PSU Penalties: $60 Mil Fine, 4-Year Bowl Ban, 40 Schollies Over 4 Years, Wins Vacated

[Warner2BruceTD]

It doesn't, and I'm not saying it does, I just found that to be an unfortunate phrasing considering getting molested as a young child is a lot more emotionally destructive than having to relocate because your business closed down.

Let's keep some perspective here. Whether you agree with how the NCAA handled this situation, their actions did not victimize anybody.

dude...

I agree. You orginally quoted me talking in response about what the death penalty would have resulted in. I don't have issues with the sanctions, because the NCAA (intentionally or otherwise) created as little collateral damage as possible, while also hammering the program.

 

[SethMode]

Let's keep some perspective here. Whether you agree with how the NCAA handled this situation, its actions did not victimize anybody, at least nowhere near to the degree that the actual victims experienced. Let's stop equating those two things.

I think that that is at the very least debatable and certainly remains to be seen. I understand this is your favorite story to bust in on your moral high horse on, but as I said in an earlier post, if you don't think this ruling hurts more than just the Penn State football team, you're delusional.

 

[FirstTimer]

I think that that is at the very least debatable and certainly remains to be seen. I understand this is your favorite story to bust in on your moral high horse on, but as I said in an earlier post, if you don't think this ruling hurts more than just the Penn State football team, you're delusional.

Seth, I'm pretty sure no matter what happens down the road it's a fairly safe assumption to make that PSU sanctions and the repercussions as a result won't land in the same field of being a victim as being raped and blown by a 50 year old man.

 

[SethMode]

Seth, I'm pretty sure no matter what happens down the road it's a fairly safe assumption to make that PSU sanctions and the repercussions as a result won't land in the same field of being a victim as being raped and blown by a 50 year old man.

Certainly not, and I don't think that I implied that (nor do I think that W2B did). I'm simply pointing out that these sanctions do stand to create more victims of a different type. I don't think it's fair to say that to be a victim in this situation you either had to be one of Sandusky's prey or something similar to it.

 

[FirstTimer]

Certainly not, and I don't think that I implied that (nor do I think that W2B did). I'm simply pointing out that these sanctions do stand to create more victims of a different type. I don't think it's fair to say that to be a victim in this situation you either had to be one of Sandusky's prey or something similar to it.

Well NAHSTE said this:

"Whether you agree with how the NCAA handled this situation, its actions did not victimize anybody, at least nowhere near to the degree that the actual victims experienced"

Maybe you're "that's debatebale was more to the first half of the statement but still, does that need to be said?

And frankly, those "victims" can blame PSU as well for not handling their shit like they should have 10+ years ago.

I just think using the term victims is a little melodramatic in context of people possibly losing money when children were raped.

 

[SethMode]

Let me just add that this isn't really worth arguing about between the two of us, because I personally think that the NCAA overstepped its bounds and stretched the basis for "institutional control" too far. I respect and won't even detract from those that differ from that opinion, but I personally don't see myself being convinced of it. So arguing about victimization in this case is kind of moot because my entire basis behind it is that I think the NCAA shouldn't have been involved.

 

[FirstTimer]

Let me just add that this isn't really worth arguing about between the two of us, because I personally think that the NCAA overstepped its bounds and stretched the basis for "institutional control" too far. I respect and won't even detract from those that differ from that opinion, but I personally don't see myself being convinced of it. So arguing about victimization in this case is kind of moot because my entire basis behind it is that I think the NCAA shouldn't have been involved.

Fair enough.










Fuck you.

 

[NAHSTE]

dude...

I agree. You orginally quoted me talking in response about what the death penalty would have resulted in. I don't have issues with the sanctions, because the NCAA (intentionally or otherwise) created as little collateral damage as possible, while also hammering the program.

I don't think the death penalty would have created "more" victims. That implies that we are just adding on to the current number, like they are under the same umbrella. They aren't.

Losing your football team because they are believed to have committed heinous crimes does not make you a victim. It makes you a fan of a football team that is believed to have committed heinous crimes. Whether or not you had anything to do with it, whether or not the punishment was deserved, etc. None of that shit matters. Call it what you want, I am just wary of the statement that it would be "adding more victims" because that implies that their suffering is equivalent to the suffering of the actual victims.

I take issue with your phrasing, mainly, and this has nothing to do with my personal view of the NCAA's ruling. Semantics? You bet, but I just don't think we should be equating the two groups of people is all.

 

[FirstTimer]

Long NYTimes story on looking back at the boards decision to fire Paterno.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/19/s...-decision-to-fire-paterno.html?pagewanted=all

 

[ralaw]

............some of the more self righteous here could use some as well...................

....moral high horse ........

Your use of these words concerns me. People are only condemning the actions of PSU leadership for harboring a child molester and condemning those who still support Paterno even given his apathy. How is condemning them being considered self righteous or sitting on a moral high horse?

 

[SethMode]

Well NAHSTE said this:

Maybe you're "that's debatebale was more to the first half of the statement but still, does that need to be said?

And frankly, those "victims" can blame PSU as well for not handling their shit like they should have 10+ years ago.

I just think using the term victims is a little melodramatic in context of people possibly losing money when children were raped.

Sorry, that was a poor sentence on my part, I didn't clarify that I was referring to the NCAA's actions victimizing people, not that it was debatable that said victimizing was on par with child molestation.

This is why I wanted to become a vet, to get AWAY from having to construct carefully worded arguments haha

 

[SethMode]

Your use of these words concerns me. People are only condemning the actions of PSU leadership for harboring a child molester and condemning those who still support Paterno even given his apathy. How is condemning them being considered self righteous or sitting on a moral high horse?

In short: I think NAHSTE and FedEx were kind of being douches about it, and purposefully trying to stir the pot at times. It's the internet, so whatever, it just got to the point where it started to kind of creep me out that they almost felt like they NEEDED to roll in and type "MOLDER OF MEN!" or something. It seems disingenuous to me, like most instances of people acting extremely self righteous does.

 

[NAHSTE]

Your use of these words concerns me. People are only condemning the actions of PSU leadership for harboring a child molester and condemning those who still support Paterno even given his apathy. How is condemning them being considered self righteous or sitting on a moral high horse?

It all strikes me as very ironic considering Penn State football spent the last 50 years identifying themselves as being morally superior to the rest of the country. THE GRAND EXPERIMENT and all that ...

But no, it's we who are on the high horse. Right.

It seems disingenuous to me, like most instances of people acting extremely self righteous does.

LOL that's funny because that sums up my opinion of Joe Paterno, one that I developed long before any of this ever came out. It's possible that my longstanding belief that he was full of shit is coloring my outrage. Since I already thought he was an undercover scum bag, all these revelations have just emboldened my opinions. I'll admit to some bouts of overzealousness here and in the 20 other threads on this topic.

 

[SethMode]

It all strikes me as very ironic considering Penn State football spent the last 50 years identifying themselves as being morally superior to the rest of the country. THE GRAND EXPERIMENT and all that ...

But no, it's we who are on the high horse. Right.

See, this is what I mean. The fact that you take such delight out of the whole, very tragic, situation, is weird to me.

Would it be okay if I also said that PSU was on a moral high horse as well? Because they were. Am I allowed to say that your glib comments make you sound disingenuous now?

 

[EmpireWF]

lol @ this

http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/25/us/pennsylvania-penn-state-insurer/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

PSU's general liability insurer wants to deny them coverage...it would foce the school to pay out of their pocket all the upcoming damages they'll owe.

 

[NAHSTE]

See, this is what I mean. The fact that you take such delight out of the whole, very tragic, situation, is weird to me.

Would it be okay if I also said that PSU was on a moral high horse as well? Because they were. Am I allowed to say that your glib comments make you sound disingenuous now?

See edit of my previous post. I don't take any delight out of the situation, but I guess you could say I am taking some delight in false morality being exposed. Again, that could just be colored by my personal opinions on those who promote themselves as "morally upstanding" ... Tressell, Bowden, Richt, etc. are the kind of coaches whose portrayal in the media rubs me the wrong way, but that is a topic for another thread.

 

[ralaw]

In short: I think NAHSTE and FedEx were kind of being douches about it, and purposefully trying to stir the pot at times. It's the internet, so whatever, it just got to the point where it started to kind of creep me out that they almost felt like they NEEDED to roll in and type "MOLDER OF MEN!" or something. It seems disingenuous to me, like most instances of people acting extremely self righteous does.

Meh, it's part of the story though. For 50 years we've heard of how Paterno and PSU were so morally upright the arguments were always “we’ve never had any compliance issues” and/or “molder of men”. The image of Paterno is the reason why so many PSU supporters have a hard time accepting the fact that this happened and they allow their allegiance to Paterno/PSU override the fact that kids got raped. In the grand scheme of things everyone involved including Paterno are/were a POS for allowing it to happen. End of story. He can still be an overall good guy, but he still was a POS for allowing it to happen.

 

[RosettaStoned]

Let me just add that this isn't really worth arguing about between the two of us, because I personally think that the NCAA overstepped its bounds and stretched the basis for "institutional control" too far. I respect and won't even detract from those that differ from that opinion, but I personally don't see myself being convinced of it. So arguing about victimization in this case is kind of moot because my entire basis behind it is that I think the NCAA shouldn't have been involved.

Right. The sanctioning body of collegiate sports shouldn't be involved when an assistant coach is butt fucking little boys, and then is allowed, and enabled by a head coach turning a blind eye.... to continue to hang around and fuck little boys in the locker room.

Please die. Btw, moral high horse had fuck all to do with it. I have a child. If anybody did that to my child.. I would want that person, everybody that knew about it, and everybody that continued to support that person and bitch about how unfair the system was to that person.. to be rounded up and cooked, Jew style.

I fucking hate you, please die.

Fuck Penn State, fuck their fans, fuck that community. Anybody that wants to continue to have a business there that benefits from that shithole institution and it's shithole sports teams needs to be punched in the face.

 

[RosettaStoned]

Also, fuck you shag. Why don't you stop groaning me like a pussy and give your opinion on my posts so I can tell you why you're a fucking idiot?

 

[shag773]

Also, fuck you shag. Why don't you stop groaning me like a pussy and give your opinion on my posts so I can tell you why you're a fucking idiot?

You mean these posts?

Honestly I don't have a problem with that. Assholes at Penn State for real. Their student body sucks.

Because, the vast majority of that community are supporting people that covered up butt fucking small children. Fuck that place.

Right. The sanctioning body of collegiate sports shouldn't be involved when an assistant coach is butt fucking little boys, and then is allowed, and enabled by a head coach turning a blind eye.... to continue to hang around and fuck little boys in the locker room.

Please die. Btw, moral high horse had fuck all to do with it. I have a child. If anybody did that to my child.. I would want that person, everybody that knew about it, and everybody that continued to support that person and bitch about how unfair the system was to that person.. to be rounded up and cooked, Jew style.

I fucking hate you, please die.

Fuck Penn State, fuck their fans, fuck that community. Anybody that wants to continue to have a business there that benefits from that shithole institution and it's shithole sports teams needs to be punched in the face.

Here's my opinion. They are devoid of thought and have no intellectual value whatsoever. You post this mindless drivel because you are a flaming assbag that has nothing better to do then rile up posters that are in the midst of an actual discussion. I didn't respond because I thought your asinine comments pretty much spoke for themselves.

Now scurry along junior, the adults are trying to talk...