• Rules and regulations here: http://www.virtualsportsnetwork.com/forum/showthread.php?133219-VSN-Secret-Santa-Donation-Drive-Raffle-Waffle-Maynard-is-Awful&p=2346085#post2346085
  • We have just launched a new VSN Amazon Store. This new store will allow you to order games (including PC downloads) and anything else you want from Amazon and help VSN out at the same time! You get the exact same deals and pre-order bonuses through our store front as you do from Amazon so please bookmark this link and use it when you are shopping at Amazon.com - [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/"][COLOR="#0000FF"][U]VSN Amazon Store[/U][/COLOR][/URL] Here are some direct links to pre-order the major upcoming titles- [B][SIZE=4][COLOR="#0000FF"]PlayStation 4[/COLOR][/SIZE][/B] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00BGA9WK2"]PlayStation 4 500GB Console[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00HVBPRUO"]PlayStation 4 Gold Wireless Headset[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00BGA9X9W"]PlayStation 4 DualShock 4 Wireless Controller[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00BGAA3S2"]PlayStation 4 Camera[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00DCBDNW6"]Final Fantasy XIV: A REALM REBORN[/URL] - April 14th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00J128FPA"]Final Fantasy XIV: A REALM REBORN Collectors Edition[/URL] - April 14th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00IMVRVC4"]Trials Fusion[/URL] - April 15th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00GG4BBUM"]MLB 14: The Show[/URL] - May 6th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00DHF39KS"]Wolfenstein: The New Order[/URL] - May 20th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00BI83EVU"]Watch Dogs[/URL] - May 27th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00DYAQHTQ"]Watch Dogs Limited Edition[/URL] - May 27th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00I0574EW"]Murdered Soul Suspect[/URL] - June 3rd [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00DHF39HQ"]The Elder Scrolls Online[/URL] - June 30th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00BGA9ZZ4"]Drive Club[/URL] - September 30th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00GZ1GUSY"]Tomb Raider Definitive Edition[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00H5V9S6E"]Rayman Legends - Standard Edition[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00C27SCC2"]Thief[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00HD4R5YU"]Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes Standard Edition[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00BGAA0SU"]inFAMOUS Second Son Limited Edition[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00FYIXMHQ"]inFAMOUS Second Son Collectors Edition[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00D2ZK1IG"]Dying Light[/URL] [B][SIZE=4][COLOR="#0000FF"]PlayStation 3[/COLOR][/SIZE][/B] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00B0JALUE"]PlayStation 3 500GB Console[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00AEX81SG"]PlayStation 3 250GB Console[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00GY4OAIE"]LEGO The Hobbit[/URL] - April 8th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00I9UVY30"]FIFA 2014 World Cup Brazil[/URL] - April 15th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00ICWO2ZW"]Darksiders Collection[/URL] - April 29th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00ICWO2P2"]Red Faction Collection[/URL] - April 29th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00HQY8LRM"]Rambo The Video Game[/URL] - April 29th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00FRESXSA"]The Amazing Spider-Man 2[/URL] - April 29th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00CPKUV98"]Wolfenstein: The New Order[/URL] - May 20th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00J6DLPLK"]Drakengard 3[/URL] - May 20th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00BGHUS58"]Watch Dogs[/URL] - May 27th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00DYAQHZ0"]Watch Dogs Collectors Edition[/URL] - May 27th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00BG6ZHK0"]Murdered: Soul Suspect[/URL] - June 3rd [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00IGHP28Y"]Transformers Rise of The Dark Spark[/URL] - June 24th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00DNGQTFI"]Dragon Ball Z: Battle of Z[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00H4BBTCQ"]Tomb Raider - GOTY Edition[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00HNYWFMC"]Far Cry Compilation [/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00946FSIA"]Lightning Returns: Final Fantasy XIII[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00HQY8LRM"]Rambo The Video Game[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00FQFFPZO"]NASCAR '14[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00DFT92MU"]Thief[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B0088MVP3S"]Castlevania: Lords of Shadow 2[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00ECOBFCC"]The LEGO Movie Videogame[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B006IOAHPK"]South Park: The Stick of Truth[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00FDQQD52"]South Park: The Stick of Truth Grand Wizard Edition [/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00F6YD2AK"]Dark Souls II Black Armor Edition[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00F6YD2FK"]Dark Souls II Collectors Edition[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00GJSUUC0"]Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes Standard Edition[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00E44EZYA"]Ultra Street Fighter IV[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00D2ZK2O4"]Dying Light[/URL] [B][SIZE=4][COLOR="#0000FF"]Xbox One[/COLOR][/SIZE][/B] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00CMQTVUA"]Xbox One Console[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00MCLFZ1Y"]Xbox One Console Madden 15 Bundle[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00IIHU44E"]Xbox One Console Titanfall Bundle[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00HVPFGD8"]Titanfall Limited Edition Controller[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00CMQTUSS"]Xbox One Wireless Controller[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00IAVDQCK"]Xbox One Stereo Headset[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00IAVDOS6"]Xbox One Stereo Headset Adapter[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00GY4OB8S"]LEGO The Hobbit[/URL] - April 8th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00CMQTUCE"]KINECT Sports: Rivals[/URL] - April 8th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00IMVRVA6"]Trials Fusion[/URL] - April 15h [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00FRESTZW"]The Amazing Spider-Man 2[/URL] - April 29th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00DHF39L2"]Wolfenstein: The New Order[/URL] - May 20th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00CX8VY4S"]Watch Dogs[/URL] - May 27th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00DYAQI0E"]Watch Dogs Limited Edition[/URL] - May 27th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00I0574CO"]Murdered Soul Suspect[/URL] - June 3rd [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00IGH2HKU"]Transformers Rise of The Dark Spark[/URL] - June 24th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00DHF39EO"]The Elder Scrolls Online[/URL] - June 30th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00GZ1GUNO"]Tomb Raider Definitive Edition[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00DBCAS7E"]Zoo Tycoon[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00H5V9SLE"]Rayman Legends - Standard Edition[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00CYNTHA0"]Thief[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00DB9JYFY"]Titanfall[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00G2HSX86"]Titanfall Collectors Edition[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00HD4R5WC"]Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes Standard Edition[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00D2ZK2MQ"]Dying Light[/URL] [B][SIZE=4][COLOR="#0000FF"]Xbox 360[/COLOR][/SIZE][/B] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00FATRKOK"]Xbox 360 250GB Holiday Value Console[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00GZ9ESEE"]Xbox 360 250GB Console w/Halo 4, Darksiders II, Tomb Raider and Batman: Arkham City[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B003ZSP0WW"]Xbox 360 Wireless Controller[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00DC9SWWE"]Titanfall[/URL] - April 8th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00G2HSWZU"]Titanfall Collectors Edition[/URL] - April 8th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00GY4OBB0"]LEGO The Hobbit[/URL] - April 8th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00I9UVY7G"]FIFA 2014 World Cup Brazil[/URL] - April 15th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00ICWO2G6"]Darksiders Collection[/URL] - April 29th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00FRESY6G"]The Amazing Spider-Man 2[/URL] - April 29th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00CPKUV7K"]Wolfenstein: The New Order[/URL] - May 20th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00BGD6LMG"]Watch Dogs[/URL] - May 27th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00DYAQHNC"]Watch Dogs Limited Edition[/URL] - May 27th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00BG6ZHL4"]Murdered: Soul Suspect[/URL] - June 3rd [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00IGHY7LC"]Transformers Rise of The Dark Spark[/URL] - June 24th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00DNGQQUQ"]Dragon Ball Z: Battle of Z[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00H4BBVZQ"]Tomb Raider - GOTY Edition[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00DBCAT3W"]Fable Anniversary[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00946FSJ4"]Lightning Returns: Final Fantasy XIII[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00FQFFQ2Q"]NASCAR '14[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00DFT92EI"]Thief[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B0088MVP2Y"]Castlevania: Lords of Shadow 2[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00ECOBFA4"]The LEGO Movie Videogame[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B006IOAHTQ"]South Park: The Stick of Truth[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00FDQQD6Q"]South Park: The Stick of Truth Grand Wizard Edition [/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00F6YD26Y"]Dark Souls II Black Armor Edition[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00F6YD27I"]Dark Souls II Collectors Edition[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00GJSUXLS"]Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes Standard Edition[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00E44EZPE"]Ultra Street Fighter IV[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00D2ZK2RQ"]Dying Light[/URL] [B][SIZE=4][COLOR="#0000FF"]Wii U[/COLOR][/SIZE][/B] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00GY4OAM0"]LEGO The Hobbit[/URL] - April 22nd [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00FRESQKU"]The Amazing Spider-man 2[/URL] - April 29th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00DC7G2W8"]Mario Kart 8[/URL] - May 30th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00IGH1LJ8"]Transformers Rise of the Dark Spark[/URL] - June 24th [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00DC7O77A"]Donkey Kong Country Tropical Freeze[/URL] [URL="http://astore.amazon.com/vsngaming-20/detail/B00ECOAX34"]The LEGO Movie Videogame[/URL]
  • We are looking to possibly form a second XB1 Madden 15 league on VSN. Please visit the Sports Gaming subforum and post in the thread if you are interested.
  • There will be a site outage from 12 pm est till 3 am est
  • If you are having trouble accessing your account and don't remember your password, email help@virtualsportsnetwork.com and i'll get you an updated password for 2024.

[DIVISIONAL]: New York Giants @ Green Bay Packers

For some odd reason, diivox doesn't believe Jennings fumbled.

greg-jennings-fumble-530x304.jpg

Its probably because his lucky blanket is over his eyes

:kobe:
 
It was 8. Essentially that's 2 and a half drives taken away due to dropped passes.

I've seen everything from 5-8 this morning. ESPN says 6 so just go with that. Considering how pathetic the offense looked yesterday, those lost possessions all together might have account for 7 points.

Didn't know it was a part of the game for recievers to drop easy passes. :kobe:

About as much a part of the game as the soon to be announced MVP misfiring on several easy passes :kobe:
 
So your dodging the question now. lol.

Get over it.

I'm not dodging anything, I made a comparative argument. Neither excessive dropped passes or missing wide open receivers are part of the game. The dropped passes would have been less of an issue if more balls had been on target over the course of the game.

You get over telling people to get over it.
 
I'm not dodging anything, I made a comparative argument. Neither excessive dropped passes or missing wide open receivers are part of the game. The dropped passes would have been less of an issue if more balls had been on target over the course of the game.

You get over telling people to get over it.

The off target passes would have been less of an issue if more balls hadn't of been dropped.

:smug:

:acid:

Packers WR's fucking up>>Rodgers fucking up.
 
I notice you left somebody out of that assessment. So do you still think Rodgers is a better playoff QB than Favre? :shifty:

26/46 264 yards, 2 TD's, 2 TO's, QB rating 78.5

He made some plays with his legs but those were easily offset by the points taken off of the board by his bad throws to wide open receivers.

Anybody that has an objective bone would say YES. The fumble wasn't a QB Stupid mistake or a bad play by the QB, and the int was a garbage time desperation throw. Neither of those turnovers was a stupid fucking throw/decision by the QB when the game was tied or winnable. 8 dropped passes are on the receivers.

Rodgers > Favre in the playoffs.

You are an absolutely horrible fan.
 
Anybody that has an objective bone would say YES. The fumble wasn't a QB Stupid mistake or a bad play by the QB, and the int was a garbage time desperation throw. Neither of those turnovers was a stupid fucking throw/decision by the QB when the game was tied or winnable. 8 dropped passes are on the receivers.

Rodgers > Favre in the playoffs.

You are an absolutely horrible fan.

I'm sure you have been reading the Green Bay press as much as I have today so I don't have to tell you they are unanimously saying that Rodgers had an awful game, to which anybody that has an objective bone would agree.

Rodgers had his worst game of the 15-1 season in the game that mattered the most. He's still a great QB and the one the Packers can win with going forward but this should serve as a humbling lesson for those that put him on a pedestal as being better than Favre simply to spite Favre for the way his departure from the team was handled. Rodgers is human after all and all of the talk about him being the best playoffs QB in Packers history is ludicrous.
 
That line in the VSN mixtape's Remember the Titans remix is fitting Mr. Bill to a tee right now. :shifty:
 
Meh, don't worry Mr. Bill...there will be a time when Rodgers' legacy will surpass Favre's. So, enjoy all you can for now. I'm under the impression that while reading the Green Bay press drilling into Rodgers you have a bit of a smug face.
 
Meh, don't worry Mr. Bill...there will be a time when Rodgers' legacy will surpass Favre's. So, enjoy all you can for now. I'm under the impression that while reading the Green Bay press drilling into Rodgers you have a bit of a smug face.

We shall see, Peyton was supposed to break all of Brett's records as well and we see how that is working out. I don't have a smug face today, it's more of a pissed off face at squandered opportunities. The only reason I even mentioned Rodgers piss poor performance was because bucky conveniently overlooked it in his assessment of the game. I found that a little humorous because he always over glorified Rodgers accomplishments over the past 2 years because he hates Favre so much. Turns out that both of them are human. To say that Rodgers is better than Favre is premature at best.
 
I'm sure you have been reading the Green Bay press as much as I have today so I don't have to tell you they are unanimously saying that Rodgers had an awful game, to which anybody that has an objective bone would agree.

I haven't read anything today. I watched the game. The receivers dropping the ball, and the back's fumbling, had a worse game.

Rodgers had his worst game of the 15-1 season in the game that mattered the most.

He still didn't throw the ball to the other team on a piss poor decision when the game was on the line.

He's still a great QB and the one the Packers can win with going forward but this should serve as a humbling lesson for those that put him on a pedestal as being better than Favre simply to spite Favre for the way his departure from the team was handled.

Huh? I'm not spiting. I'm taking an objective look at both QB's in the playoffs. You should do the same, instead of waiting for the first sub par playoff game from Rodgers in order to try and pump up Favre.

Rodgers is human after all and all of the talk about him being the best playoffs QB in Packers history is ludicrous.

No it's not. Really Bart Starr was the best Playoff QB in Packer history. Right now, I would put Rodgers second and Favre third. That's an objective opinion from someone that watched all three play. Stop being so bitter.
 
We shall see, Peyton was supposed to break all of Brett's records as well and we see how that is working out. I don't have a smug face today, it's more of a pissed off face at squandered opportunities. The only reason I even mentioned Rodgers piss poor performance was because bucky conveniently overlooked it in his assessment of the game. I found that a little humorous because he always over glorified Rodgers accomplishments over the past 2 years because he hates Favre so much. Turns out that both of them are human. To say that Rodgers is better than Favre is premature at best.

I don't hate Favre. And so far Rodger's has shown to be a better playoff QB. I didn't mention much, just the dropped passes, and the fumbles and how the Giants were completing 3rd and longs in the first half. If 8 dropped passes turned into completions, the QB would have had a much better day. I would say the dropped passes and fumbles hurt the offense much more than the QB. Did you even watch the game? Stop being so bitter.
 
I don't hate Favre. And so far Rodger's has shown to be a better playoff QB. I didn't mention much, just the dropped passes, and the fumbles and how the Giants were completing 3rd and longs in the first half. If 8 dropped passes turned into completions, the QB would have had a much better day. I would say the dropped passes and fumbles hurt the offense much more than the QB. Did you even watch the game? Stop being so bitter.

I don't know that Rodgers has proven himself to be a better playoff QB or not. For 2 of the last 3 playoff appearances by the Packers, they have been one and done with Rodgers having a turnover on the last offensive play by the team in each game. If you want to make excuses for Rodgers, then you have to accept the same excuses in the games that Favre lost.

Not being bitter, that would be a better description of the people that proclaim Rodgers to be >>>>> than Favre after a couple of seasons of work just because they hate Favre.

I stole your joke and used it as my own on fb. Not a single credit was given..

No credit necessary, I stole it from Twitter.
 
I don't know that Rodgers has proven himself to be a better playoff QB or not. For 2 of the last 3 playoff appearances by the Packers, they have been one and done with Rodgers having a turnover on the last offensive play by the team in each game. If you want to make excuses for Rodgers, then you have to accept the same excuses in the games that Favre lost.

No excuses.

Rodgers put up 40+ points in the first playoff game. The turnover wasn't some piss poor decision/pass for an int. It was an offensive lineman getting beaten badly and knocking the ball out of Rodgers hand. Huge FUCKING difference between that and throwing a god awful int in OT. The defense gave the first playoff game away.

This game, the fumbles, the drops, and the defense lost the game, not because of the QB. The late game turnover was a desperation time throw when the game was already over.

Not being bitter, that would be a better description of the people that proclaim Rodgers to be >>>>> than Favre after a couple of seasons of work just because they hate Favre.

Sure you're being bitter. You've just been waiting for GB to lose in the playoffs to make some anti Rodgers Pro Favre BS.

Brett was not a great playoff QB. He was great in the Regular season, but not in the playoffs. That's just an objective point of view. You should try it sometime.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Woy
Sure you're being bitter. You've just been waiting for GB to lose in the playoffs to make some anti Rodgers Pro Favre BS.

Not at all, I just found it interesting that you didn't even mention the poor play of the QB at all in your breakdown when the national and Packer media were both keying on it. If you hadn't spent the last few years throwing Favre under the bus for playoff performance and had even mentioned Rodgers poor play yesterday, then I probably would have just thanked your original post and moved on.
 
Back
Top