40 years from now...

[Berowsk]

My hatred has run deep for many years. One of my many bannings at MM was due to me bashing the shit out of that faggot band because one of the admins kept posting about them all the time. I forget who it was though. I know it was someone fairly popular at the time.

Anyways they do suck balls.

Is he not big up there?

 

[Pitty]

Right.

Now name an iconic, memorable disco or new wave act.

During those eras, all of these genres were producing people who were very popular in their time and had critical and commericial success. But as their "bubble" faded, so did they.

Hi, Kanye!

So you're telling me that groups like The Bee Gees and Talking Heads aren't still recognizable?

And yes if you played a Kanye West song in front of 1000 people in between 18-34, it would be immediately recognizable, just as any of the groups mentioned before are to the Baby Boomers.

Kanye West is the biggest male artist on the planet right now. And you actually think that people today still remember Britney Spears for any of her work? No.

 

[Warner2BruceTD]

So you're telling me that groups like The Bee Gees and Talking Heads aren't still recognizable?

And yes if you played a Kanye West song in front of 1000 people in between 18-34, it would be immediately recognizable, just as any of the groups mentioned before are to the Baby Boomers.

Kanye West is the biggest male artist on the planet right now. And you actually think that people today still remember Britney Spears for any of her work? No.

So are you trying to tell me that Kanye is more recognizable, and more entrenched in american culture, than Britney Spears?

Are you trolling?

Britney Spears transcends the pop bubble. Kanye does not. Nobody over 30 knows who the fuck he is.

 

[red33]

tupac for rappers. its been what over 14 years since his death and people still listen to him.

 

[James2Stapleton]

tupac for rappers. its been what over 14 years since his death and people still listen to him.

he'll be back soon so yes people will be listening to him :shifty:

 

[Houston]

Britney Spears transcends the pop bubble. Kanye does not. Nobody over 30 knows who the fuck he is.

Ok, now you're entering the realm of delusion.


You'd have to be homeless, no...homeless and living in the woods to escape the news story of him interrupting Taylor Swift at the MTV awards.

Did you forget the big deal people made out of him pretty much calling George Bush a racist? Not to mention the time Obama called him an asshole. lol, the guy can directly be linked in the media to two different presidents.


This isn't even including his #1 albums and the hits he's had. I'm not gonna say he's more popular then Brittney(yet), but to say "Most people wouldn't recognize Kanye if the tripped over him on a sidewalk":bizzaro:
Are these the same people that wouldn't recognize Taylor Swift, Beyonce, or Jay-Z? Cause Kanye's linked pretty heavily to all 3 of them...

 

[relaxedanderson]

Ok, now you're entering the realm of delusion.


You'd have to be homeless, no...homeless and living in the woods to escape the news story of him interrupting Taylor Swift at the MTV awards.

Did you forget the big deal people made out of him pretty much calling George Bush a racist? Not to mention the time Obama called him an asshole. lol, the guy can directly be linked in the media to two different presidents.


This isn't even including his #1 albums and the hits he's had. I'm not gonna say he's more popular then Brittney(yet), but to say "Most people wouldn't recognize Kanye if the tripped over him on a sidewalk":bizzaro:
Are these the same people that wouldn't recognize Taylor Swift, Beyonce, or Jay-Z? Cause Kanye's linked pretty heavily to all 3 of them...

I couldn't name one song by any of the artists in this post. I could probably hum a few Beyonce ones because the girl who used to live next door to me would blast them out at 7:30am every day but I couldn't tell you what they were called.

That's another reason why most of today's acts are going to struggle for immortality, it's very easy for people to insulate themselves from popular music now.

Back in the 1980s when I was growing up there were only a few ways you could listen to music. We had 3 and a half TV channels and only one radio station playing pop music. On TV we had half an hour of Top of the Pops on Thursday and another half hour of The Chart Show on a Saturday morning. I was a bit too young to watch The Tube or The Old Grey Whistle Test but in hindsight I wish I'd made the effort. If you wanted to listen to anything outside what was being offered by the media then you had to go out and spend money on records and that ate up a big chunk of your money back then.

Consequently everyone listened to the same thing whether they wanted to or not. Everyone from toddlers to great-grandparents knew all the hits and all the stars. Take Michael Jackson for example; I've never been a fan of his, never bought one of his albums and, as far as I can remember, I've never gone out of my way to listen to one of his songs. Yet recently I filled in on bass for a band and had to learn three MJ songs. I found that I knew the structure and changes of all three songs instantly; I had one play through them all and then played them on stage with no problems. All his hits are deeply ingrained in me because there was no way to avoid them back then.

Nowadays there are so many avenues available for finding and listening to music that everyone can pretty much tailor their soundtrack to suit their own tastes

Compare the 80s to my life now: the only time I ever switch the radio on is to listen to Test Match Special; I hardly ever watch TV and when I do it is never anything contemporary music based; I haven't got children and none of my friends or relatives listen to chart music. This means that there is no possible situation where I will find myself knowingly listening to the artists you listed. I have heard his stuff obviously, in pubs or in shops, but when I hear music like that I will just filter it into one of two categories: Shit or Not Shit. If it's Not Shit then I will try to find out who the artist is, if it's Shit then I just let it drop out of my brain. The fact that I've never come up with Kanye West in my Not Shit research despite his apparent ubiquity probably means that he keeps falling into the Shit category.

Thinking about it, I actually have three categories Not Shit, Shit and So Shit It Can Only Be Black Eyed Peas. That's another way to live forever I suppose, to be so catastrophically bad that you will always be remembered as a benchmark for just how shit music can be.

 

[relaxedanderson]

You sound like my wife. She claims that there's a special place in that imaginary land called Hell for the Black Eyed Peas, and I'd be hard pressed to disagree with her.

They're so bad I keep wondering if they are some sort of elaborate prank to see how terrible music can be but still have people buy it by the shed load.

They're either one of humanity's worst crimes or a higher level of genius that we are unable to fully comprehend.

 

[Warner2BruceTD]

Ok, now you're entering the realm of delusion.


You'd have to be homeless, no...homeless and living in the woods to escape the news story of him interrupting Taylor Swift at the MTV awards.

Did you forget the big deal people made out of him pretty much calling George Bush a racist? Not to mention the time Obama called him an asshole. lol, the guy can directly be linked in the media to two different presidents.


This isn't even including his #1 albums and the hits he's had. I'm not gonna say he's more popular then Brittney(yet), but to say "Most people wouldn't recognize Kanye if the tripped over him on a sidewalk":bizzaro:
Are these the same people that wouldn't recognize Taylor Swift, Beyonce, or Jay-Z? Cause Kanye's linked pretty heavily to all 3 of them...

The bold is you agreeing with me, by the way.

And Kanye is definately more famous for all of his antics than he is for his music. If not for his Bush rant or Taylor Swift incident, I honestly may not even know who he is, period.

realxedanderson nailed the reason. It is very easy to insulate yourself from music you don't like these days. This is the point i've been trying to make the entire thead about Kanye. This is why, to me, no matter how "big" these stars get today, its almost impossible to become iconic, especially compared to 20 years ago.

I stand by my point. He's a star within his bubble, like 99% of artists today. He may be one of the bigger stars, but he's still in a bubble. You have multiple people in this thread who admit that they really arent all that familiar with his music, if at all. heels knows one song. I didnt know any until I googeled them, and even though I knew the songs at that point, I wouldnt have known who they were if they came on the radio. relaxed doesnt know his music at all.

He isnt the transcendent star that some of you think that he is. Not even his fault per say, it's just how badly music has gotten fragmented and geared towards specific tastses. There isnt much music that has broad appeal anymore, plus its easy to stick to your wheelhouse these days.

 

[Berowsk]

Internet killed the pop culture star.

 

[Berowsk]

And Kanye is definately more famous for all of his antics than he is for his music. If not for his Bush rant or Taylor Swift incident, I honestly may not even know who he is, period.

I think you're forgetting the fact that he's also one of the most influential producers. Here are the albums he's been involved in:

1 1996
1.1 Grav - Down to Earth
2 1998
2.1 Jermaine Dupri - Life in 1472
2.2 Foxy Brown - Chyna Doll
3 1999
3.1 Harlem World - The Movement (1999)
3.2 Trina & Tamara – Trina & Tamara (1999)
3.3 Goodie Mob - World Party (1999)
3.4 Infamous Syndicate - Changing The Game (1999)
3.5 Made Men - Classic Limited Edition (1999)
4 2000
4.1 Beanie Sigel - The Truth (2000)
4.2 Dead Prez - Let's Get Free (2000)
4.3 The Madd Rapper - Tell 'Em Why U Madd (2000)
4.4 Lil Kim - The Notorious KIM (2000)
4.5 Jay-Z - The Dynasty: Roc La Familia (2000)
4.6 Da Brat - Unrestricted (2000)
5 2001
5.1 Beanie Sigel - The Reason (2001)
5.2 Jay-Z - The Blueprint (2001)
5.3 Abstract Mindstate The M.O.D. - We Paid Let Us In! (2001)
6 2002
6.1 State Property – State Property (2002)
6.2 Cam'ron - Come Home With Me (2002)
6.3 Nas - The Lost Tapes (2002)
6.4 Scarface - The Fix (2002)
6.5 Trina - Diamond Princess (2002)
6.6 Brown Sugar [Soundtrack] (2002)
6.7 Knoc-Turn'Al - L.A. Confidential... (2002)
6.8 Jay-Z - The Blueprint²: The Gift & the Curse (2002)
6.9 Talib Kweli - Quality (2002)
6.10 Paid in Full Soundtrack (2002)
7 2003
7.1 Freeway – Philadelphia Freeway (2003)
7.2 Fabolous - Street Dreams (2003)
7.3 Cam'Ron Presents... The Diplomats - Diplomatic Immunity (2003)
7.4 Lil Kim – La Bella Mafia (2003)
7.5 Monica - After the Storm (2003)
7.6 Beyoncé - Dangerously In Love (2003)
7.7 T.I. - Trap Muzik (2003)
7.8 Royce da 5'9" - Build and Destroy (2003)
7.9 DMX - Grand Champ (2003)
7.10 Ludacris - Chicken-n-Beer (2003)
7.11 Jay-Z - The Black Album (2003)
7.12 Alicia Keys - The Diary of Alicia Keys (2003)
7.13 Memphis Bleek – M.A.D.E. (2003)
7.14 Mystic – Cuts For Luck & Scars For Freedom... (Learning To Breathe) (2003)
7.15 Nappy Roots – Wooden Leather (2003)
8 2004
8.1 Twista - Kamikaze (2004)
8.2 Janet Jackson - Damita Jo (2004)
8.3 Kanye West - The College Dropout (2004)
8.4 Dilated Peoples - Neighborhood Watch (2004)
8.5 D12 - D12 World (2004)
8.6 Petey Pablo - Still Writing in My Diary: 2nd Entry (2004)
8.7 Consequence - Take 'Em To The Cleaners (2004)
8.8 Jadakiss - Kiss of Death (2004)
8.9 Brandy – Afrodisiac (2004)
8.10 Slum Village – Detroit Deli (A Taste of Detroit) (2004)
8.11 Mobb Deep - Amerikaz Nightmare (2004)
8.12 Shyne - Godfather Buried Alive (2004)
8.13 213 - The Hard Way (2004)
8.14 Talib Kweli - The Beautiful Struggle (2004)
8.15 Mos Def - The New Danger (2004)
8.16 Jin - The Rest is History (2004)
8.17 Cam'ron - Purple Haze (2004)
8.18 John Legend - Get Lifted (2004)
8.19 DJ Kayslay - The Streetsweeper Vol. 2: The Pain From The Game (2004)
8.20 Shawnna - Worth tha Weight (2004)
9 2005
9.1 Coach Carter (soundtrack) (2005)
9.2 The Game - The Documentary (2005)
9.3 Do or Die - D.O.D. (2005)
9.4 Mariah Carey - The Emancipation of Mimi (2005)
9.5 Bump J - Move Around - Single (2005)
9.6 Young Gunz - Brothers From Another (2005)
9.7 Common - Be (2005)
9.8 Leela James - A Change Is Gonna Come (2005)
9.9 Keyshia Cole - The Way It Is (2005)
9.10 Kanye West - Late Registration (2005)
9.11 Syleena Johnson - Chapter 3: The Flesh (2005)
9.12 Paul Wall - The Peoples Champ (2005)
9.13 Czar Nok - That One Way (2005)
9.14 Mashonda - January Joy (2005)
9.15 Various Artists - Hurricane Relief: Come Together Now (2005)
9.16 Mistah F.A.B. - Son of a Pimp (2005)
9.17 Miri Ben-Ari - The Hip-Hop Violinist (2005)
10 2006
10.1 Mission: Impossible III (soundtrack) (2006)
10.2 Smitty - The Voice of the Ghetto (2006)
10.3 Rhymefest - Blue Collar (2006)
10.4 Lupe Fiasco - Lupe Fiasco's Food & Liquor (2006)
10.5 Diddy - Press Play (2006)
10.6 John Legend - Once Again (2006)
10.7 The Game - The Doctor's Advocate (2006)
10.8 Jay-Z - Kingdom Come (2006)
10.9 Nas - Hip Hop Is Dead (2006)
10.10 Gubb & Calle P - Illizit Biznizz Vol.1 (2006)
11 2007
11.1 Consequence - Don't Quit Your Day Job! (2007)
11.2 Lil' Wayne - Tha Drought Is Over 2 (Tha Carter III Sessions) (2007)
11.3 Fabolous - From Nothin' to Somethin (2007)
11.4 Common - Finding Forever (2007)
11.5 Talib Kweli - Eardrum (2007)
11.6 Kanye West - Graduation (2007)
11.7 Chris Brown - Exclusive (2007)
12 2008
12.1 Michael Jackson - Thriller 25 (2008)
12.2 Asher Roth - The GreenHouse Effect Mixtape (2008)
12.3 Lil Wayne - Tha Carter III (2008)
12.4 The Game - LAX (2008)
12.5 T.I. - Paper Trail (2008)
12.6 88-Keys - The Death of Adam (2008)
12.7 John Legend - Evolver (2008)
12.8 Kanye West - 808s & Heartbreak (2008)
13 2009
13.1 Notorious Soundtrack (2009)
13.2 Teriyaki Boyz - Serious Japanese (2009)
13.3 Malik Yusef - G.O.O.D. Morning, G.O.O.D. Night (2009)
13.4 Twista - Category F5 (2009)
13.5 Jay-Z - The Blueprint 3 (2009)
13.6 Kid Cudi - Man on the Moon: The End of Day (2009)
13.7 More Than a Game Soundtrack (2009)
13.8 Mr Hudson - Straight No Chaser (2009)
14 2010
14.1 B.o.B - May 25 (Mixtape) (2010)
14.2 Drake - Thank Me Later (2010)
14.3 Drake - Unrealeased Track (2010)
14.4 Rick Ross - Teflon Don (2010)
14.5 Kanye West - My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy (2010)
14.6 T.I. - No Mercy (2010)
15 2011
15.1 Saigon - The Greatest Story Never Told (2011)
15.2 Pusha T - Fear of God Mixtape (2011)
15.3 Snoop Dogg - Doggumentary (2011)
16 Upcoming
16.1 Jay-Z & Kanye West - Watch The Throne (2011)
16.2 Game - The R.E.D. Album (2011)
16.3 Big Sean - Finally Famous: The Album (2011)
16.4 Beyoncé Knowles - 4 (Beyoncé Knowles album)

And they left out some Lil Wayne and Nicki Minaj as well.

 

[relaxedanderson]

He isnt the transcendent star that some of you think that he is. Not even his fault per say, it's just how badly music has gotten fragmented and geared towards specific tastses. There isnt much music that has broad appeal anymore, plus its easy to stick to your wheelhouse these days.

There's a book out about this called [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Long-Tail-Future-Business-Selling/dp/1401302378"]The Long Tail[/ame]. In it Chris Anderson describes how the internet has moved us away from the hits and stars model of the past into a series of individual and personalised niches.

Back in the 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s and most of the 90s everyone would go into work in the morning and they would have all watched the same TV shows the night before, all read the same newspapers that morning and all listened to the same music on the radio on the way to work. Now there are so many different entertainment avenues to choose from that it's rare to have a wide overlap between people.

 

[Berowsk]

There's a book out about this called The Long Tail. In it Chris Anderson describes how the internet has moved us away from the hits and stars model of the past into a series of individual and personalised niches.

Back in the 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s and most of the 90s everyone would go into work in the morning and they would have all watched the same TV shows the night before, all read the same newspapers that morning and all listened to the same music on the radio on the way to work. Now there are so many different entertainment avenues to choose from that it's rare to have a wide overlap between people.

 

[Warner2BruceTD]

I think you're forgetting the fact that he's also one of the most influential producers. Here are the albums he's been involved in:


And they left out some Lil Wayne and Nicki Minaj as well.

Name a producer from 40 years ago.

The point is, nobody gives a shit in the context of this discussion. Producing music does not make you memorable or make you a star.

FWIW, I don't 99% of those songs.

edit: are those even songs? I recognize some of those as albums. Goes to show how far producing gets you in terms of lasting fame.

 

[Berowsk]

Name a producer from 40 years ago.

The point is, nobody gives a shit in the context of this discussion. Producing music does not make you memorable or make you a star.

FWIW, I don't 99% of those songs.

edit: are those even songs? I recognize some of those as albums. Goes to show how far producing gets you in terms of lasting fame.

They're album names, too many songs to copy+paste.

 

[LiquidLarry2GhostWF]

Name a producer from 40 years ago.

The point is, nobody gives a shit in the context of this discussion. Producing music does not make you memorable or make you a star.

FWIW, I don't 99% of those songs.

edit: are those even songs? I recognize some of those as albums. Goes to show how far producing gets you in terms of lasting fame.

Phil Spector.
Brian Eno.
George Martin.
Quincy Jones.

There are plenty of great producers with name value. If you don't know, then that is your own ignorance.

Is Kanye one? I dunno...he definitely is well known in hip hop and will go down as one of the better producers ala Rick Rubin, Dr. Dre, and Timbaland of all times in that circle.

 

[Warner2BruceTD]

Phil Spector.

Quincy Jones.

Missing the point, though.

 

[LiquidLarry2GhostWF]

Quincy Jones.

Missing the point, though.

Not missing the point, there are plenty of good producers with name value.

To go right next to the timelessness of Michael Jackson, goes Quincy Jones. To dismiss it is like dismissing a member of the band because they aren't the front man.

 

[Warner2BruceTD]

Not missing the point, there are plenty of good producers with name value.

To go right next to the timelessness of Michael Jackson, goes Quincy Jones. To dismiss it is like dismissing a member of the band because they aren't the front man.

In the context of this discussion, nobody gives a shit who played bass for Led Zeppplin, and nobody gives a shit who produced Madonna in the 80's.

You are naming uber producers, and still none of them have the cultural signifigance of the acts they produce. If that's really the argument some are making for Kanye, I rest my case.

 

[Senser81]

In the context of this discussion, nobody gives a shit who played bass for Led Zeppplin, and nobody gives a shit who produced Madonna in the 80's.

You are naming uber producers, and still none of them have the cultural signifigance of the acts they produce. If that's really the argument some are making for Kanye, I rest my case.

John Paul Jones. Very underrated. I think he produced Lenny Kravitz, too.

I would say 40 years from now we will still be listening to Lawrence Muggerud.