Enough is enough. Peyton Manning is the greatest QB of all time.

[bucky]

I want a better win/loss record in the playoffs. Manning is .500 in the playoffs for god's sake.

Joe Montana was 16-7.

I think Bart Starr is 9-1 w/ 5 championships in 7 years.

[MrBill]

List the CRITICAL playoff mistakes.
That's why he's not GOAT.

Add Peyton Manning to that list.

[bucky]

Add Peyton Manning to that list.

I don't have Manning as GOAT.

I'm going to wait until Manning's career is over/almost over, before cementing an opinion of him.

Brett's career is either over, or close enough to over for me to form an opinion on him.

[Fox1994]

the thing we all have to look at the criteria we want our goat to have. field general, comebacks, pinpoint accuracy, championships, and leadership off the field.

peyton is a great leader on the field, he's had some comebacks in his carreer, he's got great accuracy, he just can't win consistently in the playoffs, but he does so much off the field stuff that most people don't.

just because of the post season, i don't think he's the goat. Stabach (can't spell) or unitas. those guys were absolutely incredible. unitas in the "greatest game ever played" and roger the dodger was the pioneer of the modern quarterback, and both of those guys revolutionized the position.

unitas was the one who really dominated with the pump fake for the first time. he went out and dominated all the time, and in the joe namath super bowl, Unitas didn't play most of that game, and he still almost won.

Stabach was the guy who took the scrambler and the pocket quarterback roles and put them together. just about every quarterback in the nfl uses that combination now, and if you give me one guy who doesn't scramble these days, i will prove you wrong

Kevin Fox approves of your name...

Moving right along, I don't like Stabauch because he's - allegedly - the reason QB's no longer call their own plays... Though Peyton has been known to do that... And Trent Edwards did in the game at the beginning of the season... I think the season could've been radically different if their return man hadn't thrown that game away.

Also, besides the reasons you listed, John U (he allegedly didn't like to be called Johnny) invented the flea-flicker and the double-reverse, so - in my eyes - no one else can hold his jock.

[Deviant]

And I still beg to differ. If had to choose a quarterback to go out and win me a superbowl and I had my pick of any quarterback in history, I would take Montana every time. Montana won without Rice, something people seem to forget. He also won in KC, leading them to two postseason appearances, and AFC Championship game and beating a powrhouse 49ers team and a very, very good Elway led Broncos team in '94. Check out how he did head-to-head against other top QBs of the era, he dominated Marino and Elway in their Superbowl matchups and posted a 2-1 record against Marino, 3-3 against Elway, and 1-0 against Young.

Calling bullshit on that Chiefs' run. If I'm not mistaken, Montana threw two huge INTs in the Divisional and Marcus Allen saved the day. Also, he got crushed by the Bills in the Conference Championship. And no, he didn't go 2-1 against Marino, 3-3 against Elway, or 1-0 against Young. He went 2-1 against the Dolphins, 3-3 against the Broncos, and 1-0 against San Fran.

[MvP]

Joe Montana

/

[trojan49er]

Calling bullshit on that Chiefs' run. If I'm not mistaken, Montana threw two huge INTs in the Divisional and Marcus Allen saved the day. Also, he got crushed by the Bills in the Conference Championship. And no, he didn't go 2-1 against Marino, 3-3 against Elway, or 1-0 against Young. He went 2-1 against the Dolphins, 3-3 against the Broncos, and 1-0 against San Fran.

He actually had a better record against both the Broncs and Phins than what I listed, but I only put when Marino and Elway were starters. But even if you want to compare the straight passing performances in those games, he played better than his counterpart, even in several of the losses. I mean, you're right, with football being the ultimate team sport and all, Montana didn't compile a winning record against the three next best QBs of his era by himself, but how else are we to judge a player if not by their performances?

And, for the record, while Montana threw two picks, he also threw 3 TDs and passed for close to 300 yards while Allen only had 74 rushing yards

[Senser81]

Stabach (can't spell) or unitas. those guys were absolutely incredible. unitas in the "greatest game ever played" and roger the dodger was the pioneer of the modern quarterback, and both of those guys revolutionized the position.

unitas was the one who really dominated with the pump fake for the first time. he went out and dominated all the time, and in the joe namath super bowl, Unitas didn't play most of that game, and he still almost won.

Stabach was the guy who took the scrambler and the pocket quarterback roles and put them together. just about every quarterback in the nfl uses that combination now, and if you give me one guy who doesn't scramble these days, i will prove you wrong

I don't understand how Staubach was the pioneer of the modern QB. He became a regular starter in 1971, and by that time you had scrambling QBs like Fran Tarkenton and running QBs like Tobin Rote either 10 years into their careers or already retired. Even in 1971, there were QBs who were superior runners to Staubach, like Greg Landry and Bobby Douglass. I don't think Staubach can make the claim of being the 1st run/pass QB threat in history.

As for Unitas in SB III, he didn't even come close to winning that game.

[MrBill]

I'm going to have to say that Peyton is not the GOAT

[Juggernaut]

I'm going to have to say that Peyton is not the GOAT

After 3 bad games?

[MrBill]

After 3 bad games?

In the interest of full disclosure, I said it prior to the last 3 games.

[AJay]

I'd rather have Brady.

[Woy]

I'm going to have to say that Peyton is not the GOAT

You, of all people, shouldn't be bumping this thread.

[Bear Pand]

At least he isn't Favre. Figures Mr Bill would be the one to bump this.

Has to hurt seeing Favre get knocked out of the game then the Vikings go on to have their highest scoring output of the year. Also to se Manning compared to Favre everytime he throws an INT. At least you can find some happiness in bumping this thread.

[steeljake]

this thread needs to be renamed mr. bills takes a facial from brett favre.