Enough is enough. Peyton Manning is the greatest QB of all time.

[Woy]

All right, if Brett Favre isn't the GOAT, then his stats are lies, I guess.

Records he holds:

-Passing Attempts (career)
-Passes Completed (career)
-Passing Yards (career)
-Seasons with 3,000+ passing yards
-Games with 300+ passing yards (2nd all time)(career)
-Longest Pass (tied with others)
-Most seasons leading league in touchdowns (tied with others)
-Most consecutive seasons leading league in touchdowns (2nd)
-Most TD passes (career)
-Games with 4+ TD passes (2nd)(career)
-Games with 4+ TD passes (2nd)(season)
-Consecutive games with a TD pass (2nd)
-Interceptions thrown (career)
-Most consecutive games started (QB)


Pretty damn good if you ask me

Only one Super Bowl win and Peyton Manning will break all those records - minus the interception one - when Favre finally decides to call it quits.

[FirstTimer]

It wasn't so much to mean that as a detriment as to show that's all he's done in the Super bowl.

Yes he did good in making those reads, but again we're discussing the greatest of all time and I think just about any NFL QB could have made that Wayne read. There was nothing special about his 2 TD passes.....in two super bowls.

Not every QB could have made the read to get Wayne open in the first place.....

Plus the conditions of the first SB Manning played in weren't exactly good for passing...and I remember watching that game and remember watching Manning carve up the Bears underneath all fricking night. Manning made the smart plays needed to win that game and played that game perfectly based on what the Bears do on defense.

Manning made ONE "bad" throw last night(and even that's debatavle as Wayne slipped a bit coming out of his cut and made that pick WAY easier than it could have been) and he paid for it dearly but I'm not going to let ONE bad throw skew my view of him as a QB when looking at his career as a whole. I'm not going to say Manning gets all the credit when the Colts win and when they lose it's all on someone else but The Colts winning because of Manning, no matter the time of year, is the rule rather than the exception and them losing because of Manning is the exception rather than the rule and that's what needs to be kept in mind.

[killgod]

I want a better win/loss record in the playoffs. Manning is .500 in the playoffs for god's sake.

Joe Montana was 16-7.

Manning also played with Marvin Harrison, who is arguably a top 5 WR of all time.

Like I said, you can point to the defenses or the hall of famers or whatever you want, but the bottom line is that Joe Montana came through in the clutch and won Super Bowls by doing so. Manning has had his chances and hasn't come through yet.

Manning is great, but he's not even close to the greatest of all time..yet.

One thing you touched on here I feel it oft ignored.

You can boast the weapons, defences and kickers that other highly successful QB's have.

But Harrison and Wayne are an upper echelon group of WR's. Dallas Clark is a dangerous weapon.

Dwight Freeney, Robert Mathis.....DE pair that are again, amongst the best.


It's not that Indy is so far away in talent when it comes to who Manning has gotten to play with.

[Bear Pand]

All right, if Brett Favre isn't the GOAT, then his stats are lies, I guess.

Records he holds:

-Passing Attempts (career)
-Passes Completed (career)
-Passing Yards (career)
-Seasons with 3,000+ passing yards
-Games with 300+ passing yards (2nd all time)(career)
-Longest Pass (tied with others)
-Most seasons leading league in touchdowns (tied with others)
-Most consecutive seasons leading league in touchdowns (2nd)
-Most TD passes (career)
-Games with 4+ TD passes (2nd)(career)
-Games with 4+ TD passes (2nd)(season)
-Consecutive games with a TD pass (2nd)
-Interceptions thrown (career)
-Most consecutive games started (QB)


Pretty damn good if you ask me

If you hold the record for most consecutive games started and most passes attempted you damn well better hold records like most passing yards and most touchdown passes.

[Tailback U]

True but that's pretty lame.

I'm too young to have really ever watched Marino or Montana but I know based off just raw stats alone Montana was in a much better situation because he had a running game that outperformed Marino's on average in the playoffs, a defense that outperformed Marino's on average and he was throwing to Jerry Rice.

I don't know or care who was better between Montana and Marino but I do know Montana wouldn't wanted to have traded teams with Marino.

Marino played with at least 1 HOF WR. I think maybe even two, I'm sure of the older guys can help me out there.

I like how everyone is acting like Montana was lucky to have Jerry Rice. Jerry Rice holds all the records he does because of Montana and Young, it's not the other way around, don't get it twisted.

And again, Montana won Super Bowls by putting his team in the end zone on the last drive of the game. Forget the "he had special teams help and a great defense." He literally won a Super Bowl by going 92 yards with less than 2 minutes left in the game.

What did Manning do last night in that same situation? Gave 7 points to the other team. End of discussion.

[MrBill]

Only one Super Bowl win and Peyton Manning will break all those records - minus the interception one - when Favre finally decides to call it quits.

[Warner2BruceTD]

That's cool - can't go wrong with either one.

Interesting discussion on WFAN with Carl Banks about Peyton. His point is despite Manning's greatness, Tom Brady performs better under pressure(3-1 in Super Bowls). Agree or disagree?

Carl Banks is the worst.

When he comes on with Evan & Joe, it's time to turn off the radio. The guy is a cliche machine, and he comes off as this all knowing entity when all he does is spout generalizations (see exhibit A: Brady better under pressure due to 3-1 SB record).

EDIT: Let's say Adam Vinetieri misses vs. Oakland. Or The Rams. Or the Panthers. All of a sudden, Brady isnt "clutch"?

GTFO with these sweeping generalizations and myths about "clutch".

[killgod]

Not every QB could have made the read to get Wayne open in the first place.....

Plus the conditions of the first SB Manning played in weren't exactly good for passing...and I remember watching that game and remember watching Manning carve up the Bears underneath all fricking night. Manning made the smart plays needed to win that game and played that game perfectly based on what the Bears do on defense.

Manning made ONE "bad" throw last night(and even that's debatavle as Wayne slipped a bit coming out of his cut and made that pick WAY easier than it could have been) and he paid for it dearly but I'm not going to let ONE bad throw skew my view of him as a QB when looking at his career as a whole. I'm not going to say Manning gets all the credit when the Colts win and win they lose it's all on someone else but The Colts winning because of Manning, no matter the time of year, is the rule rather than the exception and them losing because of Manning is the exception rather than the rule and that's what needs to be kept in mind.

I'd personally say that INT was all the Porter in all honesty. He was all over that from the snap.


I think because of the offensive control that Manning has, he needs to be judged harsher based on the offensive production. Agree or disagree?

[Tailback U]

Not every QB could have made the read to get Wayne open in the first place.....

Plus the conditions of the first SB Manning played in weren't exactly good for passing...and I remember watching that game and remember watching Manning carve up the Bears underneath all fricking night. Manning made the smart plays needed to win that game and played that game perfectly based on what the Bears do on defense.

Manning made ONE "bad" throw last night(and even that's debatavle as Wayne slipped a bit coming out of his cut and made that pick WAY easier than it could have been) and he paid for it dearly but I'm not going to let ONE bad throw skew my view of him as a QB when looking at his career as a whole. I'm not going to say Manning gets all the credit when the Colts win and when they lose it's all on someone else but The Colts winning because of Manning, no matter the time of year, is the rule rather than the exception and them losing because of Manning is the exception rather than the rule and that's what needs to be kept in mind.

Nobody is saying Manning isn't a great QB, only that he doesn't deserve to be called the GOAT, at least not yet.

You have to draw the line somewhere. I use playoff performances, records, and Super Bowls to draw mine.

[Tailback U]

I'd personally say that INT was all the Porter in all honesty. He was all over that from the snap.


I think because of the offensive control that Manning has, he needs to be judged harsher based on the offensive production. Agree or disagree?

I agree, didn't matter that Wayne slipped. Porter read that all the way and jumped it even before Wayne slipped. Manning should not have thrown it, period.

[FirstTimer]

I'd personally say that INT was all the Porter in all honesty. He was all over that from the snap.

I'll meet you in the middle and say Wayne slipped, Porter made a great read, no doubt but if Wayne makes a cleaner break Porter can't jump that route as easily and it may end up as collision and incompletion.

I think because of the offensive control that Manning has, he needs to be judged harsher based on the offensive production. Agree or disagree?

More disagree than agree...Yeah Peyton can control the offense all he wants but he still has to depend on people doing their job within that offense and being where they are supposed to be when they are supposed to be there.

And to flip that around...Do we then have to take more credit away from QB's who don't have the offense control that Peyton has and are more "system" QB's of other people's system when Peyton essentially has his own system that he runs?

[MrBill]

If you hold the record for most consecutive games started and most passes attempted you damn well better hold records like most passing yards and most touchdown passes.

And by that logic, you should also have the INT record. Especially if you have thrown a 1,000 passes more than Marino or 2,500 more than Elway. The best indicator is INT percentage and Favre is around 3.3% for his career which is much better than most HoF QB's. The best ever were Joe Montana and Steve Young at 2.6% so we are only talking a little over half of a percentage point separating them and Favre.

[Bear Pand]

Marino played with at least 1 HOF WR. I think maybe even two, I'm sure of the older guys can help me out there.

I like how everyone is acting like Montana was lucky to have Jerry Rice. Jerry Rice holds all the records he does because of Montana and Young, it's not the other way around, don't get it twisted.

And again, Montana won Super Bowls by putting his team in the end zone on the last drive of the game. Forget the "he had special teams help and a great defense." He literally won a Super Bowl by going 92 yards with less than 2 minutes left in the game.

What did Manning do last night in that same situation? Gave 7 points to the other team. End of discussion.

He was lucky to have Jerry Rice. Any QB would be. Rice is in the argument of greatest football player of all time regardless of position.

And Montana's situation > Marino's situation even if Marino had a HOF WR.

[FirstTimer]

Nobody is saying Manning isn't a great QB, only that he doesn't deserve to be called the GOAT, at least not yet.

That's fine. I have Unitas as my GOAT.

Manning right now is in my Top 5 for sure. And by the end of his career I think he will be the GOAT.

[FirstTimer]

Marino played with at least 1 HOF WR. I think maybe even two, I'm sure of the older guys can help me out there.

.

I'm almost 100% positive that he didn't....

http://www.nflteamhistory.com/nfl_teams/miami_dolphins/hall_of_famers.html