, and the most Bret would say about him/history would be in his books already. So chances are, not a ton of new (interesting) info, nobody calling the other out. Just cookie-cutter, PC answers and BS "how you felt when ______" talk and plenty of matches that we've already seen on other DVDs. I'd much rather hear a DVD focused on the Hart/Hart feud or the USA/Canada feud. Not this trash again.

Not gonna see anything with Owen anytime soon....the USA/Canada feud DEFINITELY deserves it's own DVD (Bret, Taker, Austin, Shawn, Foley, Goldust, Animal are just a few they have who could talk on it).

But assuming this DVD isn't just a ploy to make some money for the 14 year anniversary of it...I'll get it and eat it up.

[EmpireWF]

According to his Twitter, Chavo asked for and received his release from WWE. Among his tweets was this gem...

I will never go back to the place WWE put me in. I will never go back to being under utilized and watching ppl who suck get bigger "pushes"