When will the Patriots realize that they need to draft a WR?

[JOHNNYTHECLOWN]

I'm talking about the Patriots not needing to draft a WR.. as the thread title suggests?? :dunno:

Thread got away from us quick.

 

[RosettaStoned]

The Steelers beat the Pats for the same reason the Jets beat them in the playoffs last year. Fucking up their WR's at the line of scrimmage.


I've spent every Pats game, every year screaming for Lebeau to stop zone blitzing those assholes and man up. It's not hard to game plan for the pats, thanks to Rex Ryan having the balls to try it. They have small unphysical wr's and when that slot guy gets worked it's a sack or a bad pass.

Also the first Steelers/Ravens game was a fluke(7 turnovers). The second game our defense was beat up, and they lost us the game.

ITT JTC is a retard.

 

[nflman2033]

It's amazing how dumb JTC and nflman are in this thread in some of their posts. 2007 Pats destroyed everyone in their path but lost in the final minute of one of the best SBs ever, yet they continue to revert back to the SB winning teams (which clearly had better defenses) WRs when Tailback suggests drafting a WR early in the draft. I agree that they need help on D first and foremost next year because they aren't as good on offense as their Defense is bad, if that makes sense. If Chad Johnson had a fucking clue and actually figured out what to do in their system this thread wouldn't of been created, and the Pats would probably be averaging a few more PPG. Unless he has a quality playoff run I think you try and dump him on someone else and find someone to take his spot next year.

you are focusing on the wrong part of the argument, My point is that they won 3 SB's without a top tier WR, and lost the only SB they were in when they had one, I never said the reason they lost was because they had Moss or the reason why they won the other 3 was because they didn't have it, I was only point to a FACT that they won 3 Super Bowls without an elite WR. I have no idea how it is dumb to point to a fact.

 

[BigBucs]

Just to be clear - I think the Patriots consistently overachieve.

I really don't think they are that talented offensively. They obviously execute better than anyone, outside of the Packers (arguably).

You can say that about a lot of teams with top tier QB's. We are seeing 1st hand what a grade A signal caller does for a marginal team. Cut the head the body will follow.

 

[Mogriffjr]

The Steelers beat the Pats for the same reason the Jets beat them in the playoffs last year. Fucking up their WR's at the line of scrimmage.


I've spent every Pats game, every year screaming for Lebeau to stop zone blitzing those assholes and man up. It's not hard to game plan for the pats, thanks to Rex Ryan having the balls to try it. They have small unphysical wr's and when that slot guy gets worked it's a sack or a bad pass.

Also the first Steelers/Ravens game was a fluke(7 turnovers). The second game our defense was beat up, and they lost us the game.

ITT JTC is a retard.

Exactly.

Funny I brought this up earlier but KG got all pissy when I said his team lacks talent pretty much across the board.

Yes the Belechick way, blah, blah is so successful...it gets you 11-14 wins a season.

But in the playoffs the last few years, they haven't won a playoff game.

I was saying trying to build a team where your skill players are undrafted FA's, and late rounders won't work when it matters most.

BB can mostly find guys who can fit into his system....it seems he has trouble trying to get great/elite talent in there though.

 

[DSpydr84]

Exactly.

Funny I brought this up earlier but KG got all pissy when I said his team lacks talent pretty much across the board.

Yes the Belechick way, blah, blah is so successful...it gets you 11-14 wins a season.

But in the playoffs the last few years, they haven't won a playoff game.

I was saying trying to build a team where your skill players are undrafted FA's, and late rounders won't work when it matters most.

BB can mostly find guys who can fit into his system....it seems he has trouble trying to get great/elite talent in there though.

I think you guys are scrutinizing this a bit much. For a team that everybody apparently knows how to beat, they're still having a ton of success. Their three losses were by a combined 15 points this season.

To say the Jets or the Steelers "put the blueprint out" for beating the Patriots is laughable. These teams consistently trade wins; the Patriots owned the Jets this season in both games, and Pittsburgh was beaten last year in convincing fashion. When two good teams play, they usually split games. That doesn't mean the Patriots are "found out".

I also find it funny that the Patriots not winning in the post-season is an argument. They've missed the playoffs twice in ten years, and have been one-and-done only recently the past two seasons. I would kill for that kind of success. '07 they won two games, '06 they won two, '05 they won one, and '04/'03/'01 they won the Superbowl. Again, mind you, this is the playoffs. It's not like they're losing to scrub teams.

I'm no Patriots fan. But you can't NOT respect what they've done and how they continue to win games with very few "star" players.

 

[Tailback U]

I don't get why people are overreacting about the comments I've made, turning this into an "any given sunday" or "you're an idiot if you think the patriots aren't doing everything right" argument.

I really hope the Steelers and Pats meet so we can bump this thread in a few weeks. That is exactly why I made it.

I wanted to make a prediction based on an opinion of mine, nothing more, and a bunch of you get your panties in a twist because somebody on a football forum suggests a team is one big time WR away from taking it to another level.

 

[Len B]

2011 Patriots - 9-3, 3rd in PPG (without a big name WR)
2010 Patriots - 14-2, 1st in PPG (without a big name WR)
2009 Patriots - 10-6, 6th in PPG (with Moss)
2008 Patriots - 11-5, 8th in PPG (with Cassel, Moss)

This thread should be re-named, "When will people realize the Patriots have a very successful system, shouldn't fuck around with it, need better defensive players and hopefully they can keep continuing to have success at a high rate"

They've made four Superbowls since the 2000s, and mother fuckers think they are going to get back every year with the way salary caps are set up? :yao:

I'll take four years of Superbowls, and then a team that continues to win their division every year over a big named WR. When will people realize that the NFL isn't that easy to make it to the Superbowl in? If your team doesn't make it, suddenly they are flawed? It's a crap shoot and they were lucky to already make it to four.

Belichick is always ahead of the curve, and if you look at stats teams with productive tight ends are now on top of the league, not wide receivers.

 

[Len B]

I don't get why people are overreacting about the comments I've made, turning this into an "any given sunday" or "you're an idiot if you think the patriots aren't doing everything right" argument.

I really hope the Steelers and Pats meet so we can bump this thread in a few weeks. That is exactly why I made it.

I wanted to make a prediction based on an opinion of mine, nothing more, and a bunch of you get your panties in a twist because somebody on a football forum suggests a team is one big time WR away from taking it to another level.

Because if the Steelers beat the Patriots its because Mike Wallace and Hines Ward are better than Wes Welker and Deion Branch, right?

Surely, it has nothing to do with the fact that Pittsburgh is 5x better on defense. The Patriots losing to the Steelers would not prove the point that the Patriots need a WR, it'd prove the point that dominating defenses tend to win in the NFL playoffs.

Let's go ask Calvin Johnson, Terrell Owens, Randy Moss, Andre Johnson, Larry Fitzgerald, etc. how many Superbowls they've won.

 

[Tailback U]

LOL..You're acting like a big time WR would have prevented them or made them worse somehow.

Not only do they not have a legit #1 stud WR, but they also have an average defense.

They haven't made the Super Bowl in 7 years, and the teams that went to the SB were completely different schematically and personnel wise from these Patriots teams. Why do you guys fail to realize that?

 

[Tailback U]

Because if the Steelers beat the Patriots its because Mike Wallace and Hines Ward are better than Wes Welker and Deion Branch, right?

Surely, it has nothing to do with the fact that Pittsburgh is 5x better on defense. The Patriots losing to the Steelers would not prove the point that the Patriots need a WR, it'd prove the point that dominating defenses tend to win in the NFL playoffs.

Let's go ask Calvin Johnson, Terrell Owens, Randy Moss, Andre Johnson, Larry Fitzgerald, etc. how many Superbowls they've won.

You're not getting it.

The Steelers play a different brand of football than the Patriots.

The Patriots rely on Brady. They should help Brady out by getting him a legit WR instead of having him try to throw to four 5'10" midgets and one 6'6" TE.

Can the Patriots beat the Steelers? Of course they can. I don't think they will, doesn't mean they won't. If they do then my argument will be irrelevant, but I'd really love to see how they will beat them if they do, because they're not going to be able to just spread it out 4 and 5 wide and chuck it around.

 

[DSpydr84]

LOL..You're acting like a big time WR would have prevented them or made them worse somehow.

Not only do they not have a legit #1 stud WR, but they also have an average defense.

They haven't made the Super Bowl in 7 years, and the teams that went to the SB were completely different schematically and personnel wise from these Patriots teams. Why do you guys fail to realize that?

:jonesy:

I don't know what team you follow, but my team hasn't made the Superbowl EVER. This ain't a bad stretch.

 

[Len B]

LOL..You're acting like a big time WR would have prevented them or made them worse somehow.

Not only do they not have a legit #1 stud WR, but they also have an average defense.

They haven't made the Super Bowl in 7 years, and the teams that went to the SB were completely different schematically and personnel wise from these Patriots teams. Why do you guys fail to realize that?

Funny, since the 2008 season the Patriots couldn't get shit done with Randy Moss, and Tom Brady was forcing the ball to him too many times deep.

Trade Randy Moss, suddenly the entire field opens up and Brady starts having more success. Because they lost to the Baltimore Ravens with no Wes Welker and to the New York Jets, suddenly they can't move the ball?

How did that "press the WR" strategy work for the Jets in the two games this year? Teams are allowed to have bad games, and the Patriots were actually moving the ball very well early on against the Jets in the playoffs. Tom Brady threw 66% for 300 yards, and they scored 21 points. Had they not botched two drives in early in the game (a dropped TD and a Brady fumble) they'd be close to thirty points. But, you just see that they lost and assume it was the passing game against the BEST corner back in the league. Not every team has a Revis.

What you should focus on is how the Jets had a better defense than the Patriots, and the Ravens had a much better running game and defensive team than the Patriots.

 

[Len B]

The Patriots rely on Brady. They should help Brady out by getting him a legit WR instead of having him try to throw to four 5'10" midgets and one 6'6" TE.

If Brady prefers short timing routes and the playbook favors it, why do they need to switch it up just so they can say they have a good receiver?

There's a reason Troy Brown, Welker and Deion Branch were Brady's favorite targets, and there's a reason Stallworth, Moss, Chad Jackson, etc. are no longer on the team.

Maybe the Pats should draft DHB!

 

[Len B]

You're not getting it.

The Steelers play a different brand of football than the Patriots.

The Patriots rely on Brady. They should help Brady out by getting him a legit WR instead of having him try to throw to four 5'10" midgets and one 6'6" TE.

Can the Patriots beat the Steelers? Of course they can. I don't think they will, doesn't mean they won't. If they do then my argument will be irrelevant, but I'd really love to see how they will beat them if they do, because they're not going to be able to just spread it out 4 and 5 wide and chuck it around.

Tom Brady career vs. Pittsburgh:

103.7 QB Rating, 6 games, 14 touchdowns, 3 interceptions. This includes 2-0 in the playoffs.

Your argument has nothing to do with wide receivers. If you wanted to argue why the Patriots aren't as good in playoffs because of horrible drafting at the defensive positions, I'd be willing to agree with you.

I think Pittsburgh will beat the Patriots this year, but it has more to do with the defenses.

 

[RosettaStoned]

I think you guys are scrutinizing this a bit much. For a team that everybody apparently knows how to beat, they're still having a ton of success. Their three losses were by a combined 15 points this season.

To say the Jets or the Steelers "put the blueprint out" for beating the Patriots is laughable. These teams consistently trade wins; the Patriots owned the Jets this season in both games, and Pittsburgh was beaten last year in convincing fashion. When two good teams play, they usually split games. That doesn't mean the Patriots are "found out".

I also find it funny that the Patriots not winning in the post-season is an argument. They've missed the playoffs twice in ten years, and have been one-and-done only recently the past two seasons. I would kill for that kind of success. '07 they won two games, '06 they won two, '05 they won one, and '04/'03/'01 they won the Superbowl. Again, mind you, this is the playoffs. It's not like they're losing to scrub teams.

I'm no Patriots fan. But you can't NOT respect what they've done and how they continue to win games with very few "star" players.

To be fair the Steelers played them this way once. As for them winning a lot of games.. well for starters like I just said.. the Steelers played them man press with pressure once out of forever. Second, not all teams have the personel to do this.

 

[RosettaStoned]

Tom Brady career vs. Pittsburgh:

103.7 QB Rating, 6 games, 14 touchdowns, 3 interceptions. This includes 2-0 in the playoffs.

Your argument has nothing to do with wide receivers. If you wanted to argue why the Patriots aren't as good in playoffs because of horrible drafting at the defensive positions, I'd be willing to agree with you.

I think Pittsburgh will beat the Patriots this year, but it has more to do with the defenses.

Again, they have played them man press once in history. And it stifled them.

 

[SlowMs3]

What the Pats really need is to run more... Last super bowl they won was 2004 when Dillon went nuts on people and ran for 1600yds... the whole "they need to draft a wr" is stupid... No one is able to cover Gronk..and Hernandez is like a big WR... Welker is a deep threat (99yd td this year). The D needs help... Lucky for us our D-Line has been doing good. I think if the steelers and pats play again the Patriots will win. Two out of the 3 loss we have came in the 4th quarter when we had the lead...... THEY NEED TO CLOSE OUT GAMES!!! We should be 11-1

 

[Scorask]

LOL..You're acting like a big time WR would have prevented them or made them worse somehow.

Not only do they not have a legit #1 stud WR, but they also have an average defense.

They haven't made the Super Bowl in 4 years, and the teams that went to the SB were completely different schematically and personnel wise from these Patriots teams. Why do you guys fail to realize that?

Fixed

 

[killgod]

Exactly.

Funny I brought this up earlier but KG got all pissy when I said his team lacks talent pretty much across the board.

Yes the Belechick way, blah, blah is so successful...it gets you 11-14 wins a season.

But in the playoffs the last few years, they haven't won a playoff game.

I was saying trying to build a team where your skill players are undrafted FA's, and late rounders won't work when it matters most.

BB can mostly find guys who can fit into his system....it seems he has trouble trying to get great/elite talent in there though.

You mean the guy we scooped off some team's practice squad (perhaps it was KC? I don't remember) who now leads the NFL in interceptions? We apparently need to pay Asomugha 100M for that? Yeah OK! Seems like we made a mistake by not getting "great/elite" talent!" It doesn't always work and is a bigger risk than trying to find a unknown talent that fits but you insinuate that spending the big dollars is the only way to go...

BB gets great value from his players and minimizes risk, that's how you live in the Salary Cap era and consistently have the ability to perform near the top of the table. If you lock into large contracts on big time talent that shits the bed, you're fucked. How is it helping the teams that make those moves?

Is D-Will in Carolina worth the money so far?
Is CJ in Tennessee worth the money so far?
Is Bradford in St Louis worth the money so far?
Is Asomugha in Philly worth the money so far?
Is Routt worth 10M in Oakland?
Paul Soliai making god knows what the fuck in Miami. Nobody even knows who this fuck is.
How did Fat Albert 100M work out in Washington? He then came to NE, on a calculated risk that cost us little and nothing to let him go.

How about Mark Sanchez? Is he worth 17 Million Fucking Dollars this season? :troll:


And what the fuck, are we supposed to win the Superbowl on every trip to the playoffs to justify the system? Like wtf kind of logic are trying to put out here? If it doesn't win every year then the system is broken?

Newsflash, you haven't even been to a Super Bowl, so what's your system if our's is broken?