WEC June 7thy on Versus

[Liquidrob]

By consistency I mean you credit fighters for nothing and discredit them for other things.

How is owning one fighter better than beating a number of fighters? That makes no sense. We've never seen Brown against stiffer competition than Yves Edwards. Leonard Garcia is not stiff competition. He, much like Brown, losses to most decent fighters he fights (Huerta, Cole Miller), his only noteable win is against Jens Pulver, who is pretty overrated at this point of his career anyways. Same goes for Curran. Brown obviously owns Faber, hes bigger in stature and is a nasty fighter. But come on.. of all fighters in the world this guy is in the top 10 p4p? Really? And you're discrediting Machida and giving this guy credit just cause he can beat Faber?

I'm not discrediting Machida, he is of course in the top p4p talk, but so is Brown, I dont really see what your getting at, but when you break down Machidas opppnents they are not that great, machida is still great, but his resume isnt worldy

Owning Faber twice is as good of not better than Tito and Rashad, just like Fedor beating Nog twice, same concept, not hard to understand, of course has more great wins, but those 2 Nog wins are huge, Nog was the king of the heavys just like Faber was

Garica losses were at 155 and Curran he is good comp and is comparable to Bonnar or someone like that

Yves > Sok and White easily, Vernon isnt even a 500 fighter

Thiago has zero good wins, so we cant take much from him, still a wild card

All of Browns losses except 1 were at a higher weight and against quality guys, Genki and Hermes were fighting for the 155 belt in the UFC and Joe Lauzon is also a good fighter

Brown is a beast at 145 and if you cant see that I dont know what to tell you

 

[LiquidLarry2GhostWF]

I never said top 5, I just said in the discussion of p4p fighters which he is a part of now

He's probably around the Top 10, probably in it, IMO.

Usually when you say "it in for the top p4p" makes me think you put him int he best p4p with Fedor, Silva/GSP, and Torres.

 

[Liquidrob]

He's probably around the Top 10, probably in it, IMO.

Usually when you say "it in for the top p4p" makes me think you put him int he best p4p with Fedor, Silva/GSP, and Torres.

I meant in the top 10, everyone in the top 10 is in the discussion

Like Rampage, probably isnt top 5, but he is in the discussion, he is right there

Besides Fedor, GSP and maybe Silva, its a battle for those other spots 2 spots for top 5, Torres, Penn (at 155), Rampage, Machida probably has the upperhand right now, but 1 win or loss moves someone in or out

Actually Torres is a tough one because 135 is a hard ass division to rate, his record is stellar, but tough to rate the 135's, thats why faber and Brown get left out of the talk, but with a lot of 155 talent dropping down it makes it easier than 135

 

[Kuzzy Powers]

I'm not discrediting Machida, he is of course in the top p4p talk, but so is Brown, I dont really see what your getting at, but when you break down Machidas opppnents they are not that great, machida is still great, but his resume isnt worldy

Owning Faber twice is as good of not better than Tito and Rashad, just like Fedor beating Nog twice, same concept, not hard to understand, of course has more great wins, but those 2 Nog wins are huge, Nog was the king of the heavys just like Faber was

Garica losses were at 155 and Curran he is good comp and is comparable to Bonnar or someone like that

Yves > Sok and White easily, Vernon isnt even a 500 fighter

Thiago has zero good wins, so we cant take much from him, still a wild card

All of Browns losses except 1 were at a higher weight and against quality guys, Genki and Hermes were fighting for the 155 belt in the UFC and Joe Lauzon is also a good fighter

Brown is a beast at 145 and if you cant see that I dont know what to tell you

Sure, hes a beast @ 145 where the quality level of fighters is not nearly as high.

All of Brown's losses are against guys you would never consider for the top 10 p4p rankings. All of his wins minus the 2 VS Faber fall under the same category.

I love Yves, but when thats the best fighter you've beaten it doesnt say much.

Curran has been around but IMO isnt on the level of Stephen Bonnar. What has Curran ever done of note in his career?

Through everything you just completely discredit him beating both Franklin and BJ. The whole size thing is a poor excuse for anything.. if you want to fight and bulk up to fight at a certain weight it counts all the same, especially over great fighters.

I dont make the Machida comparison BTW, you did. I still dont see what makes Brown a top 10 p4p fighter.. does being the best at a weak division (ESPECIALLY in America) immediately equal elite status?

Surely you're not comparing Fedor and Mike Brown. Fedor could've went without beating Nog twice and still be a legend. Some guys just own other guys.. Faber is a great fighter but the physical stature of Brown is obviously too much for him.. but id like to see Brown fight a few more higher level fighters before putting him in any top 10.

 

[Liquidrob]

lol @ thinking I compared Fedor to Brown, stop smoking 'the pot'

I said Nog was the king of the HWs, Fedor burst onto the scene with those 2 wins, just like Brown did to Faber who was the King of the 145ers, that was the end of the comparsion

I am also trying to tell you, Browns only loss at 145 is Imanari, losing at 155 to those guys isnt bad, Brown is a 145 fighter, the 145 class just recently really got some press, smaller guys have had to fight at 155 for years to get fights, so a lot of small guys had to take fights at 155 when they shouldnt have had too

lol @ Bonnar, he is only only your list because he was in TUF, his only win is Keith Jardine

Curran has beat Wagnney Fabiano, Rafael Assuncao, and Bao

 

[Kuzzy Powers]

So being a top a weak division = top 10 for you then? Beating Faber and Yves Edwards = top 10.

Ok, gotcha.

 

[Liquidrob]

145 is not weak, you dont get a break like in the other divisions, everyone has cardio (biggest thing), everyone can grapple, strike, etc...the lower weights always have more well rounded fighters

WEC always goes after the top 145 talent in the world, alot of Japanese fighters have said the WEC is the place to fight for the 145 class

 

[Kuzzy Powers]

Its the weakest division in all of MMA, especially in the US.

Top FW fighters in the US:

Mike Brown
Uriajah Faber

then?

Leonard Garcia (lol)
Jeff Curran

The rest of the best is fighting in Japan.

Sorry.. maybe 135 is weaker than 145. But I wont question the beastliness of Miguel Torres for the time being.

 

[Liquidrob]

Its the weakest division in all of MMA, especially in the US.

Top FW fighters in the US:

Mike Brown
Uriajah Faber

then?

Leonard Garcia (lol)
Jeff Curran

The rest of the best is fighting in Japan.

Sorry.. maybe 135 is weaker than 145. But I wont question the beastliness of Miguel Torres for the time being.

wow, lol @ you

WECs 145 division makes the UFC HW division look llike a tough man contest, the skill level and cardio are very high

Brown
Faber
Aldo
Grispi
Cub
Wagnney
Assuncao
Curran
Pulver
Nogueira
Garcia

 

[Steel Mamba]

Again, who cares about the resumes so much. There's no way you can watch that fight and say that Brown is not a top 10 talent in this sport. Both guys are elite fighters IMO. But, with that said I still think Faber could possibly beat Brown had he not injured his hand in the first round.

 

[Kuzzy Powers]

Again, who cares about the resumes so much. There's no way you can watch that fight and say that Brown is not a top 10 talent in this sport. Both guys are elite fighters IMO. But, with that said I still think Faber could possibly beat Brown had he not injured his hand in the first round.

Entertaining fights = top 10 status?

So we just disregard everything in a fighters career and base p4p rankings off of one fight?

Im done arguing anything MMA related if this is how you guys view your criteria for evaluating fighters.

 

[Steel Mamba]

Entertaining fights = top 10 status?

So we just disregard everything in a fighters career and base p4p rankings off of one fight?

Im done arguing anything MMA related if this is how you guys view your criteria for evaluating fighters.

lol. Where did I say anything about his entertainment status being the reason he's a top 10 fighter? Some of you guys make up the most random stuff just to create counter-points.

 

[Kuzzy Powers]

wow, lol @ you

WECs 145 division makes the UFC HW division look llike a tough man contest, the skill level and cardio are very high

Brown
Faber
Aldo
Grispi
Cub
Wagnney
Assuncao
Curran
Pulver
Nogueira
Garcia

LOL @ Pulver and Nogueira.. and Garcia for that matter. Atleast Curran has had a long career under his belt..

Your UFC hate is ridiculous.. the UFC HW division might be poor, but its >>>> 145, especially when you add in the others heavys fighting in America. 145 has some exciting fighters but you're overrating the depth big time.

Its funny how you argue tho.. when you need something to back your own argument up, you're fully willing to credit average fighters. But when you're against someone you shit on them for having "average resumes". Hence why I say you dont have consistency.

 

[Kuzzy Powers]

lol. Where did I say anything about his entertainment status being the reason he's a top 10 fighter? Some of you guys make up the most random stuff just to create counter-points.

You said you cant watch THAT fight and not put him in your top 10. Well, I didnt watch it live, but I watched it today and it was a war, and a very entertaining fight. But how does THAT fight make him a top 10 fighter? He obviously fights Faber very well.. I want to see him against stiffer competition before putting him in a top 10, when theres so many amazing fighters in this world.

 

[Steel Mamba]

You said you cant watch THAT fight and not put him in your top 10. Well, I didnt watch it live, but I watched it today and it was a war, and a very entertaining fight. But how does THAT fight make him a top 10 fighter? He obviously fights Faber very well.. I want to see him against stiffer competition before putting him in a top 10, when theres so many amazing fighters in this world.

Because his talent and skills were on display against the best fighter in that division. That has nothing to do with how entertaining the fight was.

 

[Kuzzy Powers]

So.. again.. if you are at the top of a mediocre division, you should be considered for the top 10? Only beating one great fighter gives you that? Whats the criteria here..

 

[Steel Mamba]

So.. again.. if you are at the top of a mediocre division, you should be considered for the top 10? Only beating one great fighter gives you that? Whats the criteria here..

I mean to each his own, but for me it's mainly based off of everyone's overall ability and skills, resumes factor in but it's not the focal point for me. I've just never been a stats guy, I hate stats, they lie and never tell the entire story. Smith is the All-Time leading rusher in the NFL, so he must be the most talented back to ever play right? Nope. Same with fighting, IMO you gotta base it off of skills and ability. With that said Brown might not have a great resume, but he's certainly talented. Talented enough to be in top 10 talks, I dunno if I'd exactly have him on my list, but I wouldn't argue against it either because his talent justifies him being in that discussion.

 

[RosettaStoned]

The WEC's 145 division >>>>> UFC's heavyweight division.

 

[Kuzzy Powers]

Further knock on Brown for me.. he beat a man who fought the majority of the fight with one hand last nite. Faber couldnt even go for a guillotine in the 5th round because of the injury. If Urijah could've used his right he might've been able to win that fight.

 

[Liquidrob]

lol @ Kuzzy exposing himself over and over on this thread

First off, you are talking about a fighter and division you have no prior knowledge of, your first post in this thread

Faber will avenge his loss to Brown... maybe. I dont know much about Brown but Urijah is a beast.

So, its safe to say that if you dont know about the champ of the division and all you say was Uriah is a beast, you probably have no knowledge of the division and WEC, because if you did you would know that the WEC's signature divisions are 145 and 135 and always try and do get the best 135/145 talent in the world where even Japanese fighters say the best guys are in the WEC, you also listed Uriah and Brown as the only guys in the 145 division, lol

So you are talking about fighter you have no knowledge on but can easily say he doesnt deserve p4p recongnition? please

Than you go and throw out a wack comment about my 'UFC hate', dont you even know that the WEC is owned by Zuffa? Did you even see Jens thanking Zuff and Dana last night?

If I hated the UFC so much you think I wouldnt like the WEC, also always 4 out of my top 5 p4p fighters are in the UFC, and like 7/8 of the top 10, I always sa the UFC has the most talent in the LHW, MW and WW divisions and no Org can even come close in those weight classes, I say BJ Penn is the best LW in the world even though I say the most talent is in Japan

So my 'UFC Hate' is a little exagerated, I always say GSP is the 2nd best p4p fighter in the world, MY GOD THIS UFC HATE!

You should stop posting in on this subject if you go in with no prior knowledge of the fighter you are trying talk about