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The General Wrestling Thread

Nah, pretty sure Wade's not just talking about accountability because he's gay. If Dudley dropped the Jeremy Lin line or the n word, there'd still be people calling him out.

TNA should do something with the LGBT group.

But here's the thing. He is already being accused of being insincere. Dixie Carter tried to do some PR, Keller and others accused her of being insincere.

My issue isn't that Keller and others are offended. I understand why people are offended. My issue, is when somebody swallows their pride and apologizes, there is nothing left for them to do. At that point, to me, the issue is now on you. If you think it's insincere, and you are truly offended, put your money where your mouth is and don't watch anymore. In Keller's case, don't cover them.

Does sending Bully Ray to some hokey sensitivity classes as cheap PR take away the words? Nope. Does it reverse anything? Nope. If Keller or whoever else is still offended, even after the apology, what can you do? Nothing will satisfy them at this point. People fuck up. That's life.
 
If he's getting Keller and a ton of other smarks all beat up over...I just call that being a fan-fucking-tastic heel.

Bubba always knew how to get heat, no matter how cheap.

One of the GOAT heat magnets.
 
All TNA has to do is film some of those anti-bullying ads (irony to the ultimate degree) and talk about cutting that shit out, the usual sorta stuff, anti-homophobic ads or whateverthefuck.
 
By the way, on 24/7 a couple weeks back, an ECW episode aired after the Dudleys attacked Beulah.

I REALLY liked this promo from Bubba antagonizing Dreamer.


<iframe frameborder="0" width="480" height="360" src="http://www.dailymotion.com/embed/video/xhwnd0"></iframe><br /><a href="http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xhwnd0_after-breaking-beulah-s-neck-promo-1998_sport" target="_blank">After breaking Beulah's Neck promo 1998</a> <i>by <a href="http://www.dailymotion.com/BrotherRayVideos" target="_blank">BrotherRayVideos</a></i>
 
Keller just posted this.

As a follow-up to last night's Keller's Take regarding Bully Ray calling a fan at the Chicago Impact TV event last week a "f-g," "f----t," and "queer," Dixie Carter and Bully Ray both acknowledged it on their Twitter accounts yesterday.

Dixie Carter (@TNADixie) wrote:

"Heard @RealBully5150 made inappropriate comments to a fan in Chicago. This will not be tolerated. Sincere apologies on behalf of TNA."

Bully Ray (‏@REALBully5150) wrote:

"Made an inappropriate comment to a fan in Chicago. If anyone was offended by this...I do apologize. No harm was meant."

What Dixie wrote sounds like a promising start. Saying it "will not be tolerated" and apologizing without qualification made it seem as if she sees this as more than a pesky annoyance from the P.C. Police.

Bully Ray, on the other hand, gave that classic apology that, I think to most people, translates to: "I can't believe I have to do this. I'm a frickin' heel who says controversial things. Get over it, you sissies, but if you were one of those pansy thin-skinned P.C. police who should probably be watching Oprah instead of pro wrestling, I'm sorry. No harm was intended, because I assumed you're all not all such delicate flowers."

Of course, I'm inferring all of that from his pithy, Twitter-conforming brief comments. I hope he finds time to clarify his position outside of the 140 character limit of a single Tweet on Twitter.

By the way, I can understand, to a very small degree, Bully Ray's frustration. He's a heel trying to get heel heat, he'd argue, so why should he care about hurting people's feelings?

Well, first and foremost, because his boss said "This will not be tolerated."

She has the good judgment and experience to know that saying those vile epithets in any context is going to cause controversy. Heck, look at the controversy for "Django Unchained" having the n-word in the script.

In that instance, though, the movie was intending to "depict a truthful representation of life in the antebellum south."

Also, TNA ain't Quentin Tarantino. Sorry. It's a modestly rated original cable TV series that blurs the lines between reality and fiction, but is marketed to families and not advertised as R-rated. It's stars post on Twitter using their on-air names and go in and out of character.

Even more so, though, it's all about context. There are very few places where calling someone "f----t" - whether they are gay, suspected of being gay, or obviously not gay - is going to be seen as the least bit acceptable. A movie portraying bigots being completely reprehensible people might be one context where you'd not just accept, but expect that word being used. A portrayal of schoolyard bullying in a movie might be another place.

In those situations, the viewer or audience member would know, based on context, that they might run into that word used in a certain situation - to convey the volatility of that word and the historical baggage that comes with it.

Like the n-word, the anti-gay f-word is linked to a lot of violence and dehumanizing verbal attacks over the decades. The idea that anyone at a TNA wrestling show, marketed to families including children, would want to be within earshot of that kind of language - especially in 2013 (although that's not excusing its usage in 1993 or 1973, either) - is crazy talk.

Dixie Carter knows how TNA positions itself in the marketplace. She knows, if she listed words on a sheet of paper that her TV stars were going to use in public while in character at TNA events and presented them to executives at Spike TV and Viacom or sponsors and licensing partners, "f----t" and "queer" wouldn't be presented on that list. She knows that would destroy her credibility with everyone she does business with that she would even think that word would be part of a heel pro wrestler's vernacular - at least a pro wrestler on a nationally televised show on a major cable network.

There are many ways to portray a bully. The cheapest, shortest, easiest, laziest way is to begin throwing around sexist, racist, anti-gay terms that have historical baggage that causes many people who have explored the real world just a little in their lives recoil.

To gay people, friends of gay people, family of gay people, sons and daughters of gay people, and decent people who can empathize with people who have been victimized by hate speech and words that tend to send messages to unstable bigots looking to pick on those who are weak and different than them, the word "f----t" is more than "just another word." It is scary.

People who say that word sometimes think it means gay people are such a threat, so different, so sinful, so unusual, so... whatever, that it's okay to pick on them, badger them, attack them, and sometimes even kill them. Using that word in almost any context in the real world says a lot about the person saying it. Even the most skilled of comedians tend not to use the word except to talk about how controversial it is to use the word, or to make fun of people (and themselves) for using the word in the past without regarding for how it affected those it originally targeted.

In Bully Ray's case, the fact that he thought saying it coincides with "no harm was meant" is absolutely ludicrous.

His only defense that I can imagine is that he meant harm, you know, because he's a heel and his goal is to hurt people's feelings to get heat or insult people so they boo him. Why in the hell would he use that word if not to cause harm? He said those words because he felt this annoying fan in the crowd that others on the roster also despised would be dehumanized by being accused of being gay in front of his family, friends, and hometown. Why else say it? It wasn't a compliment, it wasn't neutral (like, "Hey, you car-driving, food-eating, clothes-wearing human"). It was meant as an insult. In other words, if you're called out for being gay in public, you should feel humiliated.

Really classy.

But remember, in his apology he said: "…if anyone was offended by this." So it's not that he agrees it's wrong to say it and that he was reducing himself to the lowest form of cheap, lazy heel heat. He's only sorry "if anyone was offended." If no one was offended, well, he stands by the comment, even if it was deemed "inappropriate" by his boss.

Here's a good apology, one that I would have applauded Bully, or should I say Mark LaMonaco, for saying:

"Everybody needs to be held accountable for their bullsh--, me included. What I said was bullsh--. I'm embarrassed. I own up to being a total douche in this situation and I offer a sincere apology to anybody I hurt with careless words."

I didn't just make that up. That's what C.M. Punk wrote two years ago after he called a fan a "homo" and was recorded doing so by a fan camera.

Punk was a man. He didn't retreat. He didn't make excuses. He didn't hide behind the fact that he's an entertainer and part of a show. He said the truth. He was a douche. It was bullsh--. And he apologized for anyone he hurt with careless words.

That was redeeming and classy. It also, by the way, ended the story on Day One.

So let me get this straight. Punk's PR was worded better than Bully's, so he gets off the hook. That makes a ton of sense. So basically, Keller is just looking for better sounding PR.

This guy better not fall off that high horse, he'll break something. Either be offended, or don't be.
 
I remember one of the various times in the past I subscribed to the Torch, I think it was after the Benoit deal (could have been after Guerrero's death, don't 100% remember).....for awhile, most of what Keller wrote about and did podcasts about was coming up with these ideas about how to change the business for the better.

Were some of them good ideas....in theory, perhaps (I remember one or two of them).

But I'm talking about he went on and on and on about how WWE needed to institute an off-season, have rotating rosters so one group could rest for a month or two while the other is on the road, etc.

Of course, I remember thinking (in the aftermath of a horrible event, but still)...shut the fuck up with this bullshit. Nothing like that is going to happen and it's a waste to spend so much time on it.

It just seemed like he was trying to do so much more than what he's there for (report news, analyze it and draw from his decades covering the business).


This isn't a massive story, whether you think it should be or shouldn't be. I'll assume Keller is spending the majority of the week talking about Bully's dumb ass though.
 
Hes okay with him making sexist comments on air but not homophobic comments when no one can even hear him? What? I called him a baby on twitter.
 
TMZ says Chris Masters saved his mother from her burning home by uprooting a tree and tossing it through a window.

Some freak neighbor set fire to the place.

Woah.
 
So WWE plans to phase out PPVs and have everything on the network. I wonder how much cash they stand to lose from that, just from the people that buy two or three per year.
 
So WWE plans to phase out PPVs and have everything on the network. I wonder how much cash they stand to lose from that, just from the people that buy two or three per year.

The network will be around $12-$15 per month. I think the break even number is something like 3 million subscribers. Go back a few pages, I posted the breakdown.

It's a calculated risk to mess with the #1 revenue stream. But without the PPV's, nobody is buying the network. They will never admit that, but they needed that hook. WWE 24/7 has like 50,000 subscribers worldwide or something. A network with no PPV's wouldn't be drastically different in terms of content.

They will get 100,000 or so sure fire subscribers, the people who buy every PPV who will save $30 per month. How they plan to attract the other 2.9 million is a mystery to me. I'm not paying $15 p/m for the network based on what we think is going to be on it. The PPV's are not a draw for me, I don't even watch most of them for free illegally.
 
Sorry, break even is ONE million subscribers. Here is Meltzer's breakdown from the quarterly investors call a few weeks ago:

CFO George Barrios, who did most of the talking, talked about the network as losing money early, figuring in start up costs and cannibalization of the PPV business. They were projecting, when the entire country has access to the network, that they will maintain at between 2 million and 4 million subscription homes in the U.S. with a proposed monthly price point of between $12.99 and $14.99. They project, based on those figures, that the company will double to triple its current level of profits by 2015, depending upon where between that 2 million and 4 million figure they base out at.

Of course, many are skeptical of those projections. Monday Night Raw on 3/11 was viewed, for free, in 3,313,000 homes. They are talking about getting the same number of homes to all spend $12.99 to $14.99 monthly on their network when they already get six-and–a-half hours of first-run free weekly programming, and most of those viewers don’t watch anywhere near all six-and-a-half hours.

In 2012, the company averaged about 102,000 to 105,000 U.S. buys on PPV, so we know those people are going to get the network since they are paying either $44.95 or $54.95 monthly. The 2013 Royal Rumble did 322,000 North American buys, which, taking out Canada and Puerto Rico, would probably be 280,000 to 285,000 in the U.S. (and with late reported buys that could reasonably assumed to end up at 294,000 to 310,000). There are currently 85,000 homes worldwide that still subscribe to 24/7 Classics on Demand at $7.99 in most places. So maybe we’re talking 50-60,000 in the U.S.

Those are all base numbers for the people that we should expect will purchase the network as soon as it’s available. Using those numbers to extrapolate the final number you are going to reach is more than 2 million is difficult. But as noted many times, this is uncharted water.

They noted that at those prices, break-even on the network will be roughly 1 million subscribers. They don’t expect that many right away, but expect continued growth until hitting a plateau in 2015. The projection is with 2 million subscribers, that would be $125 million in added annual revenue and $50 million in pre-tax profit. At 4 million, it would be $250 million in added revenue and $150 million of that would be pre-tax profit.

It should be noted that they are not projecting a start date for the network, not even saying it would be before the end of 2013. They also don’t expect it to roll out nationally. The plan, as stated here before, is that the network would offer every PPV but WrestleMania, and once it is available on a national basis and the fan base has converted, they will be down to one PPV per year. As noted before, if they do that, most likely that event will be far bigger and WrestleMania, which did about 650,000 buys in the U.S. alone last year, could increase significantly with the idea there is only one such show during the year, similar to boxing’s gains per event on PPV by running fewer major shows.

The feeling is if, say, the network opens and is available on only a few systems and in, let’s just say, 30% of the U.S. homes, it will lose money at first and that’s not an issue because they are expecting that in the first year or so. But after a year in those homes, they will have the data on how well it is received. If it bombs in those places, then they can cut losses early. If it does so-so, they can behave accordingly. If it does well, that will give them leverage because everyone else will want to jump aboard.
 
There are like 5 bars and restaurants in a 10 mile radius of my house that show all the WWE PPVs

I believe you, but I'm not sure that's typical. Zero bars show WWE in my town, to my knowledge. Some of these shows are doing like 90,000 domestic, I just don't see the demand for bars to jump on the network unless the product gets much hotter.

The bars that currently show the PPV's will obviously buy it. But how many of those 100,000 regular buyers are bars? I don't think many others will hop on.
 
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